You have to make a tutorial on how to build on units!
I was trying to do that too for quite a while now, the only way I saw was to use the "move unit instantly" trigger, but I guess thats going to lag on battle.net like hell :D
Anyway, I got something you might like: attackable engines! that was awsome in Homeworld, and it would open up awsome new strategies.
It also would be very easy: set the speed of your BC to 0, make a new engine unit, attach it, give them an aura that will increase the movment speed of (massive) ships nearby, create an ability to rebuild them, done!
Oh yay, someone took my idea from the project workplace sometimes month before and made it happen.
Possible ideas:
* Battlecruisers don't die even after it's hp drops to 0, instead, it goes on a burnout mode, and functions may not work properly. Players need to repair it and put out the fires. If the burnout finishes, the BC explodes and nearby ships takes major damage... This is to prevent those usual DOTA styled teaming up, because these ships are huge and can be turned into an explosive. (Why in space battle movies, you see battleships blowing up one after the other? It's a chain reaction from the damage in space)
* Weapons and gun placements should be the utmost important, friendly fire should be on, and the range of the guns could be tweaked so it would only shoot if enemies are within range AND in direct sight.
* Along with friendly fire comes careful tactics, the usual star battle tactic where you can group up on one target isn't always effective, as you'll be hitting each other more than hitting your target.
* Shield upgrades can be possible to add onto the battlecruiser, and it adds a radius of effect on the frame of the ship.
* Battlecruisers should have various category of pieces, like engine room, armory, launch pads, etc. and you can customize them in battle. Enemies can basically target it and disable your ability to launch ships for example.
* Weapon fire should be more manual, meaning you have 3 weapon slots to use, and you simply click on a target area to shoot it. Shoot the engine to slow the enemy down, shoot the guns to make him harmless, shoot the launch pad so ships can't invade you.
* Invading function, if the ship has no shields, ships could be able to invade the battlecruiser, which is a great way to destroy them. In order to invade, special ships needs to be built and a squad of units are needed to get into the enemy ship. When invading, the enemy ship basically goes into a "debuff" and losses health at random interval, sometimes even losing functionality because they are wrecking the insides of the ship.
Anyone up for creating a bigger and better map, where only 1 battlecruiser exists for each team, and the team controls the ships instead? Think of it as a mobile carrier and you basically live on the BC. This idea would be awesome to make squad base ship battle, with smaller ships so you don't really control DOTA styled battleships. IT also means you can respawn too.
1) Maybe replace Mothership and Planetary Fortress with other space bases? Maybe like asteroids or maybe clear space?
2) Can you add with triggers thing, that will prevent ships split into one? Maybe a minimal distance?
3) Can you add some space "weather"? As example - black hole, that will randomly take all DOTA-ships or lock off your weapons, or your radars. Or Asteroids, that will sometimes do small damage to your ship?
4) Maybe add 1st/3rd person control on some ships for direct damage on targets, like weapons or engines?
5) Maybe add mutalisks as neutral creeps, that will be spawned on the map (from hatcheries on asteroids) and you will got some moneys from killing them. Like killing terrans on SotIS
I think the biggest problem is there is effectively 1 very thin corridor that's barely wide enough for the 3 battleships.
All that happens is each team lines up against each other with very little manoeuvring until someone gets too badly hurt so they retreat. The other team then has the upper hand and keeps pushing them back to their mothership and kills them.
I basically ended up wanting these battleships (because they are amazing) on the starbattle map. It just needs the fighters to travel in wider arcs really.
Absolutely love the battleships though, very cinematic.
lol LOVE the Death animation. "Jim, I dunno' how much longer I can hold her toge'-BOOM!- ... 'Oi, that was fast..."
This concept has many many uses; for example, Supreme Commander 2's unit upgrade/customization system now seems more flexible and possible than it did before in SC2.
@irok2002: Go
This concept has many many uses; for example, Supreme Commander 2's unit upgrade/customization system now seems more flexible and possible than it did before in SC2.
Yeah, it's the concept I love. The possibilities are just limitless. I just want to make sure I get things right first time before I implement more features. The next features I want to implement are bombers, defensive hardpoints, a skill system and more lanes. I'm working on the skill system now, I'll release it when it's clean and smooth. I made the mistake of releasing content too rapidly (especially unpolished content) with my first map. I definitely wouldn't want a repeat.
I think the biggest problem is there is effectively 1 very thin corridor that's barely wide enough for the 3 battleships. All that happens is each team lines up against each other with very little manoeuvring until someone gets too badly hurt so they retreat. The other team then has the upper hand and keeps pushing them back to their mothership and kills them.
I basically ended up wanting these battleships (because they are amazing) on the starbattle map. It just needs the fighters to travel in wider arcs really.
Absolutely love the battleships though, very cinematic.
It's a problem, yeah. I mean, it has advantages but I want to expand the scale a little.
one thing:
also publish in LA servers.
one question:
Where did you got the model for the battlecrusier? I know it is from the cinematics in the game, but I did not though that the models would run on the actual game!
thx
The thing about Star Battle in NA that gets on my nerve is when you die, your out, literally, and can't offer any help other than being an extra eye.
There also lacks additional defenses. Where are the space stations and, if possible, planets.
I remember playing a SC1BW map where you pilot Fighter Ships and use your microing skills and upgrade to destroy your enemies...
Well basically, space battle gamemodes needs a variety of action, because typical ship vs ship gets old when cheap abilities and team ups makes it NOT fun.
Eiviyn you always seem to make maps that are seem amazing. I say seem amazing because I haven't played Catalyst due to me being NA and you only have it hosted on EU. I would do anything to have maps this quality on NA. We have nothing but simple games that anyone can make. Star battles is the newest but it's still too simple.
Btw what model is that battlecruiser? It looks awesome, is it storymode?
I'd imagine a lot of people will start making or hasten their release of spaceship-battle maps soon. I never thought their was any demand for such a genre before either. Competition is good, Star Battle and VoidCraft have just set a decent standard for maps of similar design.
It goes to show that trashing unique map ideas thinking it wouldn't fly is a major mistake.
Well done Eiviyn. I too would like to know how you managed making build-able regions on a unit. That sounds like clever uses of footprints and flags.
I come from a background where you create a design-> Iterate-> fully functional-> In-house testing-> Public/Closed-Beta testing. Quality release.
Like I said though, Just a different way of doing things I suppose.
<</quote>>
In-house testing is impossible. Since SC2 does not support LAN, the only way to test a map is to publish it.
One could have a private publish for a closed Beta, but then you'd have to always invite beta testers you most likely don't have in the first place, so the only way to really get a lot of feedback is an open Beta.
Now you're blaming me for the coffee, eh? I told you, the dog took it! I've got an alibi, i was jacking your cookies at that time!
Anyway, i played the map again, doing really good ;) played void mode. its pretty fun untill you get maxed with upgrades and cant do anything, lol.
One thing i think should be fixed:
All the build fighter abilities are on autocast. Thats good, i dont mind that. The problem is that the autocast priorities are somehow upside-down. I dont want to build wraiths first which'll die instantly, i want my vikings! I don't know whether there's a way to change the priority except for changing the position of the buttons. For now my only solution was to turn off autocast on the other two abilities...
I have a suggestion that i think could improve a lot the game play. Instead of autoturrets that fire automatically to other bs make them a (little) aoe aimed atack with cooldown. This will work great with the idea of different part of the ship and will make manoubring more important. You can have 2 types of turrets, one antiwratihs or antimissiles that work as the normal missile turrets of the game with little damage but bonus against "ligth" to make them only usefulla gaintns wraiths or other little ships and other for atacking capital ship with aoe damage and bonus agaonnts "massive"(to represent that little ships avoid the huge blasts). The aoe means that if you target it well yu can hit several parts of the enemy bs and the cooldown makes it like naval battles in sea, with "rounds of atacks" and much more tactical than simply constant autofire.
If you want an example, the special atack of the "odin" (the big thor) in the campaign, when you assault the UNN studios.
this map has a great potential, keep up the good work!
I agree that there's definately a lot of potential in the way you upgrade you battle ship in this map. Sorry for refraining from providing detailed feedback right now, but I think a lot of good points have already been made by other people.
There's two major things that confuse me right now:
1) Why do my turrets sometimes just transfer over to an ally's battle ship? There's no command that I could see that would do that, yet several times now, my initial 2 turrets served me greatly for a couple of minutes until I surprisedly realized that they'd somehow moved over to my ally's chassis, leaving me with no weaponry.
2) Is there any way to target an enemy's weapons? I've tried getting a mass fighter build to work, but I always seem to get obliterated since turrets and siege cannons simply outdamage me by a large margin. If there was a possibility to focus and eliminate their weapons, that'd open up new strategic possibilities. But from what I can tell after playing 5 or 6 games so far, the only way to (somewhat) reliably take them out is via siege cannon splash damage.
Yeah. You need to bring their shields down, then you can take out their structures. I felt that they were too vulnerable and not worth the investment without some outside protection. 3 of the initial Wraiths could happily take out 2 starting turrets purely due to their firepower. I'll try to make this more obvious in future.
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You have to make a tutorial on how to build on units! I was trying to do that too for quite a while now, the only way I saw was to use the "move unit instantly" trigger, but I guess thats going to lag on battle.net like hell :D Anyway, I got something you might like: attackable engines! that was awsome in Homeworld, and it would open up awsome new strategies. It also would be very easy: set the speed of your BC to 0, make a new engine unit, attach it, give them an aura that will increase the movment speed of (massive) ships nearby, create an ability to rebuild them, done!
I hope you like it :)
Oh yay, someone took my idea from the project workplace sometimes month before and made it happen.
Possible ideas:
* Battlecruisers don't die even after it's hp drops to 0, instead, it goes on a burnout mode, and functions may not work properly. Players need to repair it and put out the fires. If the burnout finishes, the BC explodes and nearby ships takes major damage... This is to prevent those usual DOTA styled teaming up, because these ships are huge and can be turned into an explosive. (Why in space battle movies, you see battleships blowing up one after the other? It's a chain reaction from the damage in space)
* Weapons and gun placements should be the utmost important, friendly fire should be on, and the range of the guns could be tweaked so it would only shoot if enemies are within range AND in direct sight.
* Along with friendly fire comes careful tactics, the usual star battle tactic where you can group up on one target isn't always effective, as you'll be hitting each other more than hitting your target.
* Shield upgrades can be possible to add onto the battlecruiser, and it adds a radius of effect on the frame of the ship.
* Battlecruisers should have various category of pieces, like engine room, armory, launch pads, etc. and you can customize them in battle. Enemies can basically target it and disable your ability to launch ships for example.
* Weapon fire should be more manual, meaning you have 3 weapon slots to use, and you simply click on a target area to shoot it. Shoot the engine to slow the enemy down, shoot the guns to make him harmless, shoot the launch pad so ships can't invade you.
* Invading function, if the ship has no shields, ships could be able to invade the battlecruiser, which is a great way to destroy them. In order to invade, special ships needs to be built and a squad of units are needed to get into the enemy ship. When invading, the enemy ship basically goes into a "debuff" and losses health at random interval, sometimes even losing functionality because they are wrecking the insides of the ship.
Anyone up for creating a bigger and better map, where only 1 battlecruiser exists for each team, and the team controls the ships instead? Think of it as a mobile carrier and you basically live on the BC. This idea would be awesome to make squad base ship battle, with smaller ships so you don't really control DOTA styled battleships. IT also means you can respawn too.
Epic idea! Just some questions and ideas:
1) Maybe replace Mothership and Planetary Fortress with other space bases? Maybe like asteroids or maybe clear space? 2) Can you add with triggers thing, that will prevent ships split into one? Maybe a minimal distance? 3) Can you add some space "weather"? As example - black hole, that will randomly take all DOTA-ships or lock off your weapons, or your radars. Or Asteroids, that will sometimes do small damage to your ship? 4) Maybe add 1st/3rd person control on some ships for direct damage on targets, like weapons or engines? 5) Maybe add mutalisks as neutral creeps, that will be spawned on the map (from hatcheries on asteroids) and you will got some moneys from killing them. Like killing terrans on SotIS
can someone PLEASE publish this on the NA servers? i MUST HAVE!
@ScruffythePoltergeist: Go
I'm interesting in how to attach a unit to another too. A tutorial or just a general idea on how its done would be nice.
There is already a tutorial I believe, just look in the wiki or tutorial section for it.
It was a nexus with photon cannons on it.
I think the biggest problem is there is effectively 1 very thin corridor that's barely wide enough for the 3 battleships. All that happens is each team lines up against each other with very little manoeuvring until someone gets too badly hurt so they retreat. The other team then has the upper hand and keeps pushing them back to their mothership and kills them.
I basically ended up wanting these battleships (because they are amazing) on the starbattle map. It just needs the fighters to travel in wider arcs really.
Absolutely love the battleships though, very cinematic.
@irok2002: Go
lol LOVE the Death animation. "Jim, I dunno' how much longer I can hold her toge'-BOOM!- ... 'Oi, that was fast..."
This concept has many many uses; for example, Supreme Commander 2's unit upgrade/customization system now seems more flexible and possible than it did before in SC2.
The left one stole the right one's coffee.
It looks like I'll be able to publish direct to NA in 1.12.
Yeah, it's the concept I love. The possibilities are just limitless. I just want to make sure I get things right first time before I implement more features. The next features I want to implement are bombers, defensive hardpoints, a skill system and more lanes. I'm working on the skill system now, I'll release it when it's clean and smooth. I made the mistake of releasing content too rapidly (especially unpolished content) with my first map. I definitely wouldn't want a repeat.
It's a problem, yeah. I mean, it has advantages but I want to expand the scale a little.
one thing: also publish in LA servers. one question: Where did you got the model for the battlecrusier? I know it is from the cinematics in the game, but I did not though that the models would run on the actual game! thx
The thing about Star Battle in NA that gets on my nerve is when you die, your out, literally, and can't offer any help other than being an extra eye.
There also lacks additional defenses. Where are the space stations and, if possible, planets.
I remember playing a SC1BW map where you pilot Fighter Ships and use your microing skills and upgrade to destroy your enemies...
Well basically, space battle gamemodes needs a variety of action, because typical ship vs ship gets old when cheap abilities and team ups makes it NOT fun.
Eiviyn you always seem to make maps that are seem amazing. I say seem amazing because I haven't played Catalyst due to me being NA and you only have it hosted on EU. I would do anything to have maps this quality on NA. We have nothing but simple games that anyone can make. Star battles is the newest but it's still too simple.
Btw what model is that battlecruiser? It looks awesome, is it storymode?
@Eiviyn: Go
Generals is an awesome song isn't it?
GL with the map. Looks good.
I'd imagine a lot of people will start making or hasten their release of spaceship-battle maps soon. I never thought their was any demand for such a genre before either. Competition is good, Star Battle and VoidCraft have just set a decent standard for maps of similar design.
It goes to show that trashing unique map ideas thinking it wouldn't fly is a major mistake.
Well done Eiviyn. I too would like to know how you managed making build-able regions on a unit. That sounds like clever uses of footprints and flags.
<<quote 233500>>
<<reply 233498>>
I come from a background where you create a design-> Iterate-> fully functional-> In-house testing-> Public/Closed-Beta testing. Quality release.
Like I said though, Just a different way of doing things I suppose.
<</quote>>
In-house testing is impossible. Since SC2 does not support LAN, the only way to test a map is to publish it.
One could have a private publish for a closed Beta, but then you'd have to always invite beta testers you most likely don't have in the first place, so the only way to really get a lot of feedback is an open Beta.
Now you're blaming me for the coffee, eh? I told you, the dog took it! I've got an alibi, i was jacking your cookies at that time!
Anyway, i played the map again, doing really good ;) played void mode. its pretty fun untill you get maxed with upgrades and cant do anything, lol.
One thing i think should be fixed:
All the build fighter abilities are on autocast. Thats good, i dont mind that. The problem is that the autocast priorities are somehow upside-down. I dont want to build wraiths first which'll die instantly, i want my vikings! I don't know whether there's a way to change the priority except for changing the position of the buttons. For now my only solution was to turn off autocast on the other two abilities...
this looks awesome.
I have a suggestion that i think could improve a lot the game play. Instead of autoturrets that fire automatically to other bs make them a (little) aoe aimed atack with cooldown. This will work great with the idea of different part of the ship and will make manoubring more important. You can have 2 types of turrets, one antiwratihs or antimissiles that work as the normal missile turrets of the game with little damage but bonus against "ligth" to make them only usefulla gaintns wraiths or other little ships and other for atacking capital ship with aoe damage and bonus agaonnts "massive"(to represent that little ships avoid the huge blasts). The aoe means that if you target it well yu can hit several parts of the enemy bs and the cooldown makes it like naval battles in sea, with "rounds of atacks" and much more tactical than simply constant autofire.
If you want an example, the special atack of the "odin" (the big thor) in the campaign, when you assault the UNN studios.
this map has a great potential, keep up the good work!
I agree that there's definately a lot of potential in the way you upgrade you battle ship in this map. Sorry for refraining from providing detailed feedback right now, but I think a lot of good points have already been made by other people.
There's two major things that confuse me right now:
1) Why do my turrets sometimes just transfer over to an ally's battle ship? There's no command that I could see that would do that, yet several times now, my initial 2 turrets served me greatly for a couple of minutes until I surprisedly realized that they'd somehow moved over to my ally's chassis, leaving me with no weaponry.
2) Is there any way to target an enemy's weapons? I've tried getting a mass fighter build to work, but I always seem to get obliterated since turrets and siege cannons simply outdamage me by a large margin. If there was a possibility to focus and eliminate their weapons, that'd open up new strategic possibilities. But from what I can tell after playing 5 or 6 games so far, the only way to (somewhat) reliably take them out is via siege cannon splash damage.
Interesting. That's definitely a bug. I think I know the cause, and uploaded a fix a few minutes ago.
Yeah. You need to bring their shields down, then you can take out their structures. I felt that they were too vulnerable and not worth the investment without some outside protection. 3 of the initial Wraiths could happily take out 2 starting turrets purely due to their firepower. I'll try to make this more obvious in future.