Hello all! I've been making a map with epic fleet battles, and I've run into a somewhat unique problem. I have an upgraded battlecruiser (A Battleship) with two kinds of weapons, a forward firing main cannon, and then the AA turrets. Both weapons are firing (The turret weapons can shoot while moving, which looks amazing).
However, the problem is that when the battleship is facing one direction, say to the right (of the screen), and I tell him to attack a target directly below him, he only turns enough to shoot at it with the turret weapons. If that wasnt clear enough, the problem is that he will attack, and will do so with both weapons, but he will not turn to face the target so long as the turrets, which have an arc of fire, can fire. (The main gun only fires straight forward).
I was able to fix this by changing the turret weapons so that they couldn't acquire a target, however the main gun cannot target certain things, so when those things attack him I have to manually turn him with a move order to face the target. (He also tries to flee, I thought he had the no flee flag on, but whatever...).
Is there some way I can set a priority for the weapons, or make it so that he will turn to face his target no mater what? Thanks everyone!
I'm kind of curious how you managed to get the unit to fire any more than one weapon at a time to begin with. Incidentally I have a mega cruiser that has three weapons currently; two beam cannons (one on either side) and a frontal bolter cannon. When the ship moves both side guns will fire at will, but when standing still only a single weapon of any type will fire; either the bolter or just one of the beam cannons.
If I could fix that I'd then try to tackle the problem of the primary firing arc... but yeah, even with linked cooldown and such turned off they do not want to co-operate.
I'd also like to know if you can force a unit to go broadside.
I looked a lot on these forums to figure it out, so if I can't help you then look around, it's on here. You don't mention the "backswing" of your weapons anywhere. Under the weapon itself (you have to have the advanced fields showing), there is something called backswing. Make all of your weapons backswing 0. It's essentially a cooldown, and when it expires all weapons stop, and only your faster weapons (most likely, but not always) will be able to fire.
I'll have to try this when I have some free time, thanks! If this works I'll see if I can figure out how arc priorities are set or even if they can be changed. I'll need my ship to face its primary target at least. So far it doesn't do that. Maybe you have to force it somehow...
Changing the backswing to 0 did not fix the problem, unfortunately. Here's my observations.
My unit will always turn to face a target if it isn't in the arc of the main weapon. If the beam weapon is firing during this period then that is all that will fire. I saw it fire the bolter cannon a single time only once. In most instances only the beam fires. If the bolter weapon fires first then it continues to fire with no other weapon firing. If I have the unit move around both beam weapons will acquire their targets and fire as it moves (the bolt cannon cannot fire while moving).
The fact that it turns to face the target regardless of the weapon firing is weird. Even weirder is that the beam weapon arcs should not allow them to fire much less do damage at frontal targets, but if it's firing and faces a target the beam will clip through the unit and continue to do damage to its target.
I know that doesn't help you much... but eh.
The main weapon is set to only fire at attack target if it makes a difference.
Ah ok, I see your problem now. I ran across this problem. I don't really understand how this works, but it sounds like you need a weapon set. There was another post about this...
Download zifoons map, go into the data editor, and set it to only show stuff from that map. For his carrier you can see the effect "Carrier - Simultaneous Attacks." Hope that helps.
I'd be interested in looking at your map when you have it ready =)
I have a theory as to why the unit doesn't face with the one weapon if this works how I think it does. Keep in mind that I have zero idea how sc2 works yet, but I think that the reason it isn't facing is because the firing arc for the smaller guns is within range and the unit thinks that because those are within range and it can shoot with those that it doesn't need to use anything else. It qualifies for attacking with the weapon because the weapon thinks it's facing the target and firing when in reality only one of its weapons is firing - it probably doesn't care or differ between them.
Ok that's kind of a bad way of explaining it but I think the weapon set itself is the cause of the unit not turning to face with everything. I'll have a look when I modify my weapons and see if that's what happens.
Again, not being very experienced with the editor, if this is indeed why I can think of two immediate solutions;
- Spawning the additional weapons as individual units/turrets (I think site ops is used for that, right?). Think Uberlisk tentacles.
- Using the Actor to somehow detect targets or heading or something when it stops to engage and having it turn to face its target? I don't know if actors are even capable of doing that... but it's a thought (and would also make broadside possible I think as well).
The units I'm making aren't for any individual map but eventually for global use in a campaign. I can show you them whenever I get them to a reasonable state of functionality... which probably won't be for a while, heh.
I could see how the weapon set would be the problem, but before I had that it simply wouldn't fire both weapons at all. If any one thing in this problem were less complex, it could be easily solved... But I'm adamant that this is how I want the ship to work.
I believe the way the Uberlisk works, you can't order attacks with its tentacles at all. They just fire at things. I already had something like that when I changed the turrets so they couldnt acquire a target. The problem then was that my main gun can't target light units (you don't use a battleships large guns to shoot at a row boat, or even a fighter, for that matter), so when only light units were around, he would just run away, even though I could manually face him to the fighters, and he could fire. When I right clicked on light units, it told me I couldnt attack them...
At this point, I think I am going to look at triggers to solve this.
Yeah... that would be a problem. I don't think you can modify unit AI, can you? Kind of one of the things I was a little worried about with sc2 was dealing with unit AI, which is probably still largely hardcoded from the sounds of it, other than forcing things.
I think Actors can communicate with each other though, can't they? Would there be any way to detect when the small guns have acquired something they would send something to the main unit that prevents it from fleeing or somesuch?
I dunno, this reminds of a lot of the confusing mechanical issues I ran into brood war. I couldn't solve most of them.
I'll probably get my weapon set sorted today and try to figure out how this is working.
I've had little luck with triggers so far. I can make the ship face the target, but then he keeps doing over and over without firing... maybe I just need to change one thing, we'll see. I think triggers would be a powerful choice for making your ship do something like a broadside, but only if we can make it work. I'll update later with some progress.
Hi, sorry for the really late reply. The editor corrupted the map with my ship concepts on it and I haven't had time to make effort to rebuild them yet, but I plan to do so in the future and continue research on this subject.
I don't think I had that flag on but I can't check now. :\
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Hello all! I've been making a map with epic fleet battles, and I've run into a somewhat unique problem. I have an upgraded battlecruiser (A Battleship) with two kinds of weapons, a forward firing main cannon, and then the AA turrets. Both weapons are firing (The turret weapons can shoot while moving, which looks amazing). However, the problem is that when the battleship is facing one direction, say to the right (of the screen), and I tell him to attack a target directly below him, he only turns enough to shoot at it with the turret weapons. If that wasnt clear enough, the problem is that he will attack, and will do so with both weapons, but he will not turn to face the target so long as the turrets, which have an arc of fire, can fire. (The main gun only fires straight forward). I was able to fix this by changing the turret weapons so that they couldn't acquire a target, however the main gun cannot target certain things, so when those things attack him I have to manually turn him with a move order to face the target. (He also tries to flee, I thought he had the no flee flag on, but whatever...). Is there some way I can set a priority for the weapons, or make it so that he will turn to face his target no mater what? Thanks everyone!
I'm kind of curious how you managed to get the unit to fire any more than one weapon at a time to begin with. Incidentally I have a mega cruiser that has three weapons currently; two beam cannons (one on either side) and a frontal bolter cannon. When the ship moves both side guns will fire at will, but when standing still only a single weapon of any type will fire; either the bolter or just one of the beam cannons.
If I could fix that I'd then try to tackle the problem of the primary firing arc... but yeah, even with linked cooldown and such turned off they do not want to co-operate.
I'd also like to know if you can force a unit to go broadside.
@ Iskatu
I looked a lot on these forums to figure it out, so if I can't help you then look around, it's on here. You don't mention the "backswing" of your weapons anywhere. Under the weapon itself (you have to have the advanced fields showing), there is something called backswing. Make all of your weapons backswing 0. It's essentially a cooldown, and when it expires all weapons stop, and only your faster weapons (most likely, but not always) will be able to fire.
@Arcticfox117: Go
I'll have to try this when I have some free time, thanks! If this works I'll see if I can figure out how arc priorities are set or even if they can be changed. I'll need my ship to face its primary target at least. So far it doesn't do that. Maybe you have to force it somehow...
Changing the backswing to 0 did not fix the problem, unfortunately. Here's my observations.
My unit will always turn to face a target if it isn't in the arc of the main weapon. If the beam weapon is firing during this period then that is all that will fire. I saw it fire the bolter cannon a single time only once. In most instances only the beam fires. If the bolter weapon fires first then it continues to fire with no other weapon firing. If I have the unit move around both beam weapons will acquire their targets and fire as it moves (the bolt cannon cannot fire while moving).
The fact that it turns to face the target regardless of the weapon firing is weird. Even weirder is that the beam weapon arcs should not allow them to fire much less do damage at frontal targets, but if it's firing and faces a target the beam will clip through the unit and continue to do damage to its target.
I know that doesn't help you much... but eh.
The main weapon is set to only fire at attack target if it makes a difference.
Ah ok, I see your problem now. I ran across this problem. I don't really understand how this works, but it sounds like you need a weapon set. There was another post about this...
http://forums.sc2mapster.com/development/map-development/1949-complicated-problems-with-my-hero-weapons/#p5
Download zifoons map, go into the data editor, and set it to only show stuff from that map. For his carrier you can see the effect "Carrier - Simultaneous Attacks." Hope that helps.
I'd be interested in looking at your map when you have it ready =)
Interesting, I'll give a look at this.
I have a theory as to why the unit doesn't face with the one weapon if this works how I think it does. Keep in mind that I have zero idea how sc2 works yet, but I think that the reason it isn't facing is because the firing arc for the smaller guns is within range and the unit thinks that because those are within range and it can shoot with those that it doesn't need to use anything else. It qualifies for attacking with the weapon because the weapon thinks it's facing the target and firing when in reality only one of its weapons is firing - it probably doesn't care or differ between them.
Ok that's kind of a bad way of explaining it but I think the weapon set itself is the cause of the unit not turning to face with everything. I'll have a look when I modify my weapons and see if that's what happens.
Again, not being very experienced with the editor, if this is indeed why I can think of two immediate solutions;
- Spawning the additional weapons as individual units/turrets (I think site ops is used for that, right?). Think Uberlisk tentacles.
- Using the Actor to somehow detect targets or heading or something when it stops to engage and having it turn to face its target? I don't know if actors are even capable of doing that... but it's a thought (and would also make broadside possible I think as well).
The units I'm making aren't for any individual map but eventually for global use in a campaign. I can show you them whenever I get them to a reasonable state of functionality... which probably won't be for a while, heh.
I could see how the weapon set would be the problem, but before I had that it simply wouldn't fire both weapons at all. If any one thing in this problem were less complex, it could be easily solved... But I'm adamant that this is how I want the ship to work.
I believe the way the Uberlisk works, you can't order attacks with its tentacles at all. They just fire at things. I already had something like that when I changed the turrets so they couldnt acquire a target. The problem then was that my main gun can't target light units (you don't use a battleships large guns to shoot at a row boat, or even a fighter, for that matter), so when only light units were around, he would just run away, even though I could manually face him to the fighters, and he could fire. When I right clicked on light units, it told me I couldnt attack them...
At this point, I think I am going to look at triggers to solve this.
Yeah... that would be a problem. I don't think you can modify unit AI, can you? Kind of one of the things I was a little worried about with sc2 was dealing with unit AI, which is probably still largely hardcoded from the sounds of it, other than forcing things.
I think Actors can communicate with each other though, can't they? Would there be any way to detect when the small guns have acquired something they would send something to the main unit that prevents it from fleeing or somesuch?
I dunno, this reminds of a lot of the confusing mechanical issues I ran into brood war. I couldn't solve most of them.
I'll probably get my weapon set sorted today and try to figure out how this is working.
I've had little luck with triggers so far. I can make the ship face the target, but then he keeps doing over and over without firing... maybe I just need to change one thing, we'll see. I think triggers would be a powerful choice for making your ship do something like a broadside, but only if we can make it work. I'll update later with some progress.
Mmm, couldn't your problem just be solved turning the weapon option "Only fire at attack target" off for all weapons?
@Arcticfox117: Go
Hi, sorry for the really late reply. The editor corrupted the map with my ship concepts on it and I haven't had time to make effort to rebuild them yet, but I plan to do so in the future and continue research on this subject.
I don't think I had that flag on but I can't check now. :\