Maps: UloseTheGame's Alternate Melee Mod(A mod comprised of just three original races. The Grugz, the Marine Corp, and the Void Pirates. This mod will showcase the power of the data editor.
Contact: In-game, Skype(Full name:UloseTheGame), Email([email protected], i do not check this much)
Hi I made a thread but it didn't get too much attention, presumably because of the name. Due to this, I have decided to make another with a better title, this will be the link here. Thank you for watching.
Today I will be casting all night, and you may see some things you didn't know. For today, I am going to be doing the Fun or Nots all day and NEVER going to leave a single one, except in between to do maps with friends! Watch me if you like, I'll be hosting from
Oh no...Not this...were you planning to make this yourself turds? This was posted a year ago on the hive, but after reading the whole post, I realized that you were unwilling to listen and change things based on what others said. This new race idea is halfassed and crap, it doesn't sound original, it just sounds desperate. When you come back with new original ideas, and a balanced layout then makes sense, then we'll talk. But right now, it just seems like another mod we dont need.
Do you even know what you are talking about? I'm just curious, when was the last time any of you tried publishing a multiplayer map on Battle.net, or even successfully played in a full lobby past page three? Please englighten me - you must have a damn good reason to argue this system isn't fubar, we know it's pointless to create new threads but when a mapmaker comes here and politely points out the flaws of the system you shouldn't call them "illogical expectations" just because it's been like this for a year and Wc3 is something to forget even though it magically worked.
I'm sorry, this is just stupid.
You two squabble at strawmen while the real problem looms high above your heads... The big problem with the popularity system is simply that it works. It does what it intends to do. It's professional now, not the youtube but the hulu. Maps are now packaged and mapmakers limited. And it's all because of DoTA. Blizzard didn't see the golden cow, didn't think much of it. When it grew too big to control, and Blizzard lost money they could have made, they developed SC2 the way they did. It wasn't Kotick at all. I can bet you it wasn't. Point fingers at valve, Dota 2 caused this. Point fingers at icefrog. He caused this when he sold out. And most of all, point fingers at yourself, 'cause it's never entirely the other person's fault. Shame on you all, for thinking it's not your problem, it's everyone's problem. It's all our faults. You see, Blizzard knew that DoTA could not screw them out of all they could have made. The money they would have made off DoTA would be far more than WoW ever could have made them. They wanted the next big project under control, their control. And I promise you it isn't SOTIS. We've got a few gems in this incarnation of battle net, that's more than we could have bargained for. Of course, people don't give them the credit they deserve. Is it below you to do what Mephs did? Are you above Rodrigo, a better person than he is? Is Chirus' hard work deserving of no attention? Does Mafia deserve to be where debates should be? Does Power Level Overwhelming, an overlooked gem, deserve no attention cause it's creator has made no drama? Think about all this, and whatever answer you decide to use, you're wrong, think again, and then you'll be right.
SCDebates is hosting interviews with mappers! Come watch these interviews and learn more about your fellow mappers! If you would like, we can host you in an interview as well! Please notify me immediately if you wish to sign up. As of 8:30 EST, we are starting in 10 minutes.
To those confused, the interviews are not started, but will start momentarily, however, there has been a slight backup for the person i'm interviewing, please be patient.
Im not really mad about that, i'm mad that just the trouble of changing all campaign aspects back to melee is a hassle(For example, not allowing a barracks to train all the units it can, allowing a nexus to use chrono boost again, ect.). I know the data editor is a very very powerufl tool that allows you to create alot. I remeber wc3 trigger based abilities, in fact thats all they really were when it came to good abilities. But i'm not entirley sure how to export just a model, (place it in a mod?), and then add that dependency to my map for later use. For example In my map, I want the hybrid models, and the hero models. But am not even sure how to only pull them from the campaign dependency.
exporting models? That's easy, BUT you have do it from the model previewer.
I'll be honest, the object editor was a piece of shit created because of programming limits and lazyness on the part of blizzard in terms of creating a lasting engine. The Data Editor is far superior when used correctly. Its just most do not. Its far easier to learn triggers in a simple manner, then think you know what you're doing. This leads people to believe triggers are easier than data. This is wrong, data is just harder to jump into. Triggering, on the other hand, is much harder to master, just easier in entry level.
That's not the point though, unless you have the intelligence of a retarded monkey, you can work the data editor at a basic level. Just because its harder to have skillz doesn't mean its worse than the object, which was for those with mental capacity INFERIOR to retarded monkeys, no offense.
Point blank: The object editor was a limited tool, and now the limits have been removed, and all those retarded monkeys are having trouble. You need to just work at it, not everything you will get immediately.
I thought I'd make one of these threads cause they're fun :D
Favorites:
Lotr maps: I know its not "one map", but I really like lotr maps. From trop to wotr to south, i love lotr maps because of the immense possibilities (I like games like chess for similar reasons). I also really like the learning aspect of it, and games with all very well-learned players are amazing!
Debates: Aside from lotr maps, I also enjoy Debates, perhaps a little TOO much. Debates to me a unique map where you get to discuss ideas and be social, that's pretty fun. Imo, Debates deserves more attention than it gets, everyone who i introduce to Debates loves it, and admits they would not normally think it to be so much fun.
My thoughts exactly. Surely epic battles are not unique to LotR?
Kara, i still doubt you've played it before, although mozared has. You're referencing epic space battles, and saying "come up with a new theme", and trust me some will. To me, it doesn't matter what theme it should be, because the models will always be incorrect. Movies too. I now imagine nazgul as leviathans, and frodo as a ghost. That's ALRIGHT with me. But the extensive lore of the lotr universe makes it a prime target for the not one, but now FIVE maps based off of it, each with its own gameplay, timeline, feel, and units. Its hard to do a star wars map type thing, because the lore is so much less extensive. Anyway, people should NOT be limited by the theme of the game. It limits us so much in our ideas by saying models matter. This early, we should only worry about gameplay, ideas, etc. DO NOT LET THEME OR LACK THEREOF BOG YOU DOWN. The "all important theme" is totally dropped in lotr, which is an amazing game. Karawasa, in fact, totally misses what makes the game fun in his post of "epic space battles". He also hasn't flamed the game in any way yet, so I doubt he's played it.
LaertesSC2 had some interest in making custom races in Starcraft 2. Why don't you PM him and maybe you too can work something out. Here is his fictional background stories he presented to me couple months ago.
"The Void Pirates fled from their home planet fleeing genocide and civil war. At this time, their ranks consisted of a handful of fleeing templars. These renegade templars knew that they were being hunted and they fled to worlds unknown. The fleeing templar came upon a planet where there existed a repository, and beside it, incarnations collecting information. These beings, born of knowledge, and sometimes powerful enough to morph into other repositories with enough knowledge, were universal anomalies. They should not have existed, and yet they did. The creatures gave the pirates a new purpose, and the first Void Pirate colony was established on a neighboring world. Drawing upon resources garnered by the Incarnations, the Void Pirates took off on their eternal quest for knowledge. However, the Void Pirates would soon clash with races of all kinds in a faraway sector which they themselves did not have a name for.
Void Pirate Techtree + Lore
Repository: It is unclear what caused the creation of this strange structure and the incarnations that tend to it. It is just as unclear what came first, the Incarnation, or the Repository. One thing is clear though, when you find one Repository, you will many more around it, for incarnations, beings of knowledge, can metamorphose into these strange formations.
Astronomicon: An infinite void is contained in every Astronomicon. But it is not clear just how it works. The Void Pirates believe that a dead universe is linked to this strange formation. But only Incarnations truly know the way. When asked about their strange journeys through, they only mention that anything can be found in an Astronomicon, but to find it, one must look beyond the dead space. Whatever the case is, the Incarnations dare not use it to find anything but the vespene geysers that the Astronomicons are built around. Those few who have emerged from the Astronomicon alive have become oblivious to the world around, muttering incomprehensible things in an ancient tongue that the Void Pirates dare not repeat...
Enclave: The Renegade Templar take up residence in community homes known as enclaves. These homes house civilians, soldiers, and monstrosities alike. Each being takes up one small dorm, but the community will eat, recreate and live in the same domain. In militant colonies, the enclave is the main training center for humanoid soldiers. The Shadowbringer, Slayer, and Renegade Templar are all trained within this home. In fact,
the enclave is likely the last link to the unknown and archaic culture of their ancestry.
Void Factory: The term "factory" is loosely defined here, however, this structure was adapted by the Void Pirates from an age old marine corp design. When an incarnation surrounded the structure in metamorphosis it could be used to create machines and experiment on devastating robotic technologies left over from an older culture not completely the void pirates. However, the Void Pirates added their own to twists to experiments performed in these factories. The engineering traits performed here include reverse engineering, Artificial Intelligence, and even dark flying creations when advanced in experimentation."
Thanks queen, I have also finished and released another techtree
This one is for the terran based units.
(This time i took your advice queen, and made the units have no bubble around them)
Note on similarities:
Intentionally, the lore takes place within the same universe, while not the same area, as the koprulu sector. Since Renegade Templar are somehow linked to the koprulu sector through an enigmatic past, the renegade templar can be called the forerunners to the dark templar. Also, the twilight gate is supposedly a "portal" through time and space that allows beings to travel through to those linked areas through a strange anomaly called twilight. Due to this, the Feralisk by definition is a Mutalisk that has been lost in these gates(Psionic power does not exist in twilight) and has come out as a Feralisk, an aggressive, uncontrolled version of the Mutalisk that is more easily manipulated by slayers.
Note on Marine Corp similarities: I intended marine corp to be more immediately connected to the Koprulu Sector, as recently as the Confederacy. They were sent out on a mission, and were lost to the Confederacy, so therein, they became their own. A nomad race that was able to survive on their own due to a colonist population. To avoid inbreeding for prolonged generations at a time, they develop many colonies on different worlds to promote cultural diversity. Just in case you were wondering.
Anyway, I am doing this alone, but we can correspond, if you want.
Well, I'm not sure what you mean by 'lotr' in this instance as I've seen many LOTR-themed maps - I have tried all of them, though. Some were crappy, some were well balanced and executed, but the theme felt horribly off in all of them.
That would work fine. Most of these simple 'alliances, heroes units' maps can be really great if executed well. As mentioned, I was a huge fan of the Silmarillion map in Warcraft III (and actually a Tolkien fan in general). Assuming the balance and polish is good, theme really is my only problem with the genre.
Ya, its pretty much everyone's, I think its the biggest problem with lotr maps. At least, however, some can ignore, or imagine it is lotr. And I feel yet another problem is the laggy environ, and as TheZizz once said, he gets 2 FPS in lotr games. I don't know how effective Kal's initial triggering was in most of them, but to say the least, there are WAY more triggers than an SC2 map should ever need, let alone have, perhaps because of the spawns. The best way would probably be to combine triggers for wotr, pre is fine, trop needs to reduce the global life of cannons and increase global life of units, and I can't say much for eriador or palamani's War in the South map.
Karawasa is 100% right. The fact that the theme is completely different is the main turn-off for me. I played LOTR maps in Warcraft III (specifically, I played a LOT of Silmarillion), but in SC it just isn't the same.
Okay, perhaps I am a little hasty to judge, but the ghost named frodo is just as much frodo and just as little frodo as the scaled down villager named frodo. Regardless, I feel that you really should not be playing lotr if you cant overlook theme, as this "theme" is not the main fun of the game.
Now, the lotr community is tight, and we all know each other by name and skill level. But I feel another turn off is the complication. The game is not an easy one to play. No matter how brilliant you are, you'll be confused by lotr on the first run through. Sure...the tips explain everything in detail...but who wants to read tips?
As they say, who reads the manual?
EDIT: Have you given lotr any chances as of yet Mozared or Karawasa? I do not believe the map is published in europe so you may be exempt Moz (Sorry :P), but Karawasa, have you bothered to try the map at all? A lot say they hate the theme, and then forget to try the map because they're busy hating the theme.
Lotr is fantasy. It simply does not fit in the Science Fiction genre. If it was Warcraft 3 or somethin' it would be a different story.
Everyone claims this, it is one of the most basic and common answers, but this just exemplifies the graphics craze. People really need to chill out and remember that the original blizzard client lotr games were for sc1, all wc3 lotr games pay credence to them. Also, for wc3, keep in mind that the graphics aren't that "lotr" either, they're warcraft graphics, and none of the models fit anyway. Lotr has always been about gameplay, and its fun because of its high skill ceiling.
In addition, the lotr game has a steadfast community with the birth of chat channels, allowing it to thrive since patch 1.2. However, to refuse to play a game because the theme does not "fit" is utterly ridiculous, since the true lotr spirit has always been in SC and never in WC.
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@wOlfLisK: Go
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Hi I made a thread but it didn't get too much attention, presumably because of the name. Due to this, I have decided to make another with a better title, this will be the link here. Thank you for watching.
0
Today I will be casting all night, and you may see some things you didn't know. For today, I am going to be doing the Fun or Nots all day and NEVER going to leave a single one, except in between to do maps with friends! Watch me if you like, I'll be hosting from
http:www.livestream.com/scdebates
0
@BloodyTurds: Go
Oh no...Not this...were you planning to make this yourself turds? This was posted a year ago on the hive, but after reading the whole post, I realized that you were unwilling to listen and change things based on what others said. This new race idea is halfassed and crap, it doesn't sound original, it just sounds desperate. When you come back with new original ideas, and a balanced layout then makes sense, then we'll talk. But right now, it just seems like another mod we dont need.
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Oh my god! You guys brought it sc2mapster! O_O *Drops Jaw, Cartoon style*
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You two squabble at strawmen while the real problem looms high above your heads... The big problem with the popularity system is simply that it works. It does what it intends to do. It's professional now, not the youtube but the hulu. Maps are now packaged and mapmakers limited. And it's all because of DoTA. Blizzard didn't see the golden cow, didn't think much of it. When it grew too big to control, and Blizzard lost money they could have made, they developed SC2 the way they did. It wasn't Kotick at all. I can bet you it wasn't. Point fingers at valve, Dota 2 caused this. Point fingers at icefrog. He caused this when he sold out. And most of all, point fingers at yourself, 'cause it's never entirely the other person's fault. Shame on you all, for thinking it's not your problem, it's everyone's problem. It's all our faults. You see, Blizzard knew that DoTA could not screw them out of all they could have made. The money they would have made off DoTA would be far more than WoW ever could have made them. They wanted the next big project under control, their control. And I promise you it isn't SOTIS. We've got a few gems in this incarnation of battle net, that's more than we could have bargained for. Of course, people don't give them the credit they deserve. Is it below you to do what Mephs did? Are you above Rodrigo, a better person than he is? Is Chirus' hard work deserving of no attention? Does Mafia deserve to be where debates should be? Does Power Level Overwhelming, an overlooked gem, deserve no attention cause it's creator has made no drama? Think about all this, and whatever answer you decide to use, you're wrong, think again, and then you'll be right.
0
SCDebates is hosting interviews with mappers! Come watch these interviews and learn more about your fellow mappers! If you would like, we can host you in an interview as well! Please notify me immediately if you wish to sign up. As of 8:30 EST, we are starting in 10 minutes.
@LaertesSC2: Go
To those confused, the interviews are not started, but will start momentarily, however, there has been a slight backup for the person i'm interviewing, please be patient.
0
exporting models? That's easy, BUT you have do it from the model previewer.
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@cstorm15: Go
I'll be honest, the object editor was a piece of shit created because of programming limits and lazyness on the part of blizzard in terms of creating a lasting engine. The Data Editor is far superior when used correctly. Its just most do not. Its far easier to learn triggers in a simple manner, then think you know what you're doing. This leads people to believe triggers are easier than data. This is wrong, data is just harder to jump into. Triggering, on the other hand, is much harder to master, just easier in entry level.
That's not the point though, unless you have the intelligence of a retarded monkey, you can work the data editor at a basic level. Just because its harder to have skillz doesn't mean its worse than the object, which was for those with mental capacity INFERIOR to retarded monkeys, no offense.
Point blank: The object editor was a limited tool, and now the limits have been removed, and all those retarded monkeys are having trouble. You need to just work at it, not everything you will get immediately.
0
I thought I'd make one of these threads cause they're fun :D
Favorites:
Lotr maps: I know its not "one map", but I really like lotr maps. From trop to wotr to south, i love lotr maps because of the immense possibilities (I like games like chess for similar reasons). I also really like the learning aspect of it, and games with all very well-learned players are amazing!
Debates: Aside from lotr maps, I also enjoy Debates, perhaps a little TOO much. Debates to me a unique map where you get to discuss ideas and be social, that's pretty fun. Imo, Debates deserves more attention than it gets, everyone who i introduce to Debates loves it, and admits they would not normally think it to be so much fun.
Share your favorite maps too!
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Kara, i still doubt you've played it before, although mozared has. You're referencing epic space battles, and saying "come up with a new theme", and trust me some will. To me, it doesn't matter what theme it should be, because the models will always be incorrect. Movies too. I now imagine nazgul as leviathans, and frodo as a ghost. That's ALRIGHT with me. But the extensive lore of the lotr universe makes it a prime target for the not one, but now FIVE maps based off of it, each with its own gameplay, timeline, feel, and units. Its hard to do a star wars map type thing, because the lore is so much less extensive. Anyway, people should NOT be limited by the theme of the game. It limits us so much in our ideas by saying models matter. This early, we should only worry about gameplay, ideas, etc. DO NOT LET THEME OR LACK THEREOF BOG YOU DOWN. The "all important theme" is totally dropped in lotr, which is an amazing game. Karawasa, in fact, totally misses what makes the game fun in his post of "epic space battles". He also hasn't flamed the game in any way yet, so I doubt he's played it.
0
Thanks queen, I have also finished and released another techtree
This one is for the terran based units. (This time i took your advice queen, and made the units have no bubble around them)
Note on similarities: Intentionally, the lore takes place within the same universe, while not the same area, as the koprulu sector. Since Renegade Templar are somehow linked to the koprulu sector through an enigmatic past, the renegade templar can be called the forerunners to the dark templar. Also, the twilight gate is supposedly a "portal" through time and space that allows beings to travel through to those linked areas through a strange anomaly called twilight. Due to this, the Feralisk by definition is a Mutalisk that has been lost in these gates(Psionic power does not exist in twilight) and has come out as a Feralisk, an aggressive, uncontrolled version of the Mutalisk that is more easily manipulated by slayers.
Note on Marine Corp similarities: I intended marine corp to be more immediately connected to the Koprulu Sector, as recently as the Confederacy. They were sent out on a mission, and were lost to the Confederacy, so therein, they became their own. A nomad race that was able to survive on their own due to a colonist population. To avoid inbreeding for prolonged generations at a time, they develop many colonies on different worlds to promote cultural diversity. Just in case you were wondering.
Anyway, I am doing this alone, but we can correspond, if you want.
0
Ya, its pretty much everyone's, I think its the biggest problem with lotr maps. At least, however, some can ignore, or imagine it is lotr. And I feel yet another problem is the laggy environ, and as TheZizz once said, he gets 2 FPS in lotr games. I don't know how effective Kal's initial triggering was in most of them, but to say the least, there are WAY more triggers than an SC2 map should ever need, let alone have, perhaps because of the spawns. The best way would probably be to combine triggers for wotr, pre is fine, trop needs to reduce the global life of cannons and increase global life of units, and I can't say much for eriador or palamani's War in the South map.
0
Okay, perhaps I am a little hasty to judge, but the ghost named frodo is just as much frodo and just as little frodo as the scaled down villager named frodo. Regardless, I feel that you really should not be playing lotr if you cant overlook theme, as this "theme" is not the main fun of the game.
Now, the lotr community is tight, and we all know each other by name and skill level. But I feel another turn off is the complication. The game is not an easy one to play. No matter how brilliant you are, you'll be confused by lotr on the first run through. Sure...the tips explain everything in detail...but who wants to read tips?
As they say, who reads the manual?
EDIT: Have you given lotr any chances as of yet Mozared or Karawasa? I do not believe the map is published in europe so you may be exempt Moz (Sorry :P), but Karawasa, have you bothered to try the map at all? A lot say they hate the theme, and then forget to try the map because they're busy hating the theme.
0
Everyone claims this, it is one of the most basic and common answers, but this just exemplifies the graphics craze. People really need to chill out and remember that the original blizzard client lotr games were for sc1, all wc3 lotr games pay credence to them. Also, for wc3, keep in mind that the graphics aren't that "lotr" either, they're warcraft graphics, and none of the models fit anyway. Lotr has always been about gameplay, and its fun because of its high skill ceiling.
In addition, the lotr game has a steadfast community with the birth of chat channels, allowing it to thrive since patch 1.2. However, to refuse to play a game because the theme does not "fit" is utterly ridiculous, since the true lotr spirit has always been in SC and never in WC.