Hey everyone, I released my arcade map "Protect The Fortress" a couple of days ago, and I want it to be popular, I see that there are some people who play it without me, but most people play it when i play it. I posted here on SC2mapster, on battle.net, and team liquid. Are there any other good places I should post about my map? Or are there other ways to make it popular?
The map is polished, has no bugs, and I update it frequently.
Popular maps I have made and/or worked on: -Poker Defense- SquadTD -MineralZ Evolution-
Only way to get your map to be popular is to get people to play it, and then make them want to continue playing it. All popular maps are either really fun or have a replayability to them. Some have both! Earning and unlocking things inside your game the more they play it is one way to add replayability. I haven't played your map yet so I just talking in general. Your map needs to get their attention with a name that makes me want to try it when I see it in open games. Protect the fortress.... doesn't do it for me. Not saying I wont try it, just saying the name along doesn't grab my attention. Popularity is based on amount of hours played and they reset the hours often nowadays. So the longer your map takes to win, with people staying in of course, the more hours your map will be able to rack up. Having 6 or more players be able to play at a time helps, as most games will have 1-2 people drop early for various reasons. When you are online sit the lobby so new players will see it in open games section, again this the reason you want your name to grab their attention. You can also go to different chats and try and grab people. But ultimately there isnt much you can do but hope and pray people will like/love your creation. If they do it will be popular, and if they don't you can always try again....
Mainly General Advice, but if you have ways to make the linked map popular then you can tell me that too XD
Map specific, first impressions
The lighting is horrific. What on earth made you pick that lighting? Really, this bothered me in the TL thread.
Half of the terrain appears to be blank on the minimap.
Leaderboard covers a huge chunk of screen space.
Boss bar seems unnecessary for how much space it takes up, given you can just mouse over the fort to see it's hp anyway.
Map layout is incredibly boring.
Lack of doodads mean that what terrain you do have, looks dull.
http://i.imgur.com/4pCEROU.jpg
Basically everything about this screenshot needs changing. Seriously. Look at this. Imagine if you were a first time player to your map and this was what you saw.
Eiv maybe right (i don't know) but maybe sugr more for pete s sake... it is pete isn't it?
ps: sorry Terran' .. the "clouds" need to align for a map to be pop and noticed and "successful"... (or you need them to bloody well aligne themselves for YOU (ohh.. and uh ...don't ever let the turkeys get you down))
i agree, youre rather upfront in a harsh way possibly, but yeah i agree. it looks like some mass spawn aoe fest with 'neat' lighting that actually detracts from the game and the UI looks sloppy aka the rest of the map must be sloppy.
like anything, if it looks good, it tastes good. Just like games or women for that matter! *rimshot*
the UI map looks unfinished etc....
but @Terranmaster2;
I will make a point to try your map out, even if i have to host it! :D
Maps such as yours often enjoy success by having content that must be unlocked by repeat plays. Take Squadron Tower Defense - you have to unlock some of the builders.
Beyond that I think just use your common sense... If you think you can succeed eventually, then keep at it, but don't get lazy - listen to your players and make changes. If not, move on.
IMO there are two main aspects to map making. Theres game design ability and technical ability. Game design is most important as you can aquire techinical ability, game design is to some extent more of a given talent. More specifically, within game design, there is the "idea". You need to be able to come up with a good idea for a game, that is more important than anything. A great idea can even make a game that is poorly executed succesful, and a bad idea even if executed very well still will probabbly not be succesful. And thats the thing when you start making a map, you better have a good idea, because if you dont pretty much nothing you do will make your game succesful. You can change things, but it gets to a point where you are basically starting over and making a new game, maybe you can salvage a few assets or something here and there but your basically starting over and you wasted most of your time and effort.
So how do you come up with a great idea, this isnt something everyone can do. In fact it would seem most people cant do it. I can give you tips on coming up with a good idea for a game, or coming up with an idea that is more likely to be successful. For someone such as yourself, it would seem you do not have alot of the technical ability aspect in map development. You can develop that later over time, but given that this seems to be the case i would reccommend a truly original idea. For example if you were trying to make an app that would sell well and make you alot of money, you wouldnt want to do something like make a peresonal planner/organizer app, becuase there are literally hundreds if not thousands of these apps out there that have been made by people who have far more ability than you do, you cannot compete with them.
Making a cookie cutter tower defense or survival map probably isnt in your best intrest as there are many out there that are of a higher quality than anything you could produce, in order to be successful you need to make something that no one has seen, that has no analogs, and that people will like in order to compensate for the likely mediocre if not poor production quality. You could do something like make a survival map if your really set on it, but it really has to be differnt, like alot differnt than anything else out there. Certain genres like for example tower defense for example, the games themselves even though they are differnt are still quite similar, its just the restrictive nature of the genre, survival games are similar. Compare that to something like a strategy game, there is a much wider variety, things are not as restrictive and defined as a tower defense or a dota map which have much of hte game play aspects set in stone just for it to be a part of the genre, its a more specific genre.
So if you want to make a survival game you really need to set it apart from every other game, look at existing games and think to yourself what could you do differtnly, what is missing, what dont you like about the existing games. You do not want to copy or take too much from other games or the general cookie cutter survival game becuase it will not stand out, and as ive said there is likely another cookie cutter survival game that is of much higher quality than what you can produce. You need to atleast come up with several major features or differences, things you will do differntly in your game to distinguish it from all of the others. Think outside the box, you dont have to have to do things in the conventional way. Of course coming up with these differences is the hard part, and as i said not everyone can do it, if everyone could youd see alot of unique games, but you just dont, especially not in the survival or tower defense genre for example.
If you make a good game with the arcade system your map will most likely become popular to some degree at some point. With the old popularity system even if it was good that was no gaurentee, im not saying arcade is good but its alot better than pop system was.
Something that can also help alot, if your map is good, is advertising. Really the best way to do this, is to make sure you get a really good cover picture for your game, and write a good game description so that it entices people to try the game, but if its not good they will try it and just not play it anymore.
Another form of advertising is your map getting attention on youtube or something. For example i put out a map in 2011, with the old pop system still in place. It didnt get alot of play time. Then HuskyStarcraft saw my map, liked it alot, played it and put up one of the replays with his commentary on youtube, and it got 150,000 hits. My map went from being barely played by a small number of people to being ranked #2 on NA literally overnight. This guy as well as i assume other youtubers make videos on custom games, although husky mainly does i think pro gaming commentary not custom maps but sometimes he does customs. If your map is good ask about one of these guys maybe playing your map and doing a video on it, they need content.
Heres a link to it
As you can see from the map, I at the time obviously didnt have alot of technical ability. The map is simplistic and not of a really high quality, but the idea is unique and very good. This wasnt origonally my idea, i got it from a map from WC3 and based it on that making some changes to try to improve upon it. And thats another thing you can do, if you cant come up with an idea look to other games for good ideas, even board games and stuff, if its good and it hasnt been done in SC2 yet it could be viable.
And in response to what others have said about unlockables and acivements. They do increase a games life, if that is your onyl goal. For me personally i would rather people play the game until they get bored of the game, not continue to play a game they are bored of just to get a top hat or something. The only custom game i really played much in SC2 was mafia, a game which has been in many ways adversilly affected by unlockables/achieves. Often times you will have 1 or even 2 players basically afking for points which can ruin games especially if they survive till they end. If you didnt have this stuff these people wouldnt be there ruining the game, and i dont know for sure, but i had thought the banks which store players points was what was causing 1-3 players to drop from almost every game, which in itself ruins games. There have been times where i had to join 4 mafia games before i actually got one that didnt break up at teh start due to drops.
I agree with you 110%.
Basically what you said is that there are 3 main aspects to make a map popular:
1. The map has new things that people never saw before
2. Achievements
3. Advertising
I believe 1 and 3 are the hardest, while #2 is just a matter of time.
Also, if anyone has any ideas for #1 (for survival games) then just tell me so :p
Thank you everyone
I think theres still an RPG-Survival type game that still needs to be made. Other than that I have no idea how you will make an original survival unless you make it PvP and make 1 guy the killers (spawn the infested) and the other guys the survivors (defends) (though i'm not sure if this hasnt been done already)
Hey everyone, I released my arcade map "Protect The Fortress" a couple of days ago, and I want it to be popular, I see that there are some people who play it without me, but most people play it when i play it. I posted here on SC2mapster, on battle.net, and team liquid. Are there any other good places I should post about my map? Or are there other ways to make it popular? The map is polished, has no bugs, and I update it frequently.
More info on map: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=423870
Thanks in advance
Are you asking for general advice on how to make a popular arcade map, or are you asking how you can make the linked map popular?
@Eiviyn: Go
Mainly General Advice, but if you have ways to make the linked map popular then you can tell me that too XD
I may know a thing or two about this......
Popular maps I have made and/or worked on: -Poker Defense- SquadTD -MineralZ Evolution-
Only way to get your map to be popular is to get people to play it, and then make them want to continue playing it. All popular maps are either really fun or have a replayability to them. Some have both! Earning and unlocking things inside your game the more they play it is one way to add replayability. I haven't played your map yet so I just talking in general. Your map needs to get their attention with a name that makes me want to try it when I see it in open games. Protect the fortress.... doesn't do it for me. Not saying I wont try it, just saying the name along doesn't grab my attention. Popularity is based on amount of hours played and they reset the hours often nowadays. So the longer your map takes to win, with people staying in of course, the more hours your map will be able to rack up. Having 6 or more players be able to play at a time helps, as most games will have 1-2 people drop early for various reasons. When you are online sit the lobby so new players will see it in open games section, again this the reason you want your name to grab their attention. You can also go to different chats and try and grab people. But ultimately there isnt much you can do but hope and pray people will like/love your creation. If they do it will be popular, and if they don't you can always try again....
@SyCoAttack: Go
okay thx
It always helps to have players hosting said mod
that "try" to make newcomers see the point of the game and the funny
i have been happily hosting pc for 2 years
(gaming and map making are generally a calling, hosting is a curse)
Map specific, first impressions
The lighting is horrific. What on earth made you pick that lighting? Really, this bothered me in the TL thread.
Half of the terrain appears to be blank on the minimap.
Leaderboard covers a huge chunk of screen space.
Boss bar seems unnecessary for how much space it takes up, given you can just mouse over the fort to see it's hp anyway.
Map layout is incredibly boring.
Lack of doodads mean that what terrain you do have, looks dull.
http://i.imgur.com/4pCEROU.jpg
Basically everything about this screenshot needs changing. Seriously. Look at this. Imagine if you were a first time player to your map and this was what you saw.
Take a look at and learn from it. That seems to be the kind of map you're going for, and that map took the right approach in terms of UI and Terrain.
Moz for the win (save?)
.. harsh ...
Eiv maybe right (i don't know) but maybe sugr more for pete s sake... it is pete isn't it?
ps: sorry Terran' .. the "clouds" need to align for a map to be pop and noticed and "successful"... (or you need them to bloody well aligne themselves for YOU (ohh.. and uh ...don't ever let the turkeys get you down))
@houndofbaskerville: Go
I am working on a big update, many of the things you mentioned are fixed or made better. Will post some new screen shots once I finish the update.
As for leaderboard: Any ideas on what I should name the income stuff (rather than mineral inc, terrazine inc, or gas inc)
@Mozared: Go
Thanks for the link, i assure you, the new update will make the map look much nicer.
@Eiviyn: Go
i agree, youre rather upfront in a harsh way possibly, but yeah i agree. it looks like some mass spawn aoe fest with 'neat' lighting that actually detracts from the game and the UI looks sloppy aka the rest of the map must be sloppy.
like anything, if it looks good, it tastes good. Just like games or women for that matter! *rimshot*
the UI map looks unfinished etc....
but @Terranmaster2;
I will make a point to try your map out, even if i have to host it! :D
@ezbeats: Go
thanks
@TerranMaster23: Go
Maps such as yours often enjoy success by having content that must be unlocked by repeat plays. Take Squadron Tower Defense - you have to unlock some of the builders.
Beyond that I think just use your common sense... If you think you can succeed eventually, then keep at it, but don't get lazy - listen to your players and make changes. If not, move on.
IMO there are two main aspects to map making. Theres game design ability and technical ability. Game design is most important as you can aquire techinical ability, game design is to some extent more of a given talent. More specifically, within game design, there is the "idea". You need to be able to come up with a good idea for a game, that is more important than anything. A great idea can even make a game that is poorly executed succesful, and a bad idea even if executed very well still will probabbly not be succesful. And thats the thing when you start making a map, you better have a good idea, because if you dont pretty much nothing you do will make your game succesful. You can change things, but it gets to a point where you are basically starting over and making a new game, maybe you can salvage a few assets or something here and there but your basically starting over and you wasted most of your time and effort.
So how do you come up with a great idea, this isnt something everyone can do. In fact it would seem most people cant do it. I can give you tips on coming up with a good idea for a game, or coming up with an idea that is more likely to be successful. For someone such as yourself, it would seem you do not have alot of the technical ability aspect in map development. You can develop that later over time, but given that this seems to be the case i would reccommend a truly original idea. For example if you were trying to make an app that would sell well and make you alot of money, you wouldnt want to do something like make a peresonal planner/organizer app, becuase there are literally hundreds if not thousands of these apps out there that have been made by people who have far more ability than you do, you cannot compete with them.
Making a cookie cutter tower defense or survival map probably isnt in your best intrest as there are many out there that are of a higher quality than anything you could produce, in order to be successful you need to make something that no one has seen, that has no analogs, and that people will like in order to compensate for the likely mediocre if not poor production quality. You could do something like make a survival map if your really set on it, but it really has to be differnt, like alot differnt than anything else out there. Certain genres like for example tower defense for example, the games themselves even though they are differnt are still quite similar, its just the restrictive nature of the genre, survival games are similar. Compare that to something like a strategy game, there is a much wider variety, things are not as restrictive and defined as a tower defense or a dota map which have much of hte game play aspects set in stone just for it to be a part of the genre, its a more specific genre.
So if you want to make a survival game you really need to set it apart from every other game, look at existing games and think to yourself what could you do differtnly, what is missing, what dont you like about the existing games. You do not want to copy or take too much from other games or the general cookie cutter survival game becuase it will not stand out, and as ive said there is likely another cookie cutter survival game that is of much higher quality than what you can produce. You need to atleast come up with several major features or differences, things you will do differntly in your game to distinguish it from all of the others. Think outside the box, you dont have to have to do things in the conventional way. Of course coming up with these differences is the hard part, and as i said not everyone can do it, if everyone could youd see alot of unique games, but you just dont, especially not in the survival or tower defense genre for example.
If you make a good game with the arcade system your map will most likely become popular to some degree at some point. With the old popularity system even if it was good that was no gaurentee, im not saying arcade is good but its alot better than pop system was.
Something that can also help alot, if your map is good, is advertising. Really the best way to do this, is to make sure you get a really good cover picture for your game, and write a good game description so that it entices people to try the game, but if its not good they will try it and just not play it anymore.
Another form of advertising is your map getting attention on youtube or something. For example i put out a map in 2011, with the old pop system still in place. It didnt get alot of play time. Then HuskyStarcraft saw my map, liked it alot, played it and put up one of the replays with his commentary on youtube, and it got 150,000 hits. My map went from being barely played by a small number of people to being ranked #2 on NA literally overnight. This guy as well as i assume other youtubers make videos on custom games, although husky mainly does i think pro gaming commentary not custom maps but sometimes he does customs. If your map is good ask about one of these guys maybe playing your map and doing a video on it, they need content.
Heres a link to it
As you can see from the map, I at the time obviously didnt have alot of technical ability. The map is simplistic and not of a really high quality, but the idea is unique and very good. This wasnt origonally my idea, i got it from a map from WC3 and based it on that making some changes to try to improve upon it. And thats another thing you can do, if you cant come up with an idea look to other games for good ideas, even board games and stuff, if its good and it hasnt been done in SC2 yet it could be viable.
And in response to what others have said about unlockables and acivements. They do increase a games life, if that is your onyl goal. For me personally i would rather people play the game until they get bored of the game, not continue to play a game they are bored of just to get a top hat or something. The only custom game i really played much in SC2 was mafia, a game which has been in many ways adversilly affected by unlockables/achieves. Often times you will have 1 or even 2 players basically afking for points which can ruin games especially if they survive till they end. If you didnt have this stuff these people wouldnt be there ruining the game, and i dont know for sure, but i had thought the banks which store players points was what was causing 1-3 players to drop from almost every game, which in itself ruins games. There have been times where i had to join 4 mafia games before i actually got one that didnt break up at teh start due to drops.
@lemmy734: Go
I agree with you 110%. Basically what you said is that there are 3 main aspects to make a map popular:
1. The map has new things that people never saw before
2. Achievements
3. Advertising
I believe 1 and 3 are the hardest, while #2 is just a matter of time. Also, if anyone has any ideas for #1 (for survival games) then just tell me so :p Thank you everyone
@FenixKissKerrigan: Go I updated my map. for change-log see here: http://www.sc2gump.com/forums/66-Stable-version-and-changelog Also, i know the leaderboard still looks bad, i will be doing a new one using dialogs, then give it some fancy border. thank you everyone for your suggestions
I think theres still an RPG-Survival type game that still needs to be made. Other than that I have no idea how you will make an original survival unless you make it PvP and make 1 guy the killers (spawn the infested) and the other guys the survivors (defends) (though i'm not sure if this hasnt been done already)