I see there are other thread where people are looking for a partner; and for this very rare occurrence, I am looking to be a partner. I phrase it like this because I do not play ladder, or campaign, or co-op. I have very few ideas or goals towards a final product. I honestly don't even know what a "co-op commander" game is like. The extent of my knowledge of that you need to spread out your marines so banelings dont kill them all. I learned that while testing last months "monthly testing thread" game.
What I bring to the table: I am very good with triggers. I can create pretty good dialogs. I am good at data, making custom abilities and upgrades and such. Pretty much anything RPG related (using the built-in AI is something I have never looked at, but I can learn it fast; or just create my own AI for everything in the game, I have one of the few working hero AI systems in sc2).
the style of game I am looking for:
One where my abilities in the editor can shine. Depth, layers of customization. I want the game experience to have true options, bringing a player back to play it again and again. I don't know the main game storyline; but I want to have a unique twist on it. Something refreshing. An M. Night Shyamalan plot-twist.
The partner I am looking for: As I consider myself a 9/10 in triggers and an 8/10 in data, I am looking for someone who is equally skilled at story-writing, terraining, and has experience with actors. Eye candy. Also a huge plus if you have any notion of how triggers work; so I can set up systems, and you can fill in simple blanks (like transmissions, texts, icons, things related to story telling).
**Edit**
I feel it is important to note, that my interest is not in strictly following the guidelines put forth by Blizzard; but to make the best game of all the entries; win or lose. Anyone who is only looking at dollar signs, I am not the dood your looking for.
"I honestly don't even know what a "co-op commander" game is like."
- Lol than why the hell you want to take part in Coop-map contest?
There is no such thing like story-writing and story telling in coop mode. Only few briefing transsmisions, telling you what you have to do to win.
"my interest is not in strictly following the guidelines put forth by Blizzard"
- Guidelines put forth by Blizzard is guidelines to make map suitable in coop mode. Not following it, means you are making another game, which is not subject of the contest.
Thank you for pointing out that I was very clear in getting my point across. I am sure there are some people a little slower than you who may not have picked up on it.
Reading the 3 pages of "rules" set forth, I do not believe there are even a dozen possible variations of map that can fit within those insanely strict guidelines. In my opinion, it goes against everything that RTC is; and comes off more as an application to blizzard. "Look, I can make something exactly like the 50 other things just like this that blizzard has made."
I am against it. I am so against it, that I would like to make a map the fits the criteria just enough that they have to test it; and show that just about anything can be better than playing 50 do-overs of the same mission.
Well said Glorn i applaud you for your attitude. I feel the story has been quite generic in co-op. It will get repetitive after some time anyway! :D nevertheless why do the rules state: Story must be set bewteen Lotv mission one towards the epilogue?? Who ever did anything creative in life at least once will recognize that: if u put restrictions on yourself you are limiting your ideas.
And the mission mechanic has been stale as well. I miss the days when blizzard make creative maps like supernova and rest. Now its all: fetch this,destroy that. A kid of 10 years of age can come up with that.
I hope u do well and win the contest. Spark some flame into blizzards lame a**es!!!
Thank you for pointing out that I was very clear in getting my point across. I am sure there are some people a little slower than you who may not have picked up on it.
Reading the 3 pages of "rules" set forth, I do not believe there are even a dozen possible variations of map that can fit within those insanely strict guidelines. In my opinion, it goes against everything that RTC is; and comes off more as an application to blizzard. "Look, I can make something exactly like the 50 other things just like this that blizzard has made."
I am against it. I am so against it, that I would like to make a map the fits the criteria just enough that they have to test it; and show that just about anything can be better than playing 50 do-overs of the same mission.
What?
There are like 3 major limitations:
Maximum mission length: Missions should not go longer than 40 minutes.
Do not use mechanics which rely on specific commanders to function.
In terms of story, these missions take place during the war against Amon. This is after the second mission of Legacy of the Void, but before the Epilogue.
Everything else seems like good rules to follow in general while making maps, or rules to keep the map simple and clean.
Well said Glorn i applaud you for your attitude. I feel the story has been quite generic in co-op. It will get repetitive after some time anyway! :D nevertheless why do the rules state: Story must be set bewteen Lotv mission one towards the epilogue?? Who ever did anything creative in life at least once will recognize that: if u put restrictions on yourself you are limiting your ideas.
And the mission mechanic has been stale as well. I miss the days when blizzard make creative maps like supernova and rest. Now its all: fetch this,destroy that. A kid of 10 years of age can come up with that.
I hope u do well and win the contest. Spark some flame into blizzards lame a**es!!!
The problem is missions like supernova would be much better for some commanders like terran than zerg or toss, who would have to rebuild their structures at every major base.
Why do the rules state where the story must be set there? What exactly is wrong with a common theme between all the maps?
Yeah u are right about supernova. I didnt think about that at all.
But story wise it just sounds more interesting if it set differently. Would you like to read just one genre? Mixing it up and changing it is what gives it excitement and intrigue. We could have Ued comback, or a new mysterious enemy (race even?). So much and what do they give us? Amon? This one-dimensional paper thin persona. I didnt enjoy this silly character and they keep insisting as if he is a masterpiece like citizen kane or titanic.
IIf glorn can deliver a map that he envisioned i rather he gets employed at blizzard.
Yeah u are right about supernova. I didnt think about that at all.
But story wise it just sounds more interesting if it set differently. Would you like to read just one genre? Mixing it up and changing it is what gives it excitement and intrigue. We could have Ued comback, or a new mysterious enemy (race even?).
Problem: then how do you fight all three enemy races in that co-op? Do you have 3 enemies we can fight?
So much and what do they give us? Amon? This one-dimensional paper thin persona. I didnt enjoy this silly character and they keep insisting as if he is a masterpiece like citizen kane or titanic.
I seriously doubt they've insisted that. He's not even mentioned at all in Stetmann's or Donny's mission in fact, and it's pretty rare that he's mentioned in other missions. There are 3 missions that I can think of that he's name-dropped a ton (rifts to korhal, lock and load, void shuttles) (if you think he's everywhere in co-op, you don't actually play any co-op). He's more of a villain that exists for the armies he haves, rather than a villain on the field.
IIf glorn can deliver a map that he envisioned i rather he gets employed at blizzard.
Or he gets disqualified because it's a map that violates multiple principles.
Do realize almost 1.5 pages of the rules amount to: Don't make a map that will tank in performance.
I get this. I get that blizzard wants something very specific too. Look at the rules for all of the other RTC contests. They never had rules regulating the direction your ramps are facing; the types of shadows, the weather effects, the height of doodads.
If Blizzard follows the posted criteria, as they say they do, it is pretty obvious why they have such little variety. Their goal should be to increase their options, allowing them to be more unique going forward.
I would also like to point out, that blizzard even states that "theses are just guidelines" and that I will not be disqualified for not using them; I will just lose grading points.
Again, this is why I am posting a separate thread, and not offering to team up with people who have already posted to show interest in the contest. I have a different goal; and am looking for someone else who has that goal. If you do not agree with my opinion, that is fine; as it is just my opinion. I am not trying to alter anyone's opinion.
Lack of interest, not surprised. My plan is to still win one of the "this map is unique" prizes. After discussing the rules a bit with people (mostly eric) it seems the only hard-set rules (which might cause you to be disqualified) are that it must be in the starcraft universe, between 2 missions, it must be 2 player (and should require teamwork, and solo points) , and it must not lag to play.
Though there is a lot of suggested nonsense, (stuff that is required if you want to win the grand-prize, for a blizzard look-alike contest), there is still a lot of room within the rules to make an exceptional game. And I have been thinking of some neat ideas; and think I have a unique one.
MY unique idea, which anyone is free to use or modify or join me with: Opening the dark portal in wc3, combined with starcraft 2. "something something something protoss portal (giant beast from another dimension eating your souls)". every unit that dies goes to feed the portal (too many deaths early on, you lose) Portal can be destroyed by destroying base, or big boss spawns after certain time; strength based on souls fed to portal. Rescueable NPC units, who are killed if you dont save them in time; feeding the portal. Mini-bosses defending special enemy structures which can be destroyed, to remove (custom) upgrades from them, making the fight easier in specific ways; allowing each commander type to gain an advantage.
I gladly test the hell out of it. Im just curious blizzard hasnt mentioned it: What if the gameplay is to much mutator like? My guess is why they havent gone overboard with the map ideas is that they want to be able to inject mutators into these maps.
MY unique idea, which anyone is free to use or modify or join me with: Opening the dark portal in wc3, combined with starcraft 2. "something something something protoss portal (giant beast from another dimension eating your souls)". every unit that dies goes to feed the portal (too many deaths early on, you lose) Portal can be destroyed by destroying base, or big boss spawns after certain time; strength based on souls fed to portal. Rescueable NPC units, who are killed if you dont save them in time; feeding the portal. Mini-bosses defending special enemy structures which can be destroyed, to remove (custom) upgrades from them, making the fight easier in specific ways; allowing each commander type to gain an advantage.
I just want to give you a heads up that there is a commander that specializes in making many weak disposable and suicide units (Zagara) and there is another commander for who one of available game-play styles is to sacrifice his own units to gain an advantage (Alarak).
And from what I've seen the new Stukov commander attacks by sending to their deaths hundreds of infested, which wold die either way if not used due to timed life.
And there is yet another commander that specializes in making super costly yet super strong units that likely never die when supported (Nova).
Just something to keep in mind.. tho none of these are the required 3 base commanders from the template that we'll be getting.
Thanks for the heads up ducky. I was planning to make it based on supply count, would that work for the above commanders? So a zergling would be .5 while a carrier was 8, or whatever they are these days.
It would work for Stukov, but not Zagara. Zagara routinely throws away several hundred supply per game. She is specifically designed this way, with a supply cap of 100, but has access to free banelings, cheap zerglings that spawn fast, and scourge.
Also of consideration is Karax, who can win without building a single combat unit, since his design is around powerful top bar abilities, and the ability to instant build base defense, so he often offensively towers. So he would be an autowin against this mechanic. He often doesn't go above 50 supply.
Hmm, I see. I intend to see the concept through, and there is always a way. For the optional bad guy bases, destroying 1 could lower the amount of souls drained from your units dying, but cause the enemies to drain the soul of their own slain units. For karax, he cannot win any faster than a normal commander, right? I think I can come up with a separate objective for each commander, unique to their play style.
Depends on how Karax is played. Also depends on the mastery configuration for him. Karax by default has resilient units, but all his units cost 50% more. His masteries allow him to either reduce his units cost or increase his building HP.
He tends to do very well in any defense style mission, but can also be played as a slowly creeping tower offense. Often he can use the cover of his partners army to mass deploy cannons/monoliths in the middle of battle to win. Also, he routinely can clear any base defenses with his orbital strikes.
If the game ending is dependent on killing some kind of boss, Karax will probably just camp/cover the spawn area with towers and one shot the boss. You could make the boss a base killer, has been done before in mutators (mechanics that either disable or provide units that do far greater damage to structures).
Note however, that you probably don't need to take this into account since your idea could be valid against raynor/kerrigan/artanis, and could be tweaked to accomadate the other commanders. It is just some commanders have such weird playstyles, it sometimes is difficult to work around them (no army, disposable army, temp army, special forces army, hero only, all are here).
I really like the idea. It's something that hasn't been done before I'm co-op (and not even in blizzard's campaigns). Message me on discord if you want my voice acting involved. Can probably fine-detail the terrain if it's already done or at least outlined.
Sadly, without a partner who actually know about melee balance, This is not a project I can do. Having never played, I cannot create good waves, counters, ect. I can stack a wall of siege tanks and missile turrets, that is about it. I can create my concept, and anything unique needed, but I'd be painting with half the colors of the rainbow.
If anyone finishes their primary project and is interested in this concept, let me know. I assume it would only take a few weeks to finish. I am not interested in any winnings; just to make something unique.
First thread I've had time to read in a long while. Wish mapster was a more mature community. Would be cool if some of the mature active folks could ping mods to start hiding unproductive posts. At least that would move things in the right direction and maybe one day the majority of the reading would be worthwhile. I unfortunately don't have time to read kids arguing.
Hope you found a partner GlornII.
My 2 cents to the ones who don't see the value in someone who doesn't know co-op/ladder games: When building a team you want individuals who compliment one another. In this scenario GlornII would clearly be assisting a teammate to create their vision and they would be the one with the understanding of what is necessary and appropriate for a co-op game. This is why having an understanding of what his strengths are, which he explains in his original post, is valuable information. If you suck at any of the things which are his strengths, boom, you guys compliment each other great and would be a good duo.
One of the most powerful things you can do is admit to yourself and others what you aren't good at. Until you do this you can't know who compliments you well.
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Stuff I've worked on: Carbot's StarCrafts Mod (2014-present) StarCraft 2 Hotkey Trainer (2010) | Mineralz Evolution (2011+) | Dungeon Legacy (2013+) | Phoenix TLMC 4 Entry (2014) Assisted: City of Tempest (2012) | BarCraft (2013) | Poker Defense (2014) and a few more.
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I see there are other thread where people are looking for a partner; and for this very rare occurrence, I am looking to be a partner. I phrase it like this because I do not play ladder, or campaign, or co-op. I have very few ideas or goals towards a final product. I honestly don't even know what a "co-op commander" game is like. The extent of my knowledge of that you need to spread out your marines so banelings dont kill them all. I learned that while testing last months "monthly testing thread" game.
What I bring to the table:
I am very good with triggers. I can create pretty good dialogs. I am good at data, making custom abilities and upgrades and such. Pretty much anything RPG related (using the built-in AI is something I have never looked at, but I can learn it fast; or just create my own AI for everything in the game, I have one of the few working hero AI systems in sc2).
the style of game I am looking for:
One where my abilities in the editor can shine. Depth, layers of customization. I want the game experience to have true options, bringing a player back to play it again and again. I don't know the main game storyline; but I want to have a unique twist on it. Something refreshing. An M. Night Shyamalan plot-twist.
The partner I am looking for:
As I consider myself a 9/10 in triggers and an 8/10 in data, I am looking for someone who is equally skilled at story-writing, terraining, and has experience with actors. Eye candy. Also a huge plus if you have any notion of how triggers work; so I can set up systems, and you can fill in simple blanks (like transmissions, texts, icons, things related to story telling).
**Edit**
I feel it is important to note, that my interest is not in strictly following the guidelines put forth by Blizzard; but to make the best game of all the entries; win or lose. Anyone who is only looking at dollar signs, I am not the dood your looking for.
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
- Lol than why the hell you want to take part in Coop-map contest?
There is no such thing like story-writing and story telling in coop mode. Only few briefing transsmisions, telling you what you have to do to win.
- Guidelines put forth by Blizzard is guidelines to make map suitable in coop mode. Not following it, means you are making another game, which is not subject of the contest.
Thank you for pointing out that I was very clear in getting my point across. I am sure there are some people a little slower than you who may not have picked up on it.
Reading the 3 pages of "rules" set forth, I do not believe there are even a dozen possible variations of map that can fit within those insanely strict guidelines. In my opinion, it goes against everything that RTC is; and comes off more as an application to blizzard. "Look, I can make something exactly like the 50 other things just like this that blizzard has made."
I am against it. I am so against it, that I would like to make a map the fits the criteria just enough that they have to test it; and show that just about anything can be better than playing 50 do-overs of the same mission.
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
Well said Glorn i applaud you for your attitude. I feel the story has been quite generic in co-op. It will get repetitive after some time anyway! :D nevertheless why do the rules state: Story must be set bewteen Lotv mission one towards the epilogue?? Who ever did anything creative in life at least once will recognize that: if u put restrictions on yourself you are limiting your ideas.
And the mission mechanic has been stale as well. I miss the days when blizzard make creative maps like supernova and rest. Now its all: fetch this,destroy that. A kid of 10 years of age can come up with that.
I hope u do well and win the contest. Spark some flame into blizzards lame a**es!!!
Everything else seems like good rules to follow in general while making maps, or rules to keep the map simple and clean.
The condensed Custom Campaign Initiative is on this Google Sheet!
List of my Custom campaign text reviews (warning: only the first half of each is serious)
Yeah u are right about supernova. I didnt think about that at all.
But story wise it just sounds more interesting if it set differently. Would you like to read just one genre? Mixing it up and changing it is what gives it excitement and intrigue. We could have Ued comback, or a new mysterious enemy (race even?). So much and what do they give us? Amon? This one-dimensional paper thin persona. I didnt enjoy this silly character and they keep insisting as if he is a masterpiece like citizen kane or titanic.
IIf glorn can deliver a map that he envisioned i rather he gets employed at blizzard.
Problem: then how do you fight all three enemy races in that co-op? Do you have 3 enemies we can fight?
I seriously doubt they've insisted that. He's not even mentioned at all in Stetmann's or Donny's mission in fact, and it's pretty rare that he's mentioned in other missions. There are 3 missions that I can think of that he's name-dropped a ton (rifts to korhal, lock and load, void shuttles) (if you think he's everywhere in co-op, you don't actually play any co-op). He's more of a villain that exists for the armies he haves, rather than a villain on the field.
The condensed Custom Campaign Initiative is on this Google Sheet!
List of my Custom campaign text reviews (warning: only the first half of each is serious)
Do realize almost 1.5 pages of the rules amount to: Don't make a map that will tank in performance.
If Blizzard follows the posted criteria, as they say they do, it is pretty obvious why they have such little variety. Their goal should be to increase their options, allowing them to be more unique going forward.
I would also like to point out, that blizzard even states that "theses are just guidelines" and that I will not be disqualified for not using them; I will just lose grading points.
Again, this is why I am posting a separate thread, and not offering to team up with people who have already posted to show interest in the contest. I have a different goal; and am looking for someone else who has that goal. If you do not agree with my opinion, that is fine; as it is just my opinion. I am not trying to alter anyone's opinion.
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
Lack of interest, not surprised. My plan is to still win one of the "this map is unique" prizes. After discussing the rules a bit with people (mostly eric) it seems the only hard-set rules (which might cause you to be disqualified) are that it must be in the starcraft universe, between 2 missions, it must be 2 player (and should require teamwork, and solo points) , and it must not lag to play.
Though there is a lot of suggested nonsense, (stuff that is required if you want to win the grand-prize, for a blizzard look-alike contest), there is still a lot of room within the rules to make an exceptional game. And I have been thinking of some neat ideas; and think I have a unique one.
MY unique idea, which anyone is free to use or modify or join me with:
Opening the dark portal in wc3, combined with starcraft 2. "something something something protoss portal (giant beast from another dimension eating your souls)". every unit that dies goes to feed the portal (too many deaths early on, you lose) Portal can be destroyed by destroying base, or big boss spawns after certain time; strength based on souls fed to portal. Rescueable NPC units, who are killed if you dont save them in time; feeding the portal. Mini-bosses defending special enemy structures which can be destroyed, to remove (custom) upgrades from them, making the fight easier in specific ways; allowing each commander type to gain an advantage.
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
I gladly test the hell out of it. Im just curious blizzard hasnt mentioned it: What if the gameplay is to much mutator like? My guess is why they havent gone overboard with the map ideas is that they want to be able to inject mutators into these maps.
Thanks for the heads up ducky. I was planning to make it based on supply count, would that work for the above commanders? So a zergling would be .5 while a carrier was 8, or whatever they are these days.
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
It would work for Stukov, but not Zagara. Zagara routinely throws away several hundred supply per game. She is specifically designed this way, with a supply cap of 100, but has access to free banelings, cheap zerglings that spawn fast, and scourge.
Also of consideration is Karax, who can win without building a single combat unit, since his design is around powerful top bar abilities, and the ability to instant build base defense, so he often offensively towers. So he would be an autowin against this mechanic. He often doesn't go above 50 supply.
Hmm, I see. I intend to see the concept through, and there is always a way. For the optional bad guy bases, destroying 1 could lower the amount of souls drained from your units dying, but cause the enemies to drain the soul of their own slain units. For karax, he cannot win any faster than a normal commander, right? I think I can come up with a separate objective for each commander, unique to their play style.
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
Depends on how Karax is played. Also depends on the mastery configuration for him. Karax by default has resilient units, but all his units cost 50% more. His masteries allow him to either reduce his units cost or increase his building HP.
He tends to do very well in any defense style mission, but can also be played as a slowly creeping tower offense. Often he can use the cover of his partners army to mass deploy cannons/monoliths in the middle of battle to win. Also, he routinely can clear any base defenses with his orbital strikes.
If the game ending is dependent on killing some kind of boss, Karax will probably just camp/cover the spawn area with towers and one shot the boss. You could make the boss a base killer, has been done before in mutators (mechanics that either disable or provide units that do far greater damage to structures).
Note however, that you probably don't need to take this into account since your idea could be valid against raynor/kerrigan/artanis, and could be tweaked to accomadate the other commanders. It is just some commanders have such weird playstyles, it sometimes is difficult to work around them (no army, disposable army, temp army, special forces army, hero only, all are here).
I really like the idea. It's something that hasn't been done before I'm co-op (and not even in blizzard's campaigns). Message me on discord if you want my voice acting involved. Can probably fine-detail the terrain if it's already done or at least outlined.
My YouTube | My SoundCloud | My Twitter
Sadly, without a partner who actually know about melee balance, This is not a project I can do. Having never played, I cannot create good waves, counters, ect. I can stack a wall of siege tanks and missile turrets, that is about it. I can create my concept, and anything unique needed, but I'd be painting with half the colors of the rainbow.
If anyone finishes their primary project and is interested in this concept, let me know. I assume it would only take a few weeks to finish. I am not interested in any winnings; just to make something unique.
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
First thread I've had time to read in a long while. Wish mapster was a more mature community. Would be cool if some of the mature active folks could ping mods to start hiding unproductive posts. At least that would move things in the right direction and maybe one day the majority of the reading would be worthwhile. I unfortunately don't have time to read kids arguing.
Hope you found a partner GlornII.
My 2 cents to the ones who don't see the value in someone who doesn't know co-op/ladder games: When building a team you want individuals who compliment one another. In this scenario GlornII would clearly be assisting a teammate to create their vision and they would be the one with the understanding of what is necessary and appropriate for a co-op game. This is why having an understanding of what his strengths are, which he explains in his original post, is valuable information. If you suck at any of the things which are his strengths, boom, you guys compliment each other great and would be a good duo.
One of the most powerful things you can do is admit to yourself and others what you aren't good at. Until you do this you can't know who compliments you well.
Stuff I've worked on:
Carbot's StarCrafts Mod (2014-present) StarCraft 2 Hotkey Trainer (2010) | Mineralz Evolution (2011+) | Dungeon Legacy (2013+) | Phoenix TLMC 4 Entry (2014) Assisted: City of Tempest (2012) | BarCraft (2013) | Poker Defense (2014) and a few more.