So if someone makes a new map and releases it for playtesting, it's okay to go around saying the map sucks and should be made better, just because it's bad, without providing any feedback to the author?
I doubt Blizzard will fly anyone out to California and force them to update the b.net code. All I was saying was that taking a tiny amount of effort to explain possible solutions to the problems that exist in a relevant forum might be a tad bit more productive than bemoaning everything that obviously doesn't work as well as it could.
What's the guarantee that once a few people start using macros to bump their own maps, that the creators of the already popular maps won't just go and do the same to make sure they stay on top?
I'm still not exactly sure why passive-aggressively abusing the system is the preferred method of getting this problem noticed. There's been virtually no constructive discussion about this issue on the beta forums. It's typical of that place, I suppose, since most of the discussions there are from posturing children who are all basically identical in a sea of boiling angst.
But really, the best you can come up with is some cheap zero-effort version of a 4chan google bomb?
With the amount of angry posting that happens here, it wouldn't take more than a couple of extra clicks a day to bookmark a thread with the constructive ideas (that have ALREADY BEEN MENTIONED HERE) on the official forums and post there because, ya know, that's what they are for... If/when that doesn't work, then maybe alternative methods to get the idea out there might need to be taken. But seriously, complaining about what's obviously a broken system and then choosing to willfully exploit that system because you can (instead of making the slightest effort to get it fixed) reeks of the same petty mindset that plagues the official forums. I want what I want and I want it now, with no work on my part, even a little, and if you don't give it to me you're going to get punished.
To those reading this who may have actually tried to come up with an equitable solution and get it noticed, I applaud you.
To those that haven't gone to the developers and tried to find a solution, *this* is when the problems can be fixed. There's weeks of downtime coming up, and since the game itself is in minor tweaking phase, what do you think they will be working on?
Pop gun: It's a tin can with gunpowder, dirt, sawdust, and easy-to-use string trigger. Setting it off creates a cone of flame that can light enemies on fire and disorient them... but it also leaves an unpleasant tingling sensation where your hand used to be. Don't try this at home, kids!
(Does fire damage and applies a DoT effect to enemies in front of you, but does some damage to you too.)
Bug Bomb: It's a small, carefully sealed box of fire ants. Shake it up, punch a hole in the side, drop and run. Lure enemies to it, then point and laugh.
(Works like a mine, but creates a swarm cloud in the area. Enemies that walk near it cause broodlings to spawn and attack. Powered armor (if applicable) and robot units are immune.)
Mechanical Lockpick: Works like the Fallout ones did, gives you +1 lockpicking for a single lock.
Breath Spray: +1 to speech for a short time. This covers up the fact that toothpaste hasn't existed for hundreds of years, but the illusion of hygiene only lasts a short while. Use it wisely.
High tech toys:
Overload harness: A light vest with powered circuitry that's gone somewhat haywire over the years. You have no idea what it was originally for, but pressing a button on the shoulder pad charges up the exposed wiring. Anyone that hits you while this is active gets a nasty shock, but there's a slight chance it shorts out and jolts you too.
Rocket boots: Yeah, you can fly. These babies make you airborne for a few seconds, letting you leap out of danger or over walls. There's no way you could steady yourself enough to attack while they're engaged though, just focus on pulling off the landing and keeping your pretty face intact.
Mechanical crawly: It's some weird little thing with six legs and a camera. Turn it loose and scout a short distance ahead. Includes self-destruct button to prevent capture. Also does EMP damage on explosion, suitable for taking out scout robots or security monitors.
I'm sure I'll come up with more, but that's what I got off the top of my head. Looking forward to hearing much more about this project!
It sounds like you're wanting to make a Hero transport since you're making conditionals for 7 units? If you're interested in making this work for heroes and nothing else, you could set the hero flag on your units, and copy the medivac load/unload ability to your transport, changing requirements field to include Heroic only.
Right, I didn't mean to imply this was a xenogears type thing, was more remarking that it had a bit more thought than "hold out til dropships show up."
It sounds like you're developing an interactive story moreso than a campaign, which is an area that sees far too little development these days. Cliches are only really cliche when you rely solely on established archetype to drive the plot. Think of the things you enjoyed the most in the past few years, be it books, movies, or television. What stands out about each one? It probably isn't the story as much as it is the characters involved in it, who react to that given situation in their own way. The trick in creating a world with such a scope is populating that world with characters that players/readers/viewers can grow attached to. Look at the relationship between Raynor and Kerrigan, for a small example, although I don't think Blizzard was able to develop that as much as they could have.
Your story itself reminds me strongly of Hellgate: London, with a bit of Gendou Ikari from Neon Genesis Evangaleon thrown in. It's a good baseline, just don't try too hard to fit the story together on its own. Let the missions and world be a part of the plot, instead of just trappings in the background.
I don't think your Mason class is worthless; any organization or team would need someone like that to function in such a harsh environment. Give them the ability to repair vehicles such as the evacuation APC's, or to prepare temporary defenses in case the squad is about to get overrun. You could also have a defense objective at some point where smaller fortifications must be held while a larger offensive is taking place, or to defend the center of town while NPC's prepare to activate the Holy Hand Grenade type superweapon to complete the mission.
I like the idea so far, and wish you best of luck. I'd offer to help in any way I can, but unfortunately learning the editor is a slow process for me, so I'm still absolutely no good with it. If you want feedback on plot elements or dialog, I would be more than happy to provide those.
Diablo
Diablo 2, LoD
Warcraft
Warcraft 2 + tides
Starcraft +broodwar
WoW - 80 Lock/Mage/Rogue/Paladin/Shaman/DK, though DK's are basically free and two of those were after the huge round of leveling nerfs.
I didn't play too much WC3, I found the hero system unnecessary and only played through the campaign because a friend lent me his copy. When Arthas defeated Illidan I laughed and gave the game back. Cool idea but gameplay never really worked for me and I didn't do much with custom games.
From what I've seen there's no way to make those assets within GE; you'll have to use a separate program to make the models/textures and import them into GE for your own use. I have no experience actually doing that though, so I couldn't even tell you what programs you'd want to search for.
Their game, their editor, their intellectual property. They own the trademarks to everything you are buying a license to use, while you play on their servers. They reserve the right to do what they want with their property, up to and including revoking your privileges to use it whenever they want. This isn't new or specific to them. DotA used their resources too. The thing is it's in Blizzard's best interests to foster this kind of thing because there's no way they could develop the sheer amount of content that comes with custom games internally, and interest generated by fan projects feeds into their original product's longevity without any expense on their part whatsoever. They get continued publicity for their product and we get to have fun with the resources they provide us to make our ideas into new game play. It's mutually beneficial.
While this is the internet and backing this stuff up would be rather difficult, I can condense the common ones that I have experience with.
In rough order of author's control:
All Rights Reserved: You and only you are responsible for every aspect of the map. In theory people should have to ask you for permission to play it. Granted you implicitly give that permission by making it available to download, but still...
GPL variants: People have the right to use/redistribute/repackage/reverse engineer your map in whole or in part, as long as they include source documentation in their own project that clearly details what they got from yours. The GPL keeps getting updated as companies try to privatize and exploit it somehow, so you'll have to look up what each version changed and why.
Public Domain: You forfeit all rights to anything regarding your work. In theory this is just like saying you personally wrote the Happy Birthday song. It may be true, but you have absolutely no right to it at all, not even the ska mix that someone made that made it huge on the radio. It is okay for someone to repackage your work as their own original work with this license.
Most people that would like to be given credit for their work if it is re-used publish under a GPL license, and that's by far the one I've seen most often.
This is a thread on the official SC2 beta forums regarding the flawed-ness of popularity sort. I've already made a constructive post. If the thread should happen to get filled with reasonable and positive discussion that's more focused on how to make the system better instead of a few dozen posts saying it's bad because it's bad and was written by retarded monkeys, think what an impact that might make. At the very least it would stand out amongst the sea of mindless drivel that someone sorts through.
It couldn't hurt to try, could it? Hm?
Edit: for that matter there also seems to be a lack of threads concerning how the publishing system could be improved. There's several with people saying it sucks and is bad, but almost none saying what could make it better.
Which is why I said there should be two systems, one for recent releases that has an automated update very often (daily, preferably) that keeps pushing new maps to the top of the stack for consideration, and one for more long-term maps that shouldn't be the default window that pops up. That way, everyone who publishes gets their five minutes to make a first impression with a description and map preview that's guaranteed to be seen by many UMS players as they start to browse for a game. I also suggested a hit-list type thing for maps that catch on quickly, that should have a high turnover rate. For that matter, you could treat UMS maps like ladder rankings, scaling the popularity ratings over a much longer period of time and just "reset the ladder" every couple of weeks.
I'm trying to generate ideas here that have an oh-so-tiny chance of spreading elsewhere if the right people read them and happen to bring these issues up at a blizzard fansite chat or something. But when it comes down to it, I'm a nobody from nowhere that doesn't count. No one knows me. You have a name and a reputation, the potential to make yourself heard. So do many others here if they go about it properly. If the community is this passionate about it, then work with each other and with other communities to find a better solution, and tell someone who might actually be able to change it. If nothing happens, you have lost only the time you would otherwise have wasted complaining about it on forums. What's there to lose?
I think the custom game screen should have a splash page (or three) with a news feature that lists the most recent 15-20 maps published, maps released today/this week, maybe a section with top X most played maps released this week, things like that. Popularity system is fine if you want to go with something tried and true (thinking in terms of months after release), but it should be an opt-in list instead of default. Wiping the popularity list once a day would be a nice feature as well. I have absolutely no interest in named games though. The names were almost never useful (ZERGLOLKEKEKE, Billy r u here??, ASCII sequence with random map name and another ASCII sequence, and usually some lewd reference to goats), if I didn't know exactly what I was after, by the time I decided some map looked interesting enough to try, the game was full.
Yeah sorry I wasn't clearer with what I said before. If you're still having problems let me know and I'll post the map I'm using for testing and break down the weapon components.
0
So if someone makes a new map and releases it for playtesting, it's okay to go around saying the map sucks and should be made better, just because it's bad, without providing any feedback to the author?
I doubt Blizzard will fly anyone out to California and force them to update the b.net code. All I was saying was that taking a tiny amount of effort to explain possible solutions to the problems that exist in a relevant forum might be a tad bit more productive than bemoaning everything that obviously doesn't work as well as it could.
What's the guarantee that once a few people start using macros to bump their own maps, that the creators of the already popular maps won't just go and do the same to make sure they stay on top?
0
I'm still not exactly sure why passive-aggressively abusing the system is the preferred method of getting this problem noticed. There's been virtually no constructive discussion about this issue on the beta forums. It's typical of that place, I suppose, since most of the discussions there are from posturing children who are all basically identical in a sea of boiling angst.
But really, the best you can come up with is some cheap zero-effort version of a 4chan google bomb?
With the amount of angry posting that happens here, it wouldn't take more than a couple of extra clicks a day to bookmark a thread with the constructive ideas (that have ALREADY BEEN MENTIONED HERE) on the official forums and post there because, ya know, that's what they are for... If/when that doesn't work, then maybe alternative methods to get the idea out there might need to be taken. But seriously, complaining about what's obviously a broken system and then choosing to willfully exploit that system because you can (instead of making the slightest effort to get it fixed) reeks of the same petty mindset that plagues the official forums. I want what I want and I want it now, with no work on my part, even a little, and if you don't give it to me you're going to get punished.
To those reading this who may have actually tried to come up with an equitable solution and get it noticed, I applaud you.
To those that haven't gone to the developers and tried to find a solution, *this* is when the problems can be fixed. There's weeks of downtime coming up, and since the game itself is in minor tweaking phase, what do you think they will be working on?
0
Consumables:
Pop gun: It's a tin can with gunpowder, dirt, sawdust, and easy-to-use string trigger. Setting it off creates a cone of flame that can light enemies on fire and disorient them... but it also leaves an unpleasant tingling sensation where your hand used to be. Don't try this at home, kids!
(Does fire damage and applies a DoT effect to enemies in front of you, but does some damage to you too.)
Bug Bomb: It's a small, carefully sealed box of fire ants. Shake it up, punch a hole in the side, drop and run. Lure enemies to it, then point and laugh.
(Works like a mine, but creates a swarm cloud in the area. Enemies that walk near it cause broodlings to spawn and attack. Powered armor (if applicable) and robot units are immune.)
Mechanical Lockpick: Works like the Fallout ones did, gives you +1 lockpicking for a single lock.
Breath Spray: +1 to speech for a short time. This covers up the fact that toothpaste hasn't existed for hundreds of years, but the illusion of hygiene only lasts a short while. Use it wisely.
High tech toys:
Overload harness: A light vest with powered circuitry that's gone somewhat haywire over the years. You have no idea what it was originally for, but pressing a button on the shoulder pad charges up the exposed wiring. Anyone that hits you while this is active gets a nasty shock, but there's a slight chance it shorts out and jolts you too.
Rocket boots: Yeah, you can fly. These babies make you airborne for a few seconds, letting you leap out of danger or over walls. There's no way you could steady yourself enough to attack while they're engaged though, just focus on pulling off the landing and keeping your pretty face intact.
Mechanical crawly: It's some weird little thing with six legs and a camera. Turn it loose and scout a short distance ahead. Includes self-destruct button to prevent capture. Also does EMP damage on explosion, suitable for taking out scout robots or security monitors.
I'm sure I'll come up with more, but that's what I got off the top of my head. Looking forward to hearing much more about this project!
0
It sounds like you're wanting to make a Hero transport since you're making conditionals for 7 units? If you're interested in making this work for heroes and nothing else, you could set the hero flag on your units, and copy the medivac load/unload ability to your transport, changing requirements field to include Heroic only.
0
Right, I didn't mean to imply this was a xenogears type thing, was more remarking that it had a bit more thought than "hold out til dropships show up."
0
It sounds like you're developing an interactive story moreso than a campaign, which is an area that sees far too little development these days. Cliches are only really cliche when you rely solely on established archetype to drive the plot. Think of the things you enjoyed the most in the past few years, be it books, movies, or television. What stands out about each one? It probably isn't the story as much as it is the characters involved in it, who react to that given situation in their own way. The trick in creating a world with such a scope is populating that world with characters that players/readers/viewers can grow attached to. Look at the relationship between Raynor and Kerrigan, for a small example, although I don't think Blizzard was able to develop that as much as they could have.
Your story itself reminds me strongly of Hellgate: London, with a bit of Gendou Ikari from Neon Genesis Evangaleon thrown in. It's a good baseline, just don't try too hard to fit the story together on its own. Let the missions and world be a part of the plot, instead of just trappings in the background.
I don't think your Mason class is worthless; any organization or team would need someone like that to function in such a harsh environment. Give them the ability to repair vehicles such as the evacuation APC's, or to prepare temporary defenses in case the squad is about to get overrun. You could also have a defense objective at some point where smaller fortifications must be held while a larger offensive is taking place, or to defend the center of town while NPC's prepare to activate the Holy Hand Grenade type superweapon to complete the mission.
I like the idea so far, and wish you best of luck. I'd offer to help in any way I can, but unfortunately learning the editor is a slow process for me, so I'm still absolutely no good with it. If you want feedback on plot elements or dialog, I would be more than happy to provide those.
0
Diablo
Diablo 2, LoD
Warcraft
Warcraft 2 + tides
Starcraft +broodwar
WoW - 80 Lock/Mage/Rogue/Paladin/Shaman/DK, though DK's are basically free and two of those were after the huge round of leveling nerfs.
I didn't play too much WC3, I found the hero system unnecessary and only played through the campaign because a friend lent me his copy. When Arthas defeated Illidan I laughed and gave the game back. Cool idea but gameplay never really worked for me and I didn't do much with custom games.
0
From what I've seen there's no way to make those assets within GE; you'll have to use a separate program to make the models/textures and import them into GE for your own use. I have no experience actually doing that though, so I couldn't even tell you what programs you'd want to search for.
0
Their game, their editor, their intellectual property. They own the trademarks to everything you are buying a license to use, while you play on their servers. They reserve the right to do what they want with their property, up to and including revoking your privileges to use it whenever they want. This isn't new or specific to them. DotA used their resources too. The thing is it's in Blizzard's best interests to foster this kind of thing because there's no way they could develop the sheer amount of content that comes with custom games internally, and interest generated by fan projects feeds into their original product's longevity without any expense on their part whatsoever. They get continued publicity for their product and we get to have fun with the resources they provide us to make our ideas into new game play. It's mutually beneficial.
0
While this is the internet and backing this stuff up would be rather difficult, I can condense the common ones that I have experience with.
In rough order of author's control:
All Rights Reserved: You and only you are responsible for every aspect of the map. In theory people should have to ask you for permission to play it. Granted you implicitly give that permission by making it available to download, but still...
GPL variants: People have the right to use/redistribute/repackage/reverse engineer your map in whole or in part, as long as they include source documentation in their own project that clearly details what they got from yours. The GPL keeps getting updated as companies try to privatize and exploit it somehow, so you'll have to look up what each version changed and why.
Public Domain: You forfeit all rights to anything regarding your work. In theory this is just like saying you personally wrote the Happy Birthday song. It may be true, but you have absolutely no right to it at all, not even the ska mix that someone made that made it huge on the radio. It is okay for someone to repackage your work as their own original work with this license.
Most people that would like to be given credit for their work if it is re-used publish under a GPL license, and that's by far the one I've seen most often.
0
http://forums.battle.net/thread.html?topicId=25171667923&sid=5000
This is a thread on the official SC2 beta forums regarding the flawed-ness of popularity sort. I've already made a constructive post. If the thread should happen to get filled with reasonable and positive discussion that's more focused on how to make the system better instead of a few dozen posts saying it's bad because it's bad and was written by retarded monkeys, think what an impact that might make. At the very least it would stand out amongst the sea of mindless drivel that someone sorts through.
It couldn't hurt to try, could it? Hm?
Edit: for that matter there also seems to be a lack of threads concerning how the publishing system could be improved. There's several with people saying it sucks and is bad, but almost none saying what could make it better.
0
My experience with spore is limited to watching youtube videos of critters... so I had no idea :)
0
Which is why I said there should be two systems, one for recent releases that has an automated update very often (daily, preferably) that keeps pushing new maps to the top of the stack for consideration, and one for more long-term maps that shouldn't be the default window that pops up. That way, everyone who publishes gets their five minutes to make a first impression with a description and map preview that's guaranteed to be seen by many UMS players as they start to browse for a game. I also suggested a hit-list type thing for maps that catch on quickly, that should have a high turnover rate. For that matter, you could treat UMS maps like ladder rankings, scaling the popularity ratings over a much longer period of time and just "reset the ladder" every couple of weeks.
I'm trying to generate ideas here that have an oh-so-tiny chance of spreading elsewhere if the right people read them and happen to bring these issues up at a blizzard fansite chat or something. But when it comes down to it, I'm a nobody from nowhere that doesn't count. No one knows me. You have a name and a reputation, the potential to make yourself heard. So do many others here if they go about it properly. If the community is this passionate about it, then work with each other and with other communities to find a better solution, and tell someone who might actually be able to change it. If nothing happens, you have lost only the time you would otherwise have wasted complaining about it on forums. What's there to lose?
0
I think the custom game screen should have a splash page (or three) with a news feature that lists the most recent 15-20 maps published, maps released today/this week, maybe a section with top X most played maps released this week, things like that. Popularity system is fine if you want to go with something tried and true (thinking in terms of months after release), but it should be an opt-in list instead of default. Wiping the popularity list once a day would be a nice feature as well. I have absolutely no interest in named games though. The names were almost never useful (ZERGLOLKEKEKE, Billy r u here??, ASCII sequence with random map name and another ASCII sequence, and usually some lewd reference to goats), if I didn't know exactly what I was after, by the time I decided some map looked interesting enough to try, the game was full.
0
Yeah sorry I wasn't clearer with what I said before. If you're still having problems let me know and I'll post the map I'm using for testing and break down the weapon components.