Okay, i probably misunderstood this contest, but i cant seem to find the annoucemenet where it first announced the contest to re-read it.
Because right now, it seems pretty illogical and one-sided that Vezax is the only WoW Boss entry in a WoW Boss contest ...
Sometimes i save replays of myself against the AI and check the replay from his point of view only. I have never, in any replays ive seen, ranging from Medium to Insane, since the AI "cheats", they always followed the supply cap. Sometimes i would make a proxy pylon right outside of their base's line of sight, and they would leave it alone all game long, until they get some sort of units going next to it.
I have never seen them cheats per say. But i have to give you a point, they do have flawed design at some points such as:
They never make any kind of defenses, if terran, they never wall in or anything of the sort.
If you warp in 3 buiiding a time in THEIR OWN BASE. they will leave you alone. If you only make 1 or 2 in their vision, they will worker rush you.
If you have cannons in their bases, a terran insane AI will sometimes gets siege tanks, research siege modes. But will be "afraid" to get it by the cannon too much that they will either siege out of range, or they will apporach too much, get hit, retreat and siege out of range, rinse repeat.
Also, if you attack their workers or their bases, they will use their army to try and kill whatever the problem is. It's very easy to chese a void ray into attacking them, retreating and keep hit and running. In the replays, you will see their MASSIVE army, like, sometimes 200/200 army. Playing ping pong between both bases because you have 5-6 void rays attacking their workers.
On the other hand, their Brutal AI for the campaign. Now that's interesting. They focus fire your medics, they will try to kill a lone pylon powering 5-10 cannons before killing the cannons. stuff like that.
Fact remains, watch their replays, i havent seen them cheats.
The other team left pretty early. Our team suprisingly had a nice amount of teamwork, friendly, everything, We were doing decent. Got a minor screwup at the unique towers but we pressed on. The other team died and leaked some mobs, a WEST NUKE was called on EAST BOTTOM. Yes, its a known bug, but its why im uploading this replay. Shortly after that, Green lagged out and Orange left... Through good skills, positive attitudes and teamwork, we held our position in the game. You just HAVE to watch at least the second half of this replay. It's EPIC in its raw form.
Ghostwalker will probably be proud to know what Teamwork can do in this game !
PS: Me and pink are now friends, and with a little more help, we will try to conquer the game's harder difficulty and see how the balance hangs in harder difficulty. (For example, in earlier patches, Standard TD was balanced on Easy and Normal, but Hard was just impossible to beat).
I know where the intention is. the intention is defiently there... but its someothing that didnt translate well from paper to practice. Now, people see the speed bonus and start making towers in front of the spawn point. Neutering their defenses, just to get the bonus.
How about keeping minerals bonus as it was. But the team that clears faster will "Appease the temple" and reduce your retribution by 2-3% or something.. (not possible to go in the negatives)
A good way to make it if you can, would be to only disable building if there isnt any building IN YOUR CURRENT SQUARE.
Say i'm Green. I killed my adds. Orange and Yellows adds arent over here yet. I could take that time to build my turrets, and when they arrive in my square, disable building.
The reason i said "In your builder current square" is so you cant go to another person's square and do it.
Also removed "Light" wave since no one does extra damage to that type and added a regen wave instead, with a low amount of regen to make it harder for crappy towers to work
Juggling is always a problem with maps such as these. If the AI automatically attacked anything new that was put in their way, they'd tear down someone's base everytime they build a turret in mid wave (Like early waves where its close especially). Maybe give incentive for units to be killed early? With a steady decline down to near nothing. Like killed within 15 sec of spawn = 200% minerals, within 30sec = 100%, 45 sec = 50%, 60sec =0%
Like i said, my solution counters Juggling Pretty well, unless the ones doing it is like..a top player. Like, there's a timer when you kill them all that says the mobs will appear in 20 secs or so. Now if after 5 minutes after that timer (Just to make sure they reach Green/purp or something by that time), they summon more adds. everybody will be somewhat kept entertained, the juggler can continue juggling, it just becomes even LESS effective because of more unit pool.
Also, the whole "Death by nuke" never works. There was this game i was in, 3 of the east side left, the fourth (green) one was checking my insane defense as nothing got through... And what he made at that point? He destroyed his whole maze. He just made 3 minerals turrets ALL OVER east side.
That was at wave 32ish. Guess what? He hit 100% Nuke by wave 45 and the temple was STILL only destroying at best 5 towers a wave. He had nearly a hundred. We made it to 50 and we got victorius and he still had about 40 towers up. 100% nuke...it wouldve been 150% if it couldve.
Give a hardcap of 3-5 minute till the next spawn (whatever feels right in internal testing) because i saw someone make a huge maze of t1 towers with a few higher tiers. that's normal... but then he started JUGGLING the mobs, making them past like 10+ and me and my friend were practically SLEEPING.
The guy didnt have the dps to down them in any length of early times, he didnt even JUST juggle around his mid towers. It was just painfully slow...
Also, If Purp leaves, disable his spawn, that's already in the game, now the suggestion is: If green leaves and purp is still there, do not disable green's spawn. If Red/Blue leaves but not Green or purp, do not disable the spawns.
Reason: More Income which allows to handle next boss waves without fallling back to gimmicks. May be fine for easy/normal. But Hard/Unpossible, you kinda NEED that income.
Could it be possible to add some scaling/sharing of boss minerals?
Getting a boss to 25% (having gone through all his shield, half his health) only to have middle or bottom kill it, and keep all the minerals is...saddening
I do all the work and i dont even get 1 mineral for it? GG
Other than this, i find it an awesome..if VERY LENGTHY map. Some units need their health slightly nerfed, and their speed buffed alot. I'm looking at you level 20 SlowpokeLisk
Hopefully, patches will come to fix the major flaws, IE: thor colossus are overpowered
I can understand Thor being overpowered... but how does the Colossus, with its extremely easy hardcounter, is any kind of overpowered? Send Air -> they're screwed.
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Fun or Not is basically "Play a Random Game" If you dont know what you are looking for, you random and let the wheel decide for you.
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@Bibendus: Go
Thanks for the link, yeah,that's pretty clear now.
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Okay, i probably misunderstood this contest, but i cant seem to find the annoucemenet where it first announced the contest to re-read it. Because right now, it seems pretty illogical and one-sided that Vezax is the only WoW Boss entry in a WoW Boss contest ...
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@Polantaris: Go
Sometimes i save replays of myself against the AI and check the replay from his point of view only. I have never, in any replays ive seen, ranging from Medium to Insane, since the AI "cheats", they always followed the supply cap. Sometimes i would make a proxy pylon right outside of their base's line of sight, and they would leave it alone all game long, until they get some sort of units going next to it.
I have never seen them cheats per say. But i have to give you a point, they do have flawed design at some points such as:
They never make any kind of defenses, if terran, they never wall in or anything of the sort.
If you warp in 3 buiiding a time in THEIR OWN BASE. they will leave you alone. If you only make 1 or 2 in their vision, they will worker rush you. If you have cannons in their bases, a terran insane AI will sometimes gets siege tanks, research siege modes. But will be "afraid" to get it by the cannon too much that they will either siege out of range, or they will apporach too much, get hit, retreat and siege out of range, rinse repeat.
Also, if you attack their workers or their bases, they will use their army to try and kill whatever the problem is. It's very easy to chese a void ray into attacking them, retreating and keep hit and running. In the replays, you will see their MASSIVE army, like, sometimes 200/200 army. Playing ping pong between both bases because you have 5-6 void rays attacking their workers.
On the other hand, their Brutal AI for the campaign. Now that's interesting. They focus fire your medics, they will try to kill a lone pylon powering 5-10 cannons before killing the cannons. stuff like that.
Fact remains, watch their replays, i havent seen them cheats.
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I'm Impressed at Retribution TD being near the top and staying there. 8 players, 2hours games at times.
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I also need to post a Replay.
The other team left pretty early. Our team suprisingly had a nice amount of teamwork, friendly, everything, We were doing decent. Got a minor screwup at the unique towers but we pressed on. The other team died and leaked some mobs, a WEST NUKE was called on EAST BOTTOM. Yes, its a known bug, but its why im uploading this replay. Shortly after that, Green lagged out and Orange left... Through good skills, positive attitudes and teamwork, we held our position in the game. You just HAVE to watch at least the second half of this replay. It's EPIC in its raw form.
Ghostwalker will probably be proud to know what Teamwork can do in this game !
PS: Me and pink are now friends, and with a little more help, we will try to conquer the game's harder difficulty and see how the balance hangs in harder difficulty. (For example, in earlier patches, Standard TD was balanced on Easy and Normal, but Hard was just impossible to beat).
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@Bounty_98: Go
I believe you would need an EU account, either you or someone would have to give you a EU account to upload it with.
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I know where the intention is. the intention is defiently there... but its someothing that didnt translate well from paper to practice. Now, people see the speed bonus and start making towers in front of the spawn point. Neutering their defenses, just to get the bonus. How about keeping minerals bonus as it was. But the team that clears faster will "Appease the temple" and reduce your retribution by 2-3% or something.. (not possible to go in the negatives)
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A good way to make it if you can, would be to only disable building if there isnt any building IN YOUR CURRENT SQUARE.
Say i'm Green. I killed my adds. Orange and Yellows adds arent over here yet. I could take that time to build my turrets, and when they arrive in my square, disable building. The reason i said "In your builder current square" is so you cant go to another person's square and do it.
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...Anti Juggle Code? What did you do for that?
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Like i said, my solution counters Juggling Pretty well, unless the ones doing it is like..a top player. Like, there's a timer when you kill them all that says the mobs will appear in 20 secs or so. Now if after 5 minutes after that timer (Just to make sure they reach Green/purp or something by that time), they summon more adds. everybody will be somewhat kept entertained, the juggler can continue juggling, it just becomes even LESS effective because of more unit pool.
Also, the whole "Death by nuke" never works. There was this game i was in, 3 of the east side left, the fourth (green) one was checking my insane defense as nothing got through... And what he made at that point? He destroyed his whole maze. He just made 3 minerals turrets ALL OVER east side. That was at wave 32ish. Guess what? He hit 100% Nuke by wave 45 and the temple was STILL only destroying at best 5 towers a wave. He had nearly a hundred. We made it to 50 and we got victorius and he still had about 40 towers up. 100% nuke...it wouldve been 150% if it couldve.
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Other suggestions:
Give a hardcap of 3-5 minute till the next spawn (whatever feels right in internal testing) because i saw someone make a huge maze of t1 towers with a few higher tiers. that's normal... but then he started JUGGLING the mobs, making them past like 10+ and me and my friend were practically SLEEPING. The guy didnt have the dps to down them in any length of early times, he didnt even JUST juggle around his mid towers. It was just painfully slow...
Also, If Purp leaves, disable his spawn, that's already in the game, now the suggestion is: If green leaves and purp is still there, do not disable green's spawn. If Red/Blue leaves but not Green or purp, do not disable the spawns. Reason: More Income which allows to handle next boss waves without fallling back to gimmicks. May be fine for easy/normal. But Hard/Unpossible, you kinda NEED that income.
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I love West Bottom's Defense.
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Could it be possible to add some scaling/sharing of boss minerals?
Getting a boss to 25% (having gone through all his shield, half his health) only to have middle or bottom kill it, and keep all the minerals is...saddening I do all the work and i dont even get 1 mineral for it? GG
Other than this, i find it an awesome..if VERY LENGTHY map. Some units need their health slightly nerfed, and their speed buffed alot. I'm looking at you level 20 SlowpokeLisk
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I can understand Thor being overpowered... but how does the Colossus, with its extremely easy hardcounter, is any kind of overpowered? Send Air -> they're screwed.