How can armor penetration be done? I've tried triggers and also can't find anything in the data editor. Thing that really bugs me is you can't utilize up the 'life armor' of a unit in triggers.
Armor penetration would come in handy for the game I'm making, as I could finally look more into adding items that can manipulate a units armor (the armor system in SC2 can really cause some balance issues).
Yes I understand that (which that flat damage reduction is kinda annoying btw). Penetration would mean flat out damage increase as long as it hasn't pierced through more armor than the unit has. For example: if the attacking unit has +20 Armor pen, but the unit taking damage has 10 armor, it should only 20 +10 damage. But I cannot access armor through triggers to make this kind of equation.
hmm that would work to an extent. The only reason that can't work is that is literally adding extra damage. If I give a unit +20 armor pen that way, then even if a unit only has 10 armor then the first unit will still do an extra 10 damage that shouldn't be there. Is there any way to call upon the armor property of a unit through triggers (i know there isn't in GUI, but maybe script?)
Ok, so it's not *bonus* damage that is armor penetrating; you're converting some damage to armor penetrating damage?
In that case, one trick would be to create an "Armor Penetration" upgrade with however many levels you have of different counts of armor penetration. So for example, if you have armor penetration in increments of 5, you'd have one max level for each 5 penetrating damage. Then you do what I suggested above - giving each relevant attack a second damage effect that defaults to 0 (but is not reduced by armor), but the upgrade would subtract 5 from the base damage and add 5 to armor penetrable damage for each level.
Then with triggers, you just change the upgrade level for that player as you please.
how would I do the subtraction from the regular attack?
and yes, that is pretty much genius :D
EDIT: K so I was looking at the upgrade data to see how to do it... And it makes sense. Problem is: making it more global. Or do I really have to plug in every attack for any unit I want to have armor pen?
hmm yeah this could work though. Problem is I would literally have to add each damage effect to subtract from. The addition of the armor penetration effect is more global though. I'll try this for now (at least it does something like armor pen), but if anybody has perfected it that would be great.
The concept of armor penetration is not that hard to grasp, everybody. Unit 1 has 5 armor. Unit 2 does 6 damage, but since unit 1 has 5 armor it really only does 1 damage. But if the attack was armor penetrating, it would do all 6 damage. Comprende? Anyway...don't know how to help you tho, take this response as a bump.
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Tried giving units 0 armor and adding it using a stacking buff that recharges instantly unless the unit is being targeted (disables applicatior of behaviour), the attacking unit then removes x stacks from the target before damage calculation?
couldnt you create a "switch effect" that validates how much armor a unit has...
Armor in SC2 isnt really armor ... Its damage reduction
What you could try is not using the units "built-in" armor ... and instead use behaviors on the units to handle armor then that armor behavior can function like armor from wc3
so Armor behavior = 1% damage reduction (make it so this behavior is stackable up to 100 stacks = 100% damage reductions.
Then your "armor deduction effect" can basically remove these damage reduction stacks before applying damage.
so unit has 20 stacks of armor = 20% damage reduction
Unit has a sunder armor item equiped that on hit removed 5 % armor which basically would remove 5 stacks of the armor behavior from the unit....
I dunno thats just a thought ... ive seen some in depth armor guild for somebody doing it like this.
I'm not too skilled with the data editor, and that person's guide is somewhat confusing to me. I understand the concept, but am limited by my ability. How do you do what you say?
How can armor penetration be done? I've tried triggers and also can't find anything in the data editor. Thing that really bugs me is you can't utilize up the 'life armor' of a unit in triggers.
Armor penetration would come in handy for the game I'm making, as I could finally look more into adding items that can manipulate a units armor (the armor system in SC2 can really cause some balance issues).
@thromshall: Go
What do you mean by armor penetration ? The game use flat reduction armor, which penetration is a flat out damage increase.
@progammer: Go
Yes I understand that (which that flat damage reduction is kinda annoying btw). Penetration would mean flat out damage increase as long as it hasn't pierced through more armor than the unit has. For example: if the attacking unit has +20 Armor pen, but the unit taking damage has 10 armor, it should only 20 +10 damage. But I cannot access armor through triggers to make this kind of equation.
@thromshall: Go
bump
Fix`d.
Sorry, Couldn`t resist;p
@EternalWraith: Go
hmm yes but a fix to my problem would be more than amazing ;D
So by armor penetration, do you mean BONUS armor penetrating damage? I see you describing it as stuff like an unit being given "+20 armor pen".
Then just give the attack an extra damage effect that has 0 armor reduction (that is, armor doesn't reduce how much damage the effect deals).
Thus, an unit with 10 + 20 armor pen would first deal 10 damage reducible by armor then deal 20 non-reduced damage. Is that how you want it done?
@OneSoga: Go
hmm that would work to an extent. The only reason that can't work is that is literally adding extra damage. If I give a unit +20 armor pen that way, then even if a unit only has 10 armor then the first unit will still do an extra 10 damage that shouldn't be there. Is there any way to call upon the armor property of a unit through triggers (i know there isn't in GUI, but maybe script?)
Ok, so it's not *bonus* damage that is armor penetrating; you're converting some damage to armor penetrating damage?
In that case, one trick would be to create an "Armor Penetration" upgrade with however many levels you have of different counts of armor penetration. So for example, if you have armor penetration in increments of 5, you'd have one max level for each 5 penetrating damage. Then you do what I suggested above - giving each relevant attack a second damage effect that defaults to 0 (but is not reduced by armor), but the upgrade would subtract 5 from the base damage and add 5 to armor penetrable damage for each level.
Then with triggers, you just change the upgrade level for that player as you please.
Get it? Mathematically, it all still adds up.
@OneSoga: Go
how would I do the subtraction from the regular attack?
and yes, that is pretty much genius :D
EDIT: K so I was looking at the upgrade data to see how to do it... And it makes sense. Problem is: making it more global. Or do I really have to plug in every attack for any unit I want to have armor pen?
Anyone else got a better solution?
@OneSoga: Go
hmm yeah this could work though. Problem is I would literally have to add each damage effect to subtract from. The addition of the armor penetration effect is more global though. I'll try this for now (at least it does something like armor pen), but if anybody has perfected it that would be great.
bump.
Please anybody?
The concept of armor penetration is not that hard to grasp, everybody. Unit 1 has 5 armor. Unit 2 does 6 damage, but since unit 1 has 5 armor it really only does 1 damage. But if the attack was armor penetrating, it would do all 6 damage. Comprende? Anyway...don't know how to help you tho, take this response as a bump.
@zeldarules28: Go
yet another bump
Tried giving units 0 armor and adding it using a stacking buff that recharges instantly unless the unit is being targeted (disables applicatior of behaviour), the attacking unit then removes x stacks from the target before damage calculation?
Contribute to the wiki (Wiki button at top of page) Considered easy altering of the unit textures?
https://www.sc2mapster.com/forums/resources/tutorials/179654-data-actor-events-message-texture-select-by-id
https://media.forgecdn.net/attachments/187/40/Screenshot2011-04-17_09_16_21.jpg
@DrSuperEvil: Go
couldnt you create a "switch effect" that validates how much armor a unit has...
Armor in SC2 isnt really armor ... Its damage reduction
What you could try is not using the units "built-in" armor ... and instead use behaviors on the units to handle armor then that armor behavior can function like armor from wc3
so Armor behavior = 1% damage reduction (make it so this behavior is stackable up to 100 stacks = 100% damage reductions. Then your "armor deduction effect" can basically remove these damage reduction stacks before applying damage.
so unit has 20 stacks of armor = 20% damage reduction
Unit has a sunder armor item equiped that on hit removed 5 % armor which basically would remove 5 stacks of the armor behavior from the unit....
I dunno thats just a thought ... ive seen some in depth armor guild for somebody doing it like this.
Heres the link
http://forums.sc2mapster.com/resources/tutorials/9853-triggers-data-warcraft-3-armor-system/
I'm not too skilled with the data editor, and that person's guide is somewhat confusing to me. I understand the concept, but am limited by my ability. How do you do what you say?
how would you make an attack that hurt the units HP but not its shield?
@Reaper872: Go
not quite sure, but you could try a trigger that restores the shield equal to the damage amount.