You're too hard on yourself. Everyone starts somewhere! The best thing about this community is that most people want to share their knowledge. I'll play your campaign once it's done and you have a version out you'd be comfortable with me putting on youtube.
Yeah, I'll definitely need help getting any references I may have missed in AE09... Most of the music was used in previous missions, "Khaal-Ro courtesy", and of course GOT 'EM :) (not really a PS reference though). Otherwise, I was very focused on not losing and probably missed a bunch.
I answered someone who asked on my channel, but you should be asking the mapmaker not me! He just hasn't uploaded it to the Arcade yet because he's been very busy.
I think we have an opportunity with LotV coming up and we shouldn't blow it. There will be 2-3 months of hype where Reddit, TL, and Battle.net forums will explode with traffic before dipping again and we should capitalize on it to get people interested. It really would not be time consuming or hard work if people take their excitement and attempt to branch it out to these other, larger forums!
Meanwhile, it's important to get organized and keep discussing ways we can get more exposure to the scene. Iguana and EivindL are completely correct about coming at this from a positive perspective. Rather than commenting on what we don't have, we should reflect on what we do have that is working well and then figure out how to expand on it and push it out to people who want to experience it, but have otherwise not heard about it.
I can try messaging Lowko on YouTube... YT has notoriously poor private messaging though. Is he on Twitter? That may be the best way to get his attention. I agree, he is one of the best analytical casters these days and has quite the following.
I haven't finished mission 09 yet, but I want to take a shot on how I think the ending will go:
Sppppppppooilers!
The dream team pulls through in taking down Geraldus, probably with some big twist/reveal about Corelia and/or Janus and possibly the Khaal-Ro realizing they've been duped. But, with EivindL being EivindL, the ending will be bittersweet because the remaining characters realize that Geraldus, with all it's might, money, and firepower, was the only group able to keep the Zerg suppressed in the sector. Our "protagonists" fight and win against the oppressive, corporate, wild-west system of government only to realize that now they've pushed themselves into a worse position of anarchy.
It's crazy to think this is all getting wrapped up very soon! I'm anxious to see how everything will get resolved in the final 2 missions remaining.
Not tooting my own horn here (honest) - I do get messages on a consistent basis from viewers who say they have found/played campaigns after watching them on my channel. You're absolutely right about advertisement. I'm curious to know if anyone saw a meager bump in downloads after any showcases I've done. I know there are people out there that want to play the campaigns that are available - I think it's safe to say that a huge swath of people buying LotV are purchasing it just for the campaign and if they like the Blizzard campaign, I'm certain that they would enjoy the likes of Crimson Moon, Bio-Tech, Brood's Wrath, etc, etc (randomly chosen campaigns here, you know I love you all). Reaching these people is the key! The Starcraft subreddit sort of sucks and is full of elitists, but I think there is a silent majority there that really would like this stuff.
Finding that gateway is something we could all do something small to contribute to, whether it's sharing the CCI/SC2Mapster on Facebook, Reddit, or what have you. Sharing my and others' videos also could open the door more effectively since folks can actually see what these campaigns are before they're instantly turned off by the "complex" installations. We could always use more showcasing from others and I'd be down for some collaboration as well! Obviously, we know it's not hard to install this stuff, but to a new person, they may click away since it only takes a split second for these people to lose interest.
Hock demonstrates a great point with how the scene appears fragmented back in 2013, but once he took the initiative and organized the CCI forum page, things noticeably picked up. If we can give the appearance of excitement and organization, people will come. We live in the clickbait age and maybe that's what we need to be doing on TL and Reddit to get people interested enough to pay us a visit. I'm willing to make a separate installation video for each and every campaign that's out there even if they are all basically the same thing if you all think it could help.
It's also sort of a chicken or the egg scenario... Which comes first? Creators making awesome maps to draw a big crowd? Or a crowd that gives creators an incentive to actually make maps?
Let's not kid ourselves... while there are some really great people out there that make maps for themselves as a hobby, we all know that people want their maps played and to bathe in that sweet, sweet positive feedback. WC3 seems to still have that base that plays/gives feedback and it's hard to pinpoint why we don't... it seems that building a community has to happen in tandem with cool maps being made. We definitely already have cool maps though, so I think it's about exposure.
I want to preempt any argument someone wants to make about money... After the whole DotA fiasco, Blizzard now retains ownership of anything people make as part of their ToS and some would say this pushed mapmakers away. I couldn't disagree with this more - most SC1 custom content was free and not monetized.
I find the major problem has to do with the UI of the Arcade and the complexity of the map editor. We can sort of blame Blizzard for not pushing the Arcade harder and trying more UI updates for it, but they provided us with a VERY powerful tool to make maps. It's so powerful such that the barrier to entry is now much higher than SC1 and WC3 and less people are willing to try making things. I was using the SC1 Editor when I was 12... I couldn't imagine using the SC2 Editor at that age.
That makes the issues with the custom scene much more complex because everyone is looking to blame Blizzard when maybe they should blame themselves... they need to try to make something or, more importantly, actually open the Arcade and play something. I can guarantee that at least 75% of the people complaining don't play on the Arcade at all and there are some really quality maps on there.
The campaign scene in particular is harder to pin down, but I still think it's mostly the editor complexity and depth. It allows creators to dream big... they get started and then things start getting hairy because of the shear amount of things they'll have to learn. Look how many abandoned projects we have here that demonstrates this point! With the older game editors, the limitations were clear and it stopped creators from getting too ambitious too fast.
I'd love to see campaign support like we had in WC3 though. Even so, SC1 had a huge modding community and there was no support from Blizzard in that era, so I don't believe direct campaign support as much of an issue as some would believe (but it would help and be great to have). I think the excitement has simply been lost since Brood War. Many creators from the older era have grown up and newer players looking for content are lazy.
While I'm not opposed to removing CM10, I liked the escort part. It was challenging in a unique way and rewarding to complete. If others found it too hard, I can see why they wouldn't like it.
Yeah, pre-order sales are crazy, especially on Amazon. They usually have well-known things up for pre-order months in advance, maybe even a year. They just put up a placeholder item on the page anticipating that they will be selling that item upon release so they can lock in the sales. I don't know how legit this is on other sites, but Amazon is trustworthy for this type of practice.
Nah, that's legit on Amazon. I'm pretty sure the physical box versions of the game are only sold through 3rd party retailers. Blizzard will only sell you a direct download on Battle.net - if you want the box you'll have to get it at Gamestop, Amazon, etc.
Most people here know how into Starcraft I am, but it always amazes me how deeply people think about these cinematics. They are for viewing pleasure. I've enjoyed all of them because they give the tinglies and that's about as much as they're worth. Just always keep in mind these videos, and the game as a whole, are all about fun, plain and simple. You watch, say "that was cool!", and then buy the game.
I've got people on my channel who argue with each other about these crazy lore conjectures, SC1 vs SC2, etc etc on my old WoO videos from months ago and it boggles my mind that they're still at it.
0
@ksnumedia: Go
You're too hard on yourself. Everyone starts somewhere! The best thing about this community is that most people want to share their knowledge. I'll play your campaign once it's done and you have a version out you'd be comfortable with me putting on youtube.
0
Yeah, I'll definitely need help getting any references I may have missed in AE09... Most of the music was used in previous missions, "Khaal-Ro courtesy", and of course GOT 'EM :) (not really a PS reference though). Otherwise, I was very focused on not losing and probably missed a bunch.
0
Finished it.
...my soul...
0
@DEFILERRULEZ: Go
I answered someone who asked on my channel, but you should be asking the mapmaker not me! He just hasn't uploaded it to the Arcade yet because he's been very busy.
0
I think we have an opportunity with LotV coming up and we shouldn't blow it. There will be 2-3 months of hype where Reddit, TL, and Battle.net forums will explode with traffic before dipping again and we should capitalize on it to get people interested. It really would not be time consuming or hard work if people take their excitement and attempt to branch it out to these other, larger forums!
Meanwhile, it's important to get organized and keep discussing ways we can get more exposure to the scene. Iguana and EivindL are completely correct about coming at this from a positive perspective. Rather than commenting on what we don't have, we should reflect on what we do have that is working well and then figure out how to expand on it and push it out to people who want to experience it, but have otherwise not heard about it.
0
@deltronLive: Go
I can try messaging Lowko on YouTube... YT has notoriously poor private messaging though. Is he on Twitter? That may be the best way to get his attention. I agree, he is one of the best analytical casters these days and has quite the following.
0
I haven't finished mission 09 yet, but I want to take a shot on how I think the ending will go:
Sppppppppooilers!
The dream team pulls through in taking down Geraldus, probably with some big twist/reveal about Corelia and/or Janus and possibly the Khaal-Ro realizing they've been duped. But, with EivindL being EivindL, the ending will be bittersweet because the remaining characters realize that Geraldus, with all it's might, money, and firepower, was the only group able to keep the Zerg suppressed in the sector. Our "protagonists" fight and win against the oppressive, corporate, wild-west system of government only to realize that now they've pushed themselves into a worse position of anarchy.
It's crazy to think this is all getting wrapped up very soon! I'm anxious to see how everything will get resolved in the final 2 missions remaining.
0
@Hockleberry: Go
Not tooting my own horn here (honest) - I do get messages on a consistent basis from viewers who say they have found/played campaigns after watching them on my channel. You're absolutely right about advertisement. I'm curious to know if anyone saw a meager bump in downloads after any showcases I've done. I know there are people out there that want to play the campaigns that are available - I think it's safe to say that a huge swath of people buying LotV are purchasing it just for the campaign and if they like the Blizzard campaign, I'm certain that they would enjoy the likes of Crimson Moon, Bio-Tech, Brood's Wrath, etc, etc (randomly chosen campaigns here, you know I love you all). Reaching these people is the key! The Starcraft subreddit sort of sucks and is full of elitists, but I think there is a silent majority there that really would like this stuff.
Finding that gateway is something we could all do something small to contribute to, whether it's sharing the CCI/SC2Mapster on Facebook, Reddit, or what have you. Sharing my and others' videos also could open the door more effectively since folks can actually see what these campaigns are before they're instantly turned off by the "complex" installations. We could always use more showcasing from others and I'd be down for some collaboration as well! Obviously, we know it's not hard to install this stuff, but to a new person, they may click away since it only takes a split second for these people to lose interest.
Hock demonstrates a great point with how the scene appears fragmented back in 2013, but once he took the initiative and organized the CCI forum page, things noticeably picked up. If we can give the appearance of excitement and organization, people will come. We live in the clickbait age and maybe that's what we need to be doing on TL and Reddit to get people interested enough to pay us a visit. I'm willing to make a separate installation video for each and every campaign that's out there even if they are all basically the same thing if you all think it could help.
0
It's also sort of a chicken or the egg scenario... Which comes first? Creators making awesome maps to draw a big crowd? Or a crowd that gives creators an incentive to actually make maps?
Let's not kid ourselves... while there are some really great people out there that make maps for themselves as a hobby, we all know that people want their maps played and to bathe in that sweet, sweet positive feedback. WC3 seems to still have that base that plays/gives feedback and it's hard to pinpoint why we don't... it seems that building a community has to happen in tandem with cool maps being made. We definitely already have cool maps though, so I think it's about exposure.
0
I want to preempt any argument someone wants to make about money... After the whole DotA fiasco, Blizzard now retains ownership of anything people make as part of their ToS and some would say this pushed mapmakers away. I couldn't disagree with this more - most SC1 custom content was free and not monetized.
I find the major problem has to do with the UI of the Arcade and the complexity of the map editor. We can sort of blame Blizzard for not pushing the Arcade harder and trying more UI updates for it, but they provided us with a VERY powerful tool to make maps. It's so powerful such that the barrier to entry is now much higher than SC1 and WC3 and less people are willing to try making things. I was using the SC1 Editor when I was 12... I couldn't imagine using the SC2 Editor at that age.
That makes the issues with the custom scene much more complex because everyone is looking to blame Blizzard when maybe they should blame themselves... they need to try to make something or, more importantly, actually open the Arcade and play something. I can guarantee that at least 75% of the people complaining don't play on the Arcade at all and there are some really quality maps on there.
The campaign scene in particular is harder to pin down, but I still think it's mostly the editor complexity and depth. It allows creators to dream big... they get started and then things start getting hairy because of the shear amount of things they'll have to learn. Look how many abandoned projects we have here that demonstrates this point! With the older game editors, the limitations were clear and it stopped creators from getting too ambitious too fast.
I'd love to see campaign support like we had in WC3 though. Even so, SC1 had a huge modding community and there was no support from Blizzard in that era, so I don't believe direct campaign support as much of an issue as some would believe (but it would help and be great to have). I think the excitement has simply been lost since Brood War. Many creators from the older era have grown up and newer players looking for content are lazy.
0
While I'm not opposed to removing CM10, I liked the escort part. It was challenging in a unique way and rewarding to complete. If others found it too hard, I can see why they wouldn't like it.
0
@Narudek: Go
Yeah, pre-order sales are crazy, especially on Amazon. They usually have well-known things up for pre-order months in advance, maybe even a year. They just put up a placeholder item on the page anticipating that they will be selling that item upon release so they can lock in the sales. I don't know how legit this is on other sites, but Amazon is trustworthy for this type of practice.
0
@wargirlwargirl: Go
Nah, that's legit on Amazon. I'm pretty sure the physical box versions of the game are only sold through 3rd party retailers. Blizzard will only sell you a direct download on Battle.net - if you want the box you'll have to get it at Gamestop, Amazon, etc.
0
Most people here know how into Starcraft I am, but it always amazes me how deeply people think about these cinematics. They are for viewing pleasure. I've enjoyed all of them because they give the tinglies and that's about as much as they're worth. Just always keep in mind these videos, and the game as a whole, are all about fun, plain and simple. You watch, say "that was cool!", and then buy the game.
I've got people on my channel who argue with each other about these crazy lore conjectures, SC1 vs SC2, etc etc on my old WoO videos from months ago and it boggles my mind that they're still at it.
0
@EivindL: Go
Is that perhaps a monstrous robot in the background?