This will be a boring job, sorry in advance if anyone accepts.
What I need:
18 or so Units set up to be like heroes. I have all of the hero abilities, stats, ect data created. I simply need need a lot of units duplicated, and set up with actors, weapons, ect ect. No advanced data entry, just a unit that works like a unit.
70-80 Items created. That is, I need items, actors for them, behaviors made and added to them, Buttons/icons, and tooltips. Once again, I will have everything set up beforehand so this requires no free thinking of your own.
Organization while doing this. Use of prefix and suffix on objects, ect.
Additional Info:
This is for the map "Custom Hero Arena" which is more... "updated" on my site, http://chao.forumclan.net/ if you are interested in it.
There is no "Rush" on getting the whole thing done fast. I simply need good communication about when you can work on it, so we can swap the most updated map back and forth. Trying to copy units over from another map and set it all up again isn't worth the time. If you have 2 free days and want to try to grind out 20 items, that is fine.
Anyone willing to do this will have a little sway on map non-specifics. you can pick almost any unit models you want. I will be making spells while this is going on, and if there are a few you would like to see, I could try to make room for them (if they are balanced).
Of course you will be credited as helping create the map.
Hmmm... Would there be a way to make it so that buff cannot be removed by a debuff trigger/ability without running a conditional check for each attribute buff? I could run the check, it wouldn't be game changing, but for future reference; it would be easier if there was a field I am overlooking that would exclude these. Does "hidden" get overlooked? like a hidden unit is when "picking every unit"?
I have a hero system, with stats. I am curious is there is a way to increase his stats (a behavior) 1 at a time, through triggers. Par example:
I pick up an item
I gain 1 strength
Thanks for you speedy reply,
I am not sure I fully understand, but this is what I took from it:
I set various effects, rather than making different abilities; and just add say, 400 affects to a single ability (say I have 40 skills, 10 levels each)? I would need 1 ability to represent all instant effects, and 1 ability to represent all target effects; for every skill I plan for my unit to have. 4 skills would mean adding a total of 8 abilities.
Is that what you are saying, or did I completely miss the mark on it?
I thought I had asked many valid questions, that interested workers would like to know the answer to. If someone wants me to do a drywalling job, I dont say "yeah, I will do it" there are things that need to be known. Maybe you want a skylight installed. Skylights are problematic in terms of electrical, and leaks from the roof. This could mean that I have to get up on the roof and shingle. Maybe the person has 14 ft tall walls and getting a sheet of drywall up to the ceiling is nothing something I can do with my normal tools.
I think it is very reasonably to ask beforehand exactly how much money you are willing to spend, how much work is expected to be done, and more than a very brief description of what you want done. Serious people dont jump blindly into positions like that. If they take your "up front" payment, then decide a month into it that you are too difficult to work for, what happens? Do you demand all of your money back? do you pay for the time they spent? I am trying to express to you, as many people have, that you need to have a lot more of your plans written out if you want anyone to take this seriously. Can you not understand this?
I have spent a good few hours on multiple sites trying to figure out if anyone has managed to do this yet; and well, I read a sentence somewhere about it being possible; but no information on how one might do it.
What I Need:
With triggers to be able to add abilities to units
I need to be able to exceed the number of abilities that you are allowed to add to a unit (32)
With that in mind, the whole "add the ability to the unit, then unlock it through a research requirement trigger" cannot work.
I need all of the abilities to be "on" the unit; that is, no morphing into various units to cast different abilities.
I only need a few abilities to actually be active per unit (I am not looking to have 50 castable abilities on a single unit at once)
Does anyone know if this is currently possible in the Editor?
My brightest work around that doesnt work:
Attempting to cast each ability through dummy units. If I could give a dummy unit 32 abilities, and make 20 dummy units, with 32 abilities each, I could have endless abilities. then with triggering, I could set my ability to simply create a dummy to cast whichever of the above skills I wanted; simply by saving a few bits of information into variables.
The problem with this idea is that, unless I am hopefully proven wrong, I cannot have an icon for the skill I want cast, which will accurately display the cast information of the actual skill being cast.
Any thoughts into the situation will be, well, essential for me ^_^ thanks.
I really dont like to be a negative nancy; but the "search" function is entirely too broad; and I would rather not be the guy who asks how to do.. everything; especially since I am sure it has all been answered 40 times, and I simply cannot find it. Thank you though ^_^ I have found a few youtube walkthroughs, for just general things in the object editor. err, data editor. that is the biggest thing kicking my ass; the triggering system is great, a huge improvement over wc3.
I will edit my OP to include the general outline of my game. Once I start creation, and can make a catchy post, I will make a map development post that is full of win. Any feedback on the map idea will be taken seriously; right now this is an "idea factory" grinding away. I plan to have a well thought out plan before I start adding stuff.
keep in mind that making a game friendlier to new player, makes it less popular for hardcore players. The kind of players, who, say, might be willing to pay to play a game with other highly skilled players. Example: Is there a single hardcore WoW player left that isn't getting paid to play?
The problem I see is that you don't want to pay someone until their work is "Satisfactory" in your eyes. What does this mean? you want the game to be better than all existing DOTA games before you will pay? There is a huge difference between your ideas, and what will actually work in a fair and balanced game with a high skill curve. If your ideas prevent a person from creating the gameplay you want, are they the ones held responsible?
I agree with the many above comments that you should find someone who is truly interested in making a game of this style. Unless you can pay them a fair wage, there is no way someone is going to do "work" for you under the context that they might not get paid at all if you aren't pleased with the results, be them exactly what you wanted or not. Find someone interested in your style of map, by giving an elaborate description, and then offer to pay them to work with you on it. If the basis for your map is "balance" and "perfection" then you are looking at hiring someone on who needs to get deeply involved with this game for a year+. Even paying someone 2 dollars an hour, I think you might break your budget. In a year of updates, plus the creation time; you can assume 10 hours a week for a year, on average. that is 1000 dollars; if you can find someone to work for that cheap. 500 hours of work is nothing for a high quality game. Also, you need to think of how you will get feedback on this game. No player feedback is no balance. Do you want to pay this person to test it with a friend 10,000 times? Are you going to hire someone to create a website and advertise for the game/site? Without player feedback, you have no game.
So, simple question, yes or no, do you have at least 5,000 dollars ready to invest into the creation of a game that may only be played by 16 people ever? Answer yes, and you will get some replies.
I am the editor of custom hero arena for WC3, and have finally decided to jump to SC2. There is a lot of information I am trying to learn, and quite frankly, all of the tutorials on this site that have anything to do with heroes, abilities, and items, are severely outdated. Outdated to the point of them being unusable. That is, the very few that dont simply display a 404 error. I have read and followed almost all of the hero creation threads, and all of them have been... problematic. After finding an "updated" tutorial on youtube, it became simple and fast.
So uhh, does anyone know where there might be UPDATED tutorials? Most sites and searches redirect me here. "Here" is clearly the wrong place.
Help?
- - - - - THE GAME - - - - - - - -
The Short:
You start by picking a hero skin, then its attributes and skills. Yeah, you create your own hero. Then you and your teamates are allowed free from your base to roam the countryside and kill monsters for gold and experience. Your opponents will also be doing the same thing. You can head over to your friendly neighbor opponent and kill him with a toothy smile. Because a lot of people are afraid of PVP though; there are periodic arena fights. Teams are put into a pit, and not allowed out until someone is dead. The game is based on a kill count; so scoring kills outside of arenas is a good way to secure victory for your team. This means that teams, or individuals (because teamates rarely communicate beyond low throat noises) have to play their builds in a way that will allow them to excel in various aspects of the game. Selecting all pvp skill, or later game skill will mean that your opponents get more levels, giving them more stats and items, and they will head over and kill you. If you only have skills that are best for killing creeps, you may have those extra levels, but if you do not take advantage of the situation fast, there is a good chance your opponent will become to strong for you to kill; as their pvp skills scale up.
BYO Mode:
For those who have no idea what that means. "Build your own hero" is exactly that. You pick a skin that you want, and from there, customize stats, stat gain, move speed, range, base attack speed, armor. I have to find out how limiting this is in SC2, but from what I read, "anything is possible". Of course, for new players, there will be a dozen or so pre-made heroes, so you dont have to spend too much time thinking up a build. Of course, through testing, starting stat points and all that will have to be balanced.
Advanced stat systems: (will take ideas on)
Rather than 3 stats, and adding all different abilities onto items, I was thinking of just using a higher stat system. Of course, balance help is needed here, and creative ideas. My first thoughts:
Strength: How much damage you deal
Stamina: Your Life
Armor: Uhh, armor, damage reduction as a value that increases your EHP (like in wc3)
Agility: attack speed
Spellpower: added to heals and spells
Spell defense: spell damage reduction
Intelligence: Mana
Constitution: both life and mana regeneration (in uneqyal values)
Speed: move speed
Shield: The value of your shield
Creep/Terrain layout:
my 3rd idea that is a big change from WC3, but might fix a long standing problem, is that of terrain layout. I am a terrible terrainer, so have no idea how far this will go... I would like to have "random" creep camps. Rather than 5 camps, 5 creeps each. Various sided camps all over the map. Heavy casters could bump from big ones to big ones, no problem. Melee passive farmers would also be able to pick up the stray creeps they find. This would allow passive farmers not to be overwhelmed if their opponent gets 2 levels on them; and it would also allow newbie players to kill a few creeps without getting rocked by 5 hard creeps at once. On this entire list; managing to do this in a balanced way honestly seems like the most difficult...
Creeps:
Wc3 offers very many creeps, hundreds in fact. Sc2 has almost none; and even non-creep units are... battlecruisers. I will be lucky to find 15-20 usable skins for creeps. With that in mind, It would be very silly to copy/paste each creep and set its stats individually, to call it a different level. Why? Because SC2 editor can do something wc3 cant... Trigger changes to the base of units. ...the skinny of it is:
- - I can simply make creeps able to level! I can make it so creeps level up based on the average hero level (same method used in CHA, except I dont have to make 350 creeps). I can set things to increase on the creeps as they level; damage, attack speed, life, armor, mana, shields, ect. I can even add and remove abilities for various levels. Once a creep hits 5, I can give him an ability that burns 20 mana. At level 7, I can replace it with one that deals 50. Though this is all POSSIBLE in wc3; it is much, much easier to do on sc2. On top of that, I can change the EXP rewarded for killing them, the bounty, and their scale size, so they get bigger as they level. Again, technically possible in wc3, but much easier now.
ITEMS:
Everyone wants to know about items. They are a major part of CHA, and a big part of what makes the game complicated. Learning starting items is painful, having a new player on your team who spends the first 7 minutes looking through shops to see what items he wants later, and how to make them now.. dear god... Well, with the help of wrath, yiffs godlike voice saying "sounds much better than what we got" I present you with:
Upgradable items, and set item slots.
That is, there will be set items that you have. Boots, armor, gloves, amulet, ring, helm, weapon, shield. you will START with all of these items in their basic form.
From there, with your gold, you upgrade them. Say, you need to upgrade their base forms twice. Example: Worn boots 1: 30ms, pay 200g to upgrade them, worn boots 2: 40 ms, 200g to upgrade, worm boots3: 50ms. From there, you can pick which "tree" you want to gear towards with that item. Once you have your rank 3 3 boots, you can upgrade to say, "armored boots" which give armor, but little move speed, "lightweight boots" which give higher MS, or "agile boots" which offer a little evasion and medium movespeed. you upgrade them 3 times, say, 1000g per upgrade, and there might be a new tree, or new, final class of that item.
Items of course will offer various stats, and have an upgrade tree that would fit any build type. If you decide you no longer want to be invested in a certain item/tree you can sell it; and the item is set back to rank 1. Essentially, you will never be buying items, only upgrades.
Reasoning behind this? well, uhhh... No one would ever really be stuck in base for too long trying to make recipes or figure out which items they want. "shield shop" upgrades your shield! You have 3 shields to look at, and once you have one, you are set in your ways, unless you plan to sell. When in doubt, you can keep upgrading the same piece of armor, because it seems to be working for you. The concept here is that noobs can learn the game much more easily, but great players cannot easily master an item set.
Starting Gold:
Also, open for debate, is starting gold. It is my opinion right now there there is NO STARTING GOLD. Because you will be able to build your own hero, I can simply allow players to start with enough stats to not be useless. If you got a few levels before an ally decides standing in base looking at all the pretty colors, well, you can handle yourself a little better than being level 1 in the same situation.
*I understand that in the above some units (30ms) are wc3 units of measurement. My following crowd is from WC3, and my game is from wc3, so, habit of using terms I am familliar with.
0
This will be a boring job, sorry in advance if anyone accepts.
What I need: 18 or so Units set up to be like heroes. I have all of the hero abilities, stats, ect data created. I simply need need a lot of units duplicated, and set up with actors, weapons, ect ect. No advanced data entry, just a unit that works like a unit. 70-80 Items created. That is, I need items, actors for them, behaviors made and added to them, Buttons/icons, and tooltips. Once again, I will have everything set up beforehand so this requires no free thinking of your own. Organization while doing this. Use of prefix and suffix on objects, ect.
Additional Info: This is for the map "Custom Hero Arena" which is more... "updated" on my site, http://chao.forumclan.net/ if you are interested in it. There is no "Rush" on getting the whole thing done fast. I simply need good communication about when you can work on it, so we can swap the most updated map back and forth. Trying to copy units over from another map and set it all up again isn't worth the time. If you have 2 free days and want to try to grind out 20 items, that is fine. Anyone willing to do this will have a little sway on map non-specifics. you can pick almost any unit models you want. I will be making spells while this is going on, and if there are a few you would like to see, I could try to make room for them (if they are balanced). Of course you will be credited as helping create the map.
Thanks for reading!
0
Hmmm... Would there be a way to make it so that buff cannot be removed by a debuff trigger/ability without running a conditional check for each attribute buff? I could run the check, it wouldn't be game changing, but for future reference; it would be easier if there was a field I am overlooking that would exclude these. Does "hidden" get overlooked? like a hidden unit is when "picking every unit"?
thanks for the above reply ^^
0
long title, but that is what I need.
I have a hero system, with stats. I am curious is there is a way to increase his stats (a behavior) 1 at a time, through triggers. Par example: I pick up an item I gain 1 strength
no buff!
0
Thanks for you speedy reply, I am not sure I fully understand, but this is what I took from it:
I set various effects, rather than making different abilities; and just add say, 400 affects to a single ability (say I have 40 skills, 10 levels each)? I would need 1 ability to represent all instant effects, and 1 ability to represent all target effects; for every skill I plan for my unit to have. 4 skills would mean adding a total of 8 abilities.
Is that what you are saying, or did I completely miss the mark on it?
0
I thought I had asked many valid questions, that interested workers would like to know the answer to. If someone wants me to do a drywalling job, I dont say "yeah, I will do it" there are things that need to be known. Maybe you want a skylight installed. Skylights are problematic in terms of electrical, and leaks from the roof. This could mean that I have to get up on the roof and shingle. Maybe the person has 14 ft tall walls and getting a sheet of drywall up to the ceiling is nothing something I can do with my normal tools.
I think it is very reasonably to ask beforehand exactly how much money you are willing to spend, how much work is expected to be done, and more than a very brief description of what you want done. Serious people dont jump blindly into positions like that. If they take your "up front" payment, then decide a month into it that you are too difficult to work for, what happens? Do you demand all of your money back? do you pay for the time they spent? I am trying to express to you, as many people have, that you need to have a lot more of your plans written out if you want anyone to take this seriously. Can you not understand this?
0
I have spent a good few hours on multiple sites trying to figure out if anyone has managed to do this yet; and well, I read a sentence somewhere about it being possible; but no information on how one might do it.
What I Need:
With triggers to be able to add abilities to units I need to be able to exceed the number of abilities that you are allowed to add to a unit (32) With that in mind, the whole "add the ability to the unit, then unlock it through a research requirement trigger" cannot work. I need all of the abilities to be "on" the unit; that is, no morphing into various units to cast different abilities. I only need a few abilities to actually be active per unit (I am not looking to have 50 castable abilities on a single unit at once)
Does anyone know if this is currently possible in the Editor?
My brightest work around that doesnt work: Attempting to cast each ability through dummy units. If I could give a dummy unit 32 abilities, and make 20 dummy units, with 32 abilities each, I could have endless abilities. then with triggering, I could set my ability to simply create a dummy to cast whichever of the above skills I wanted; simply by saving a few bits of information into variables. The problem with this idea is that, unless I am hopefully proven wrong, I cannot have an icon for the skill I want cast, which will accurately display the cast information of the actual skill being cast.
Any thoughts into the situation will be, well, essential for me ^_^ thanks.
0
I really dont like to be a negative nancy; but the "search" function is entirely too broad; and I would rather not be the guy who asks how to do.. everything; especially since I am sure it has all been answered 40 times, and I simply cannot find it. Thank you though ^_^ I have found a few youtube walkthroughs, for just general things in the object editor. err, data editor. that is the biggest thing kicking my ass; the triggering system is great, a huge improvement over wc3.
I will edit my OP to include the general outline of my game. Once I start creation, and can make a catchy post, I will make a map development post that is full of win. Any feedback on the map idea will be taken seriously; right now this is an "idea factory" grinding away. I plan to have a well thought out plan before I start adding stuff.
0
keep in mind that making a game friendlier to new player, makes it less popular for hardcore players. The kind of players, who, say, might be willing to pay to play a game with other highly skilled players. Example: Is there a single hardcore WoW player left that isn't getting paid to play?
The problem I see is that you don't want to pay someone until their work is "Satisfactory" in your eyes. What does this mean? you want the game to be better than all existing DOTA games before you will pay? There is a huge difference between your ideas, and what will actually work in a fair and balanced game with a high skill curve. If your ideas prevent a person from creating the gameplay you want, are they the ones held responsible?
I agree with the many above comments that you should find someone who is truly interested in making a game of this style. Unless you can pay them a fair wage, there is no way someone is going to do "work" for you under the context that they might not get paid at all if you aren't pleased with the results, be them exactly what you wanted or not. Find someone interested in your style of map, by giving an elaborate description, and then offer to pay them to work with you on it. If the basis for your map is "balance" and "perfection" then you are looking at hiring someone on who needs to get deeply involved with this game for a year+. Even paying someone 2 dollars an hour, I think you might break your budget. In a year of updates, plus the creation time; you can assume 10 hours a week for a year, on average. that is 1000 dollars; if you can find someone to work for that cheap. 500 hours of work is nothing for a high quality game. Also, you need to think of how you will get feedback on this game. No player feedback is no balance. Do you want to pay this person to test it with a friend 10,000 times? Are you going to hire someone to create a website and advertise for the game/site? Without player feedback, you have no game.
So, simple question, yes or no, do you have at least 5,000 dollars ready to invest into the creation of a game that may only be played by 16 people ever? Answer yes, and you will get some replies.
0
I am the editor of custom hero arena for WC3, and have finally decided to jump to SC2. There is a lot of information I am trying to learn, and quite frankly, all of the tutorials on this site that have anything to do with heroes, abilities, and items, are severely outdated. Outdated to the point of them being unusable. That is, the very few that dont simply display a 404 error. I have read and followed almost all of the hero creation threads, and all of them have been... problematic. After finding an "updated" tutorial on youtube, it became simple and fast.
So uhh, does anyone know where there might be UPDATED tutorials? Most sites and searches redirect me here. "Here" is clearly the wrong place.
Help?
- - - - - THE GAME - - - - - - - -
The Short: You start by picking a hero skin, then its attributes and skills. Yeah, you create your own hero. Then you and your teamates are allowed free from your base to roam the countryside and kill monsters for gold and experience. Your opponents will also be doing the same thing. You can head over to your friendly neighbor opponent and kill him with a toothy smile. Because a lot of people are afraid of PVP though; there are periodic arena fights. Teams are put into a pit, and not allowed out until someone is dead. The game is based on a kill count; so scoring kills outside of arenas is a good way to secure victory for your team. This means that teams, or individuals (because teamates rarely communicate beyond low throat noises) have to play their builds in a way that will allow them to excel in various aspects of the game. Selecting all pvp skill, or later game skill will mean that your opponents get more levels, giving them more stats and items, and they will head over and kill you. If you only have skills that are best for killing creeps, you may have those extra levels, but if you do not take advantage of the situation fast, there is a good chance your opponent will become to strong for you to kill; as their pvp skills scale up.
BYO Mode: For those who have no idea what that means. "Build your own hero" is exactly that. You pick a skin that you want, and from there, customize stats, stat gain, move speed, range, base attack speed, armor. I have to find out how limiting this is in SC2, but from what I read, "anything is possible". Of course, for new players, there will be a dozen or so pre-made heroes, so you dont have to spend too much time thinking up a build. Of course, through testing, starting stat points and all that will have to be balanced.
Advanced stat systems: (will take ideas on) Rather than 3 stats, and adding all different abilities onto items, I was thinking of just using a higher stat system. Of course, balance help is needed here, and creative ideas. My first thoughts: Strength: How much damage you deal Stamina: Your Life Armor: Uhh, armor, damage reduction as a value that increases your EHP (like in wc3) Agility: attack speed Spellpower: added to heals and spells Spell defense: spell damage reduction Intelligence: Mana Constitution: both life and mana regeneration (in uneqyal values) Speed: move speed Shield: The value of your shield
Creep/Terrain layout: my 3rd idea that is a big change from WC3, but might fix a long standing problem, is that of terrain layout. I am a terrible terrainer, so have no idea how far this will go... I would like to have "random" creep camps. Rather than 5 camps, 5 creeps each. Various sided camps all over the map. Heavy casters could bump from big ones to big ones, no problem. Melee passive farmers would also be able to pick up the stray creeps they find. This would allow passive farmers not to be overwhelmed if their opponent gets 2 levels on them; and it would also allow newbie players to kill a few creeps without getting rocked by 5 hard creeps at once. On this entire list; managing to do this in a balanced way honestly seems like the most difficult...
Creeps: Wc3 offers very many creeps, hundreds in fact. Sc2 has almost none; and even non-creep units are... battlecruisers. I will be lucky to find 15-20 usable skins for creeps. With that in mind, It would be very silly to copy/paste each creep and set its stats individually, to call it a different level. Why? Because SC2 editor can do something wc3 cant... Trigger changes to the base of units. ...the skinny of it is: - - I can simply make creeps able to level! I can make it so creeps level up based on the average hero level (same method used in CHA, except I dont have to make 350 creeps). I can set things to increase on the creeps as they level; damage, attack speed, life, armor, mana, shields, ect. I can even add and remove abilities for various levels. Once a creep hits 5, I can give him an ability that burns 20 mana. At level 7, I can replace it with one that deals 50. Though this is all POSSIBLE in wc3; it is much, much easier to do on sc2. On top of that, I can change the EXP rewarded for killing them, the bounty, and their scale size, so they get bigger as they level. Again, technically possible in wc3, but much easier now.
ITEMS: Everyone wants to know about items. They are a major part of CHA, and a big part of what makes the game complicated. Learning starting items is painful, having a new player on your team who spends the first 7 minutes looking through shops to see what items he wants later, and how to make them now.. dear god... Well, with the help of wrath, yiffs godlike voice saying "sounds much better than what we got" I present you with:
Upgradable items, and set item slots. That is, there will be set items that you have. Boots, armor, gloves, amulet, ring, helm, weapon, shield. you will START with all of these items in their basic form. From there, with your gold, you upgrade them. Say, you need to upgrade their base forms twice. Example: Worn boots 1: 30ms, pay 200g to upgrade them, worn boots 2: 40 ms, 200g to upgrade, worm boots3: 50ms. From there, you can pick which "tree" you want to gear towards with that item. Once you have your rank 3 3 boots, you can upgrade to say, "armored boots" which give armor, but little move speed, "lightweight boots" which give higher MS, or "agile boots" which offer a little evasion and medium movespeed. you upgrade them 3 times, say, 1000g per upgrade, and there might be a new tree, or new, final class of that item. Items of course will offer various stats, and have an upgrade tree that would fit any build type. If you decide you no longer want to be invested in a certain item/tree you can sell it; and the item is set back to rank 1. Essentially, you will never be buying items, only upgrades. Reasoning behind this? well, uhhh... No one would ever really be stuck in base for too long trying to make recipes or figure out which items they want. "shield shop" upgrades your shield! You have 3 shields to look at, and once you have one, you are set in your ways, unless you plan to sell. When in doubt, you can keep upgrading the same piece of armor, because it seems to be working for you. The concept here is that noobs can learn the game much more easily, but great players cannot easily master an item set.
Starting Gold: Also, open for debate, is starting gold. It is my opinion right now there there is NO STARTING GOLD. Because you will be able to build your own hero, I can simply allow players to start with enough stats to not be useless. If you got a few levels before an ally decides standing in base looking at all the pretty colors, well, you can handle yourself a little better than being level 1 in the same situation.
*I understand that in the above some units (30ms) are wc3 units of measurement. My following crowd is from WC3, and my game is from wc3, so, habit of using terms I am familliar with.