How would it help people cheat the banks? People can already cheat the banks by hacking the bank data......
If the Bank is protected well enough, meaning it's not just encrypted but subject to global parity checks with recursive/obscure functions (hard to copy and reproduce) every time it's modified, everyone can look at the code and generate correct values but it can take a lot of time and since the author can manually purge every score he wants it isn't just worth it.
If you can launch the modified map locally, with full debugging powers, you can generate 100% correct values in a matter of seconds. Which is how they easily "hacked" Rodrigo's NWN by the way, except it was done by someone experienced enough and not the first random guy finding this thread on Google...
Sure, Blizzard said they will try to protect Banks somehow.
But it's Blizzard, and I'm not sure I'm willing to wait 2013 for that...
I would rather be the one who controls the information and thus the first to prepare for it than one of the last because I was too afraid to accept the existence of it.
Being able to launch protected maps locally means being able to cheat on any map making use of (encrypted or not) Banks.
You are obviously not interested in protecting maps, but we definitely are and for a reason.
Since there's nothing we can do to reliably protect them, it's up to Blizzard and this thread doesn't help anyone here.
Someone already knew how to, sure, but teaching every bored player out there is a fucking terrible move.
theres really no stopping people from cracking locked maps.
I think everyone here already knew that, Soul. Blizzard's map protection sucks, shocking news!
There's a huge difference though between experienced (or novice, but motivated) mapmakers cracking maps to find out how something very specific was done to take inspiration for their own projects and random Googleboys being now able to easily "tweak" and republish maps, possibly taking over your spot after the next popularity reset... given how the whole system sucks atm - and this IS going to happen, any Euro player probably knows what I'm talking about.
Can someone please elaborate how teaching them HERE how to do so is a good idea?
"Some other forum will come up with the same tutorial anyway" so SC2Mapster must be the first?
Sixen, please, let's cut the "open source" crap shall we.
(Reply on page 1)
This is nothing like opening the source code of a software to learn from it. You have a lot of tutorials to learn from, there's plenty of unlocked maps to download and look at if you browse SC2Mapster, and people keep releasing libraries ready to plug and use easily.
Maps are not protected, we all know that since Beta and Blizzard doesn't care at the moment just like they don't seem to care about custom maps at all. Let's be honest here for a second, who do you think we are really afraid of? The experienced user who already knew how to reconstruct maps and look at THAT specific data editor trick he wanted to copy in his own project, or the 10.000 retards who will now Google this and boost their own unbalanced/cheated version of *Random popular map here* after the next popularity reset?
"Nicely done"? "This is newsworthy"?. I'm sorry, but you are SO not a mapmaker :|
Please find me anyone who spent 300+ hours creating a map and remotely agrees with this.
This tutorial will probably come out soon on other websites, that's unfortunately true. So if we want to do something to force Blizzard to protect maps for real, let's spam the official forums to the point we quickly get an answer. That's something. I fail to see how showcasing a thread like this on SC2Mapster (the #1 resource online) can be positive at all for the mapmaking community, its only effect will be to disencourage authors from releasing their work because every kid out there will know how to modify and upload his favourite map, your call if a few additional clicks on the website can justify that.
Yeah, Technically there is no debate actually. Sixen`s word seems to be law. This thread is dumb and should be deleted. Sixen having this here is just doing terrible terrible damage to the site`s reputation.
Ive lost my interest. Helping noobs to the point of virtually DOING our own maps(which takes a very long time), and letting them have their way with it, just sucks. We should create a sub forum. With all the cool maps hacked and opened hmm?. Lets make it one step easier for them?. Why not?
Mile25 is working on a cool Rpg. You think he wants people to know how to open his map?. Im pretty sure not. That includes the rest of us.
Anyway, I don't really think a rating system is going to improve the situation.
If 80% of the Battle.net playerbase really likes Nexus Wars, what vote do you think the map will get?
What vote do you think niche maps, or maps that actually require skill/experience, will get?
Funny.
I wrote very VERY similar things on the EU Beta forums 3 months ago...
and now someone with my name reposts this.
Too many tabs though, imho.
You should have your own Thumbed Up and Thumbed Down tabs, not Popular lists decided by others.
The New Releases tab should be sorted by release date and only include maps without enough votes.
The only Popular tab should be sorted by positive votes percentage, not including maps you already voted on (you don't need those there, you already have your "bookmarks").
The Battle.net playerbase is so addicted to brainless maps we would see the very same situation otherwise, honestly I'm not that worried about the system itself as much as how people are playing that crap over and over. That's depressing :/
Nope, in World of Warcraft you are allowed to modify any of your addons (something that is there to personalize the game to your liking). Now, banks are there so that users may personalize the game to their liking. Say for example, in your map the user can set the level of tips they receive during the map (beginner, expert, etc). When Blizzard came up with their banks idea, I don't think they meant for them to be used to store critical data (eg. "Map unlocks upgrades as a player plays more of the map.") or for it to be transmitted (eg. "Map maintains a ranking list.").
That's why the user should be allowed to edit their bank data. Your analogy of editing "levels, items, etc" is totally wrong. The things you mention are core game mechanics (if you want an analogy, in SC2, it is the map which should be locked). Bank files allow for personalisation (in WoW, these are the WTF files, addon files, etc. which are all editable).
Well, 1 hour ago you wrote he hacked his savefile 3 times "today".
If you had really updated your protection algorhytm today, previously generated scores wouldn't just show or spread anymore. Unless you clean cheated scores manually without any kind of parity check that is.
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If the Bank is protected well enough, meaning it's not just encrypted but subject to global parity checks with recursive/obscure functions (hard to copy and reproduce) every time it's modified, everyone can look at the code and generate correct values but it can take a lot of time and since the author can manually purge every score he wants it isn't just worth it.
If you can launch the modified map locally, with full debugging powers, you can generate 100% correct values in a matter of seconds. Which is how they easily "hacked" Rodrigo's NWN by the way, except it was done by someone experienced enough and not the first random guy finding this thread on Google...
Sure, Blizzard said they will try to protect Banks somehow.
But it's Blizzard, and I'm not sure I'm willing to wait 2013 for that...
0
Being able to launch protected maps locally means being able to cheat on any map making use of (encrypted or not) Banks.
You are obviously not interested in protecting maps, but we definitely are and for a reason.
Since there's nothing we can do to reliably protect them, it's up to Blizzard and this thread doesn't help anyone here.
Someone already knew how to, sure, but teaching every bored player out there is a fucking terrible move.
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I lol'd. Oh yes, yes they will.
It's the current Battle.net playerbase we are talking about.
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I think everyone here already knew that, Soul. Blizzard's map protection sucks, shocking news!
There's a huge difference though between experienced (or novice, but motivated) mapmakers cracking maps to find out how something very specific was done to take inspiration for their own projects and random Googleboys being now able to easily "tweak" and republish maps, possibly taking over your spot after the next popularity reset... given how the whole system sucks atm - and this IS going to happen, any Euro player probably knows what I'm talking about.
Can someone please elaborate how teaching them HERE how to do so is a good idea?
"Some other forum will come up with the same tutorial anyway" so SC2Mapster must be the first?
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Send a mail to the original author?
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Sixen, please, let's cut the "open source" crap shall we.
(Reply on page 1)
This is nothing like opening the source code of a software to learn from it. You have a lot of tutorials to learn from, there's plenty of unlocked maps to download and look at if you browse SC2Mapster, and people keep releasing libraries ready to plug and use easily.
Maps are not protected, we all know that since Beta and Blizzard doesn't care at the moment just like they don't seem to care about custom maps at all. Let's be honest here for a second, who do you think we are really afraid of? The experienced user who already knew how to reconstruct maps and look at THAT specific data editor trick he wanted to copy in his own project, or the 10.000 retards who will now Google this and boost their own unbalanced/cheated version of *Random popular map here* after the next popularity reset?
"Nicely done"? "This is newsworthy"?. I'm sorry, but you are SO not a mapmaker :|
Please find me anyone who spent 300+ hours creating a map and remotely agrees with this.
This tutorial will probably come out soon on other websites, that's unfortunately true. So if we want to do something to force Blizzard to protect maps for real, let's spam the official forums to the point we quickly get an answer. That's something. I fail to see how showcasing a thread like this on SC2Mapster (the #1 resource online) can be positive at all for the mapmaking community, its only effect will be to disencourage authors from releasing their work because every kid out there will know how to modify and upload his favourite map, your call if a few additional clicks on the website can justify that.
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Well if you decide to spam the forums about this, make sure to post in General Discussions.
I don't think they even read the Custom Maps one.
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Couldn't agree more.
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The first one is awesome.
Read the patch notes in the fake downloader!
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Oh well, I posted this yesterday on the official forums: http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/801651430
And no, I don't trust them anymore. "We have mid-long term plans" is not enough.
Anyway, I don't really think a rating system is going to improve the situation.
If 80% of the Battle.net playerbase really likes Nexus Wars, what vote do you think the map will get?
What vote do you think niche maps, or maps that actually require skill/experience, will get?
0
Funny.
I wrote very VERY similar things on the EU Beta forums 3 months ago...
and now someone with my name reposts this.
Too many tabs though, imho.
You should have your own Thumbed Up and Thumbed Down tabs, not Popular lists decided by others.
The New Releases tab should be sorted by release date and only include maps without enough votes.
The only Popular tab should be sorted by positive votes percentage, not including maps you already voted on (you don't need those there, you already have your "bookmarks").
The Battle.net playerbase is so addicted to brainless maps we would see the very same situation otherwise, honestly I'm not that worried about the system itself as much as how people are playing that crap over and over. That's depressing :/
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No.
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"We stalk with the Stalkers" (Phoenix repeated)
What would you say if they decided to remove Marauders from the game?
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Don't worry too much, just ignore them :)
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Well, 1 hour ago you wrote he hacked his savefile 3 times "today".
If you had really updated your protection algorhytm today, previously generated scores wouldn't just show or spread anymore. Unless you clean cheated scores manually without any kind of parity check that is.