Right now, I'm making mission 6 of Amber Sun, and I'm a about halfway finished. After this is mission 7, where you fight the Zerg. It's called Breeding Ground, though that's just a placeholder name (yet at the same time a very possible title). Now, to the point: I considered several terrain options for this mission (like an infested city), but thought it would be cool to make a Zerg interior. I know handclaw tried this (with brilliant results), as showcased in this thread, but I was wondering if anyone here had any tips on how to create this? I want it to feel like you're inside a Zerg building or something, and not just a cave ala Belly of the Beast. I also considered making several buildings that you could walk in and out of (so there'd be an exterior as well, which could be the city). That would make it possible to include a player base outside the buildings from where you send your troops from (air units would be disabled, obviously).
Well, I could start off with a simple general statement. Usually, Zerg terrains are made by making any normal terrain and then 'Zergifying' it. Cause that's what the Zerg do - they grow over terrain like a disease. In your case, the exact opposite would be true. The interior of a Zerg building would be completely designed by Zerg from the ground up and thus have no obvious connection to natural/terran/protoss environments. This would make it hard to get right. To start off with, I'd say you're looking at a race that's aiming to evolve to perfection: their buildings would be built as efficiently as possible. Think small hallways, smaller 'main rooms' hooked up to a 'core room' and baths with storage for biomass or such.
I didn't even consider that kind of perspective. Even though I was initially thinking more about what kind of doodads I should use and stuff like that, I suppose I should take your post into heavy consideration.
Yeah, well, what Mozie said technically covers what's to be said concerning Zerg terrain (Infested or Built-up). That in itself, I admit, takes much more time than making a city (Take my city, Pride, for an instance), because you have to plan the structure first, then make it, then plan where the destruction, chaos, blood, corpses and stuff will be, and putting it piece by piece. It's a lot of work, one that you can lose and rant a lot if you don't have a backup in case of crashes and stuff.
I didn't even consider that kind of perspective. Even though I was initially thinking more about what kind of doodads I should use and stuff like that, I suppose I should take your post into heavy consideration.
It's a matter of how deeply you want to approach your terrain, but 'what doodads to use' and questions like such are generally answered if you've thought about the background of your map. My analysis would lead me to say 'only Zerg doodads, absolutely nothing natural or man-made'. This in turn leads me to say that perhaps the best way to go about it is to use those cliff-tentacle doodads to take care of all the walls while adding creep along the entire ground. Once you've got that basic structure mapped out it should become easier to add a bunch of other zergy things in there and make it look good. It'll be a pretty unique terrain from what I've seen, that's for sure.
What you might also want to think about is what kind of building we're talking about (I'm assuming some kind of humongous hive if it's big enough for Terrans to enter it) and what kind of rooms are in there. A breeding room? An evolution pit (like the one containing Abathur in the campaign)? Some kind of hive-control centre containing a lot of 'in stasis' queens? This will allow you to keep every room and area in your map interesting and unique as you're going on and really make the player feel like he's inside an actual Zerg building rather than a set of corridors with Zerg doodads in them.
I always imagined a hive as having a kind of wheel and spoke setup say 4 entrances that meet in the middle of the main floor
that has some type of elevator/nydus canal in the center that transports units from chambers on other floors
Just what i always imagined
Depending on unit type... If it's an air unit, I suggest spires and (scaled up) greater spires in the corners of the room (should be circular, with zerg doodad walls). Keep the content in the center to a minimum, maybe a big egg or a cluster of various medium sized eggs. Maybe add some glows. For ground, just spawning pools and hatcheries (at the edges) and a virophage or two. Same walls and center. Also, try to experiment - if we decide to call mapping an art, we can throw rules out the window and experiment with different techniques.
Personally in term of layout it would be wise to, much like mozared said, to do some relevant research. Zerg building are often refered as part of a hive organism, so clearly hey work much like organs themselves, and for that I would recommend studying organ interiors and how they work, for that some endoscopy/colonoscopy plus googling [organ name] interior might help. Note that the body transfers nutrients and and such via complicated pump systems, so consider including a lot of organic looking valves and vents, with walkable spaces being narrow and steamy perhaps (playe acces wuld have to be throgh maybe some huge respiratory and digestive conducts), with most of the components bordering on specifically functional. Try to look how internal organs systems (respiratory, digestive, reproductory - uterus in particular for actual getsation phase) work in terms of phases and transport. Some zerg tendrils could work as veins and such, with some tweaed nydus worms as tracts, and well, just look at many char/zerus and "zerg" doodads as you for tissue. There are some terrain bubbles that could be placed on fleshy looking ground for giving th illusion of air passage and such.
Well, I had some anatomy once, though it didn't go much further than the loungs/heart. Maybe it'll make an interesting gameplay twist: stop the damn thing from breathing by clogging the airways.
I would suggest that if it is a Zerg structure like a Lair you could get away with using some natural stuff (well, rock mostly) as I imagine the Hatchery strain (Hatchery, Lair, Hive) as being partly 'dug into' the ground and merging with it. Mind you that'd probably only really be visible on the lowest levels where the Hatchery so I don't know how well that applies to what you have in mind....
A Zerg interior would indeed be very cool to see and maybe we'll get to see something like that in Legacy of the Void (A mission to board a Leviathan would be awesome :D).
I would suggest for inspiration see if you can dig out the models for Kerrigan's Leviathan (especially the set for the 'docking bay' as I remember that also having a Zerg door sort of thing) and you might even be able to take some textures used on those models and make them into custom terrain textures.
I think I'm going to try this next now. Mission 6 is finished, and although an urban environment would be cool, it's done to death already. This will be something extraordinary.
Right now, I'm making mission 6 of Amber Sun, and I'm a about halfway finished. After this is mission 7, where you fight the Zerg. It's called Breeding Ground, though that's just a placeholder name (yet at the same time a very possible title). Now, to the point: I considered several terrain options for this mission (like an infested city), but thought it would be cool to make a Zerg interior. I know handclaw tried this (with brilliant results), as showcased in this thread, but I was wondering if anyone here had any tips on how to create this? I want it to feel like you're inside a Zerg building or something, and not just a cave ala Belly of the Beast. I also considered making several buildings that you could walk in and out of (so there'd be an exterior as well, which could be the city). That would make it possible to include a player base outside the buildings from where you send your troops from (air units would be disabled, obviously).
@EivindL: Go
Well, I could start off with a simple general statement. Usually, Zerg terrains are made by making any normal terrain and then 'Zergifying' it. Cause that's what the Zerg do - they grow over terrain like a disease. In your case, the exact opposite would be true. The interior of a Zerg building would be completely designed by Zerg from the ground up and thus have no obvious connection to natural/terran/protoss environments. This would make it hard to get right. To start off with, I'd say you're looking at a race that's aiming to evolve to perfection: their buildings would be built as efficiently as possible. Think small hallways, smaller 'main rooms' hooked up to a 'core room' and baths with storage for biomass or such.
I didn't even consider that kind of perspective. Even though I was initially thinking more about what kind of doodads I should use and stuff like that, I suppose I should take your post into heavy consideration.
@Mozared: Go
Yeah, well, what Mozie said technically covers what's to be said concerning Zerg terrain (Infested or Built-up). That in itself, I admit, takes much more time than making a city (Take my city, Pride, for an instance), because you have to plan the structure first, then make it, then plan where the destruction, chaos, blood, corpses and stuff will be, and putting it piece by piece. It's a lot of work, one that you can lose and rant a lot if you don't have a backup in case of crashes and stuff.
It's a matter of how deeply you want to approach your terrain, but 'what doodads to use' and questions like such are generally answered if you've thought about the background of your map. My analysis would lead me to say 'only Zerg doodads, absolutely nothing natural or man-made'. This in turn leads me to say that perhaps the best way to go about it is to use those cliff-tentacle doodads to take care of all the walls while adding creep along the entire ground. Once you've got that basic structure mapped out it should become easier to add a bunch of other zergy things in there and make it look good. It'll be a pretty unique terrain from what I've seen, that's for sure.
What you might also want to think about is what kind of building we're talking about (I'm assuming some kind of humongous hive if it's big enough for Terrans to enter it) and what kind of rooms are in there. A breeding room? An evolution pit (like the one containing Abathur in the campaign)? Some kind of hive-control centre containing a lot of 'in stasis' queens? This will allow you to keep every room and area in your map interesting and unique as you're going on and really make the player feel like he's inside an actual Zerg building rather than a set of corridors with Zerg doodads in them.
Well, I was thinking some kind of lair where a certain unit type is breeded.
I always imagined a hive as having a kind of wheel and spoke setup say 4 entrances that meet in the middle of the main floor
that has some type of elevator/nydus canal in the center that transports units from chambers on other floors
Just what i always imagined
Oh yeah, interior Nydus Worms... that's a great idea, actually.
@EivindL: Go
Depending on unit type... If it's an air unit, I suggest spires and (scaled up) greater spires in the corners of the room (should be circular, with zerg doodad walls). Keep the content in the center to a minimum, maybe a big egg or a cluster of various medium sized eggs. Maybe add some glows. For ground, just spawning pools and hatcheries (at the edges) and a virophage or two. Same walls and center. Also, try to experiment - if we decide to call mapping an art, we can throw rules out the window and experiment with different techniques.
Personally in term of layout it would be wise to, much like mozared said, to do some relevant research. Zerg building are often refered as part of a hive organism, so clearly hey work much like organs themselves, and for that I would recommend studying organ interiors and how they work, for that some endoscopy/colonoscopy plus googling [organ name] interior might help. Note that the body transfers nutrients and and such via complicated pump systems, so consider including a lot of organic looking valves and vents, with walkable spaces being narrow and steamy perhaps (playe acces wuld have to be throgh maybe some huge respiratory and digestive conducts), with most of the components bordering on specifically functional. Try to look how internal organs systems (respiratory, digestive, reproductory - uterus in particular for actual getsation phase) work in terms of phases and transport. Some zerg tendrils could work as veins and such, with some tweaed nydus worms as tracts, and well, just look at many char/zerus and "zerg" doodads as you for tissue. There are some terrain bubbles that could be placed on fleshy looking ground for giving th illusion of air passage and such.
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Well, I had some anatomy once, though it didn't go much further than the loungs/heart. Maybe it'll make an interesting gameplay twist: stop the damn thing from breathing by clogging the airways.
BRB stealing idea.
I would suggest that if it is a Zerg structure like a Lair you could get away with using some natural stuff (well, rock mostly) as I imagine the Hatchery strain (Hatchery, Lair, Hive) as being partly 'dug into' the ground and merging with it. Mind you that'd probably only really be visible on the lowest levels where the Hatchery so I don't know how well that applies to what you have in mind....
A Zerg interior would indeed be very cool to see and maybe we'll get to see something like that in Legacy of the Void (A mission to board a Leviathan would be awesome :D).
I would suggest for inspiration see if you can dig out the models for Kerrigan's Leviathan (especially the set for the 'docking bay' as I remember that also having a Zerg door sort of thing) and you might even be able to take some textures used on those models and make them into custom terrain textures.
Haha. "Your hatchery has lounge cancer".
You just have to worry about Zerg antibodies.
I think I'm going to try this next now. Mission 6 is finished, and although an urban environment would be cool, it's done to death already. This will be something extraordinary.