It's no use creating a map that uses 100% of the editor's functions if it's not fun. Yes, fancy dialogs and all the effects are cool. But that does not translate in fun.
Remember the Wings of Liberty does not use more than half of the editor's functionality but they're well made and extremely fun.
P.S.: What I meant to say: I smell jealousy in these posts and getting rid of that is a good first step to creating a popular map.
Kinda agree with Tolkfan here. Blizzard really does have better things to do than *decide/pick* and play test what all of you think are good maps. You know, its a trivial task to meet out. Someone must have just quickly grabbed a few map names from the 1st page etc etc. Its not like someone there is getting paid to pay attention to our community, judge quality maps on b.net etc etc.
Main thing about the statement, ...so what?. Who cares?
Im hardly surprised. Its just a generic press statement. That in no way changes my feelings toward mapping, Blizzard, and the community.
On a related note I haven't played sc2 in like 6 months and I was told those maps are still at the top. Don't songs on the radio go away after a month or two? Does that not apply?
I want to stress that the maps on the top page are fun. You don't need to do anything crazy to make a fun game. Custom UIs are cool, but the standard SC2 UI is perfectly fine.
Custom models, custom this, custom that is also good and fine, but Blizzard already gave us a ton of FAMILIAR units that we can work with.
I don't understand why Desert Strike and Marine Arena get ripped on so much. I mean, I personally still play Desert Strike. I have grown to hate Marine Arena, but that is only because I played it so much. Nexus Wars is also fun.
I'm not saying that there aren't maps that should be up there, but I am saying that the maps that are up there are up there for a reason.
Also, Mafia and especially EleTD are very new games. Who is to say that there is some reason why Blizzard doesn't want to announce them? Maybe Blizzard has some secret "Why we do this" archive somewhere, but as far as I can tell, they never tell us why they do anything.
Remember the Wings of Liberty does not use more than 25% of the editor's functionality but they're well made and extremely fun.
I corrected this statement as it was grossly inaccurate.
While I think Blizzard is horribly out of touch when it comes to the actual map making community (That's not just us, btw), this blog post was never s'posed to be more than a fluff peace acknowledging that StarCraft II has now been out for more than a year. I don't disagree that the list of names provided is incredibly misleading in-so-far as attributing reputable talent and mastery, but I also don't really care what the post says. It's not for us and it's not trying to give an accurate representation of anything mentioned in it.
If this were a forum post in the custom map section then I could see a reason to complain, but for now, just accept it for what it is: meaningless filler as a nod in our direction.
Did you come from SC1 or War3 though? I find a lot of sc1 people who are happy to come into those maps; but, the Warcraft players (me for instance) who came from the rainbow of frozen throne maps were scratching our heads.
Well I can only speak for myself... I admire the success and longevity of certain maps but I don't think I've played one of them for more than a few games.
Also Taco, I just noticed your sig lol... is that line from a trailer I made a while back?
Also, Mafia and especially EleTD are very new games.
Mafia came out before Desert Strike.
Again; I'm not sitting here crying, but I do think it's kind of sad. They seem to try to want to mention us, and then do it in pretty much the worst way possible. You can make excuses for it all day, but in the end, how hard would it have been to include at least a map like Mafia in there to give some recognition to the actual mapping community?
They copy-pasted a list of most-popular maps so that the article would have the illusion of authenticity for the infinitely larger melee playing community. When people who ladder all day and watch Husky or Day9 see the article they'll go "wow, they really do care about custom maps, look at that list they gave
In other words, you're clearly saying that Blizzard doesn't give a shit about the map making community. My impression is that they don't take half hour of their time to play a new custom map. Most of the maps they cited was made since Starcraft BETA as if the last time they played a custom map was during the BETA.
I love how they say "and, of course, Nexus Wars". Like, obviously bro!
Nexus Wars now represents the map-making community. Awesome! I decided to play it, and I almost cried how terribly NOT FUN it is. I've seen hundreds of better maps in here, such as the cops&robbers by OneTwo and that Tron game (both low in popularity). I don't want to mention my own maps to not sound jealous, such as Nexus Hindrance Wars and Nexus Word Wars.
Alright. Nexus Wars is Blizzard's best example of a "technical, artistic, and creative" map making community. Ok. It makes a lot of sense now why Blizzard said the editor is just extra feature, why there's so many bugs, why they keep broken featured maps, feature wrong maps (zealot...), forget about the custom map spotlight (or forget to actually feature the maps on the blog), accidentally ban map makers (redWraith...), pisses everyone off with a broken system and release a patch to fix it but it does only make it worse, and in the end they give an interview on BlizzCon saying that the community is really happy with the system and that they have done an awesome job! (pm me for the link). It's not Blizzard's fault. The problem is that they don't play maps that are not on the first page. Makers of not popular maps, we just don't exist. That's why I'm out. Time to give a break and go dedicate myself to things that my presence actually matters.
Let Nexus Wars stay for the next 10 years representing the Map making community, because that's what it's most likely to happen right now.
Last I recall, I played Desert Strike waaaaaaay before Mafia was announced.
There might be a difference between NA and EU, but I'm pretty positive that Desert Strike at the very least never got to page 1 of the pop list before Mafia had been there for some time. Of course the concept has been around since SC1, though.
personally i dont get some of the most played maps
many of them are not very fun, i was a big fan of marine arena but i think it was ruined by shifting heavy focus onto the mercenaries.
when it was a careful balance of micro'ing and positioning your marines it was great.
other maps i dont even understand. except for the fact that they use banks and an xp/unlock system. people love the grind more than the game?
anyway, yea it is obvious blizzard just wanted to put the maps with the most hours played in that article.
whatever you know. Blizzard are too busy making more expansions(coughdlc) and horrible melee maps people dont want for their ladder.
that said i can't blame blizzard for being so thin stretched, their business focus is on wow, SC2 has such a small team it's a wonder to me anything gets done at all.
NA has a version that has been around since like 2 weeks into SC2 beta, and has been on the front page since. You can YouTube it, I personally think it looks like the EU version isn't as good.
Considering the maps they picked for their custom map contest, this doesn't surprise me in the least.
Although, to give them some leeway, there aren't really any truly amazing maps on Battle.net right now. All of the maps that could've been amazing were started but never finished. I think an extremely unintuitive and bug-ridden editor is most likely to blame; although there are, of course, many other factors...such as a partial popularity system, "patches" that destroy maps and editor functionality, and Nazi-strict regulations on maps' copyright infringements and any other thing that might possibly offend.
Sorry to hear you guys dont enjoy those maps they listed. They are good for time killing and easy to get games.
Honestly I give the guy who makes Nexus Wars props... hes gotta deal with all you discouraging s....
I think what you aren't catching up on this thread is that Blizzard is giving all the credits to maps who got lucky, while the actual good maps are left in the shadows simply because they are not found due to the stupid popularity system by Blizzard. Did you really take a good look at Nexus Wars? It has zero enviroment detail, minimal UI appearance and extremely poor balance. Why do people like it? Because it's easy, and like you said "easy to get games", should that really be a reason for the game to be liked? In Warcraft 3 all games were easy to get games with.
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It's no use creating a map that uses 100% of the editor's functions if it's not fun. Yes, fancy dialogs and all the effects are cool. But that does not translate in fun.
Remember the Wings of Liberty does not use more than half of the editor's functionality but they're well made and extremely fun.
P.S.: What I meant to say: I smell jealousy in these posts and getting rid of that is a good first step to creating a popular map.
@Klishu: Go
Yes, but to quote you:
@Tolkfan: Go
Kinda agree with Tolkfan here. Blizzard really does have better things to do than *decide/pick* and play test what all of you think are good maps. You know, its a trivial task to meet out. Someone must have just quickly grabbed a few map names from the 1st page etc etc. Its not like someone there is getting paid to pay attention to our community, judge quality maps on b.net etc etc.
Main thing about the statement, ...so what?. Who cares?
Im hardly surprised. Its just a generic press statement. That in no way changes my feelings toward mapping, Blizzard, and the community.
Edit: And what OutsiderEX said.
On a related note I haven't played sc2 in like 6 months and I was told those maps are still at the top. Don't songs on the radio go away after a month or two? Does that not apply?
I love how they say "and, of course, Nexus Wars". Like, obviously bro!
Go play Antioch Chronicles Remastered!
Also, coming soon, Antioch Episode 3: Thoughts in Chaos!
Dont like mapster's ugly white? Try Mapster's Classic Skin!
I want to stress that the maps on the top page are fun. You don't need to do anything crazy to make a fun game. Custom UIs are cool, but the standard SC2 UI is perfectly fine.
Custom models, custom this, custom that is also good and fine, but Blizzard already gave us a ton of FAMILIAR units that we can work with.
I don't understand why Desert Strike and Marine Arena get ripped on so much. I mean, I personally still play Desert Strike. I have grown to hate Marine Arena, but that is only because I played it so much. Nexus Wars is also fun.
I'm not saying that there aren't maps that should be up there, but I am saying that the maps that are up there are up there for a reason.
Also, Mafia and especially EleTD are very new games. Who is to say that there is some reason why Blizzard doesn't want to announce them? Maybe Blizzard has some secret "Why we do this" archive somewhere, but as far as I can tell, they never tell us why they do anything.
Great to be back and part of the community again!
I corrected this statement as it was grossly inaccurate.
While I think Blizzard is horribly out of touch when it comes to the actual map making community (That's not just us, btw), this blog post was never s'posed to be more than a fluff peace acknowledging that StarCraft II has now been out for more than a year. I don't disagree that the list of names provided is incredibly misleading in-so-far as attributing reputable talent and mastery, but I also don't really care what the post says. It's not for us and it's not trying to give an accurate representation of anything mentioned in it.
If this were a forum post in the custom map section then I could see a reason to complain, but for now, just accept it for what it is: meaningless filler as a nod in our direction.
@TacoManStan: Go
Did you come from SC1 or War3 though? I find a lot of sc1 people who are happy to come into those maps; but, the Warcraft players (me for instance) who came from the rainbow of frozen throne maps were scratching our heads.
Well I can only speak for myself... I admire the success and longevity of certain maps but I don't think I've played one of them for more than a few games.
Also Taco, I just noticed your sig lol... is that line from a trailer I made a while back?
Edit: Yeah Prozaic said it.
Mafia came out before Desert Strike.
Again; I'm not sitting here crying, but I do think it's kind of sad. They seem to try to want to mention us, and then do it in pretty much the worst way possible. You can make excuses for it all day, but in the end, how hard would it have been to include at least a map like Mafia in there to give some recognition to the actual mapping community?
Last I recall, I played Desert Strike waaaaaaay before Mafia was announced.
Go play Antioch Chronicles Remastered!
Also, coming soon, Antioch Episode 3: Thoughts in Chaos!
Dont like mapster's ugly white? Try Mapster's Classic Skin!
Mozared pretty much spoke for me.
In other words, you're clearly saying that Blizzard doesn't give a shit about the map making community. My impression is that they don't take half hour of their time to play a new custom map. Most of the maps they cited was made since Starcraft BETA as if the last time they played a custom map was during the BETA.
Nexus Wars now represents the map-making community. Awesome! I decided to play it, and I almost cried how terribly NOT FUN it is. I've seen hundreds of better maps in here, such as the cops&robbers by OneTwo and that Tron game (both low in popularity). I don't want to mention my own maps to not sound jealous, such as Nexus Hindrance Wars and Nexus Word Wars.
Alright. Nexus Wars is Blizzard's best example of a "technical, artistic, and creative" map making community. Ok. It makes a lot of sense now why Blizzard said the editor is just extra feature, why there's so many bugs, why they keep broken featured maps, feature wrong maps (zealot...), forget about the custom map spotlight (or forget to actually feature the maps on the blog), accidentally ban map makers (redWraith...), pisses everyone off with a broken system and release a patch to fix it but it does only make it worse, and in the end they give an interview on BlizzCon saying that the community is really happy with the system and that they have done an awesome job! (pm me for the link). It's not Blizzard's fault. The problem is that they don't play maps that are not on the first page. Makers of not popular maps, we just don't exist. That's why I'm out. Time to give a break and go dedicate myself to things that my presence actually matters.
Let Nexus Wars stay for the next 10 years representing the Map making community, because that's what it's most likely to happen right now.
Didn't you base a map around it?
Yes, but Nexus Hindrance Wars would be really boring if it wasn't by the lasers. The hindrance beam is what makes that map really fun to play.
http://www.sc2mapster.com/forums/general/general-chat/23860-photos-types-of-block-hindrance-wars
Also, I just read this list on the PT-LA community. The list is the same, but there's also Smashcraft and a map called The Secret Artifact (????).
There might be a difference between NA and EU, but I'm pretty positive that Desert Strike at the very least never got to page 1 of the pop list before Mafia had been there for some time. Of course the concept has been around since SC1, though.
personally i dont get some of the most played maps
many of them are not very fun, i was a big fan of marine arena but i think it was ruined by shifting heavy focus onto the mercenaries.
when it was a careful balance of micro'ing and positioning your marines it was great.
other maps i dont even understand. except for the fact that they use banks and an xp/unlock system. people love the grind more than the game?
anyway, yea it is obvious blizzard just wanted to put the maps with the most hours played in that article.
whatever you know. Blizzard are too busy making more expansions(coughdlc) and horrible melee maps people dont want for their ladder.
that said i can't blame blizzard for being so thin stretched, their business focus is on wow, SC2 has such a small team it's a wonder to me anything gets done at all.
@RodrigoAlves: Go
None of your maps are fun IMHO.
Sorry to hear you guys dont enjoy those maps they listed. They are good for time killing and easy to get games.
Honestly I give the guy who makes Nexus Wars props... hes gotta deal with all you discouraging **s....
@Mozared: Go
NA has a version that has been around since like 2 weeks into SC2 beta, and has been on the front page since. You can YouTube it, I personally think it looks like the EU version isn't as good.
Great to be back and part of the community again!
You guys are surprised?
Marketplace will be a failure.
Surprise?
Modders will get the last laugh when no one buys HotS. SC2 doesn't deliver like WC3 did, and even that tanked before DotA picked it up.
Considering the maps they picked for their custom map contest, this doesn't surprise me in the least. Although, to give them some leeway, there aren't really any truly amazing maps on Battle.net right now. All of the maps that could've been amazing were started but never finished. I think an extremely unintuitive and bug-ridden editor is most likely to blame; although there are, of course, many other factors...such as a partial popularity system, "patches" that destroy maps and editor functionality, and Nazi-strict regulations on maps' copyright infringements and any other thing that might possibly offend.
I think what you aren't catching up on this thread is that Blizzard is giving all the credits to maps who got lucky, while the actual good maps are left in the shadows simply because they are not found due to the stupid popularity system by Blizzard. Did you really take a good look at Nexus Wars? It has zero enviroment detail, minimal UI appearance and extremely poor balance. Why do people like it? Because it's easy, and like you said "easy to get games", should that really be a reason for the game to be liked? In Warcraft 3 all games were easy to get games with.