Try getting it to warp-in via Pylons, the same way a Warp Gate requires the Pylon energy fields to warp-in units. That data is in the game already; maybe it'd be a good idea to start there.
First of all, I love the Mass Recall project going on right now (led by Jones, Telenil, Jimm3110, etc.), and wish nothing more but its successful, glorious completion.
That being said, there's a few things that I've thought about changing, especially since, while playing some SCBW:MR missions, some aspects and possibilities from SC2 are completely thrown out the window for the sake of the "recall". For example, the Mercenary system utilized in the WoL Campaign. Seems like a great aspect that could be tied somehow into the original and Brood War campaigns. Then there are the literally TONS of unused or limited-use units from the Campaigns and the development process(es) of SC1, BW, SC2, and HotS that might just never see the light of day. Tons more stuff.
But that's for another day.
Well, I had a breakthrough while brainstorming, after I had read about how LotV will supposedly be based on a "diplomacy" mechanism, where Zeratul is supposed to unite/placate the different Protoss tribes.
I looked back on the many SC2 Protoss units, and found that there are some based off of the Aiur Khalai scheme (gold+blue), and some of the Dark Templar Nerazim scheme (silver+green).
Well, isn't Episode 4 of the Brood War campaign based on the fact that the Khalai and the Nerazim are getting back together and their technology is merging once again? So why don't the Nerazim have a different tech tree than the Khalai, or at least why do they have the same units with the same palette as the Khalai units?
So I basically created a parallel tech tree for the Nerazim, which contain several of the same units as the Khalai do, but which would have different models, skins, and stats. The Nerazim would end up studying Khalai tech while the player is off on a mission, then a certain branch or a certain unit of the Nerazim tech tree would be updated to contain that new unit for the subsequent missions. So long as the Protoss are together, they could choose to build either the Khalai variant or the Nerazim variant of a unit, but once they're separate so are their tech trees.
This would work even better once, say, Scenario 7 : The Insurgent , comes around. Instead of having just the High Templar, the Arbiters, and the Archons blocked from he Tech Tree, why not have the entire Khalai blocked and force the player to use Nerazim units? Of course, by that time the player will have the whole Nerazim tech tree unlocked, so it'd basically be Nerazim vs. Khalai for that mission.
And as a reward, Scenario 8 would have both tech trees in their entirety once again, just in time for the last mission.
That was basically my idea for a new take on the campaign; any interest in seeing this take place? Comments, critiques?
I'll post have I have so far for the parallel units:
Khalai / Nerazim = unlocked Scenario
NOTE: the "unlocked scenario" number is the number of the BW mission from Episode 4 where the player gets his/her earliest chance to produce that unit, not necessarily how early he/she get to use one in a mission without a Nexus and Probes. For this reason, Scenarios 1 and 5 are not found in the following list, and I think that Scenario 7 (The Insurgent) should have the whole tech tree unlocked.
Probe / (same name, maybe same model?) = 2 Zealot / Dark Templar (In truth, I think this is the best match for these two units.) = 2 Dragoon / Stalker (Yeah, nobody said that the units would completely parallel.) = 3 High Templar / ?? = ? Archon / Dark Archon (Archon is a fighter, Dark Archon is a specialist. Rebalancing is required.) = 7
Observer / ?? (same? Mechanoids don't really need to be that different between the two tribes IMO, but what could be altered here?) = 6? Reaver / ?? = 4? Shuttle / Star Relic (take away the rumored "Phasing Mode" abilities and the OP attack power) = 4
Scout / ?? (could actually be the Corsair, actually, in which case the as-of-yet unnamed Nerazim Arbiter unit would have to be a bomber unit) = 6 (but some used in 5) Carrier / Typhoon (Can't call it the "Tempest" because of the HotS unit, but this would theoretically be the same Tempest as the betas show.) = 7 Interceptor / Shuriken (Because we have yet to see a flying unit do melee damage that isn't suicidal.) = 7
Arbiter / ?? (unsure what, but something that works like the Oracle of HotS does) = ?
xx / Corsair (Introduced in Scenario 3 as the first new unit of Brood War. The fact that it was needed is probably explained by the fact that there is no Khalai parallel unit.) = 3
Oh, and an afterthought: The same way that SC2 randomly generates either a Dark Templar with a single blade or one with a double-scythe at random... that should apply to male / female Protoss infantry, too. Female Zealots, female Dark Templar, female High Templar, WHY NOT?
You probably answered this recently, but is there any tentative release date (on Mapster) for the next build of the mod (even if it isn't 2.0 yet)? This is such a great idea, and I'd like to get some balance testing done.
€ ah, I misunderstood. You talked about the availability for champions of specific unit types. Not sure, how I will handle that, but it will be hard to decide, which unit type deserves an associated champion. Giving every observer/warp prism/shuttle an own champion version might overdo it, but hell, I would love a probe champion :D
This is correct. I just couldn't find the right way to explain it, I guess. But I agree, having one Champion for every single unit might stretch the real need of Champions. (Champion Probe? Must see to believe!)
I didn't like, that I actually had to spend money on purchasing the option to get these mercenary units, then I had to wait a long time to even be able to recruit them...
Well, perhaps the Champion/Judicator could simply be unlocked automatically once you are allowed to begin mass-producing that unit (sorta like how WoL does it, minus spending Credits). Then again, it all depends on how the campaign progresses; if you introduce / focus on one particular new unit per mission in the campaign, it would work out that way. It all has to do with the format that you want it in.
Egal was wir Dir empfehlen, es ist Deine Projekt, Küken. Es ist alle Deine Entscheidung, was Du bei Deine eigene Projekt haben willst.
(If you can't understand that, sorry, but I read Germany in
<== your little description on the side.)
@WormArmy: Go Instead of applying a behavior that changes ownership, use a Modify Unit effect to do that. Its like only the effect really converts the ownership, the behavior lets you control it, but it doesnt count as yours for supplies, upgrades or anything else.
That's a better idea. SoulFilcher has more experience with this than I do.
I've thought of a few names for Champion ("Judicators" in HotS) units. Use them if you want:
Zealot => Devout (A zealot is a fighter for his/her religion; a devout is also dedicated)
Dragoon => Revenant (Dragoons are fallen fighters who come back; a revenant is a spirit that comes back from the world of the dead)
Dark Templar => Wight (Dark Templar act like ghosts in that they disappear quickly; wights are ghosts)
Arbiter => Prosecutor (An arbiter is a judge; a prosecutor is a offensive lawyer)
Other names to consider:
Myrmidon (A type of mercenary)
Paladin (A strong warrior)
Wyvern (Some flying unit)
Halberd (A good unit that can attack both vAir and vGround would be a best match, maybe a Scout Champion/Judicator)
Keep in mind that WoL has a maximum of 8 Mercenary options; the Protoss should also have 8 Champion/Judicator options. Also, the name of the building could be Champion's (or Judicator's) Hall, too.
Also, I think a Healer of some sort wouldn't be too bad of an idea. Something like a Medic but for Protoss, only it doesn't need to heal as quickly as a Medic can Heal a Terran unit because of their shields.
Additionally, why not bring back the Vindicator/Soul Hunter? Perhaps make them available as an option if there's some issue warping-in Dragoons/Stalkers/Immortals.
Ah, that could be an idea for a map: a battle inside a Cybernetics Core / Robotics Facility / wherever those units warp-in from, where you couldn't really use them because the facility is under attack and construction is halted.
Here's one way that I thought up. When this "Capture" gets triggered on a building, the building's control is reverted to that player.
Beyond that, you can disallow certain actions (or allow other actions) to each building, which is relatively easy to do.
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Try getting it to warp-in via Pylons, the same way a Warp Gate requires the Pylon energy fields to warp-in units. That data is in the game already; maybe it'd be a good idea to start there.
0
Hmm, well met EivindL. I'll try this baby out and send you the C+C via PM.
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First of all, I love the Mass Recall project going on right now (led by Jones, Telenil, Jimm3110, etc.), and wish nothing more but its successful, glorious completion.
That being said, there's a few things that I've thought about changing, especially since, while playing some SCBW:MR missions, some aspects and possibilities from SC2 are completely thrown out the window for the sake of the "recall". For example, the Mercenary system utilized in the WoL Campaign. Seems like a great aspect that could be tied somehow into the original and Brood War campaigns. Then there are the literally TONS of unused or limited-use units from the Campaigns and the development process(es) of SC1, BW, SC2, and HotS that might just never see the light of day. Tons more stuff.
But that's for another day.
Well, I had a breakthrough while brainstorming, after I had read about how LotV will supposedly be based on a "diplomacy" mechanism, where Zeratul is supposed to unite/placate the different Protoss tribes.
I looked back on the many SC2 Protoss units, and found that there are some based off of the Aiur Khalai scheme (gold+blue), and some of the Dark Templar Nerazim scheme (silver+green).
Well, isn't Episode 4 of the Brood War campaign based on the fact that the Khalai and the Nerazim are getting back together and their technology is merging once again? So why don't the Nerazim have a different tech tree than the Khalai, or at least why do they have the same units with the same palette as the Khalai units?
So I basically created a parallel tech tree for the Nerazim, which contain several of the same units as the Khalai do, but which would have different models, skins, and stats. The Nerazim would end up studying Khalai tech while the player is off on a mission, then a certain branch or a certain unit of the Nerazim tech tree would be updated to contain that new unit for the subsequent missions. So long as the Protoss are together, they could choose to build either the Khalai variant or the Nerazim variant of a unit, but once they're separate so are their tech trees.
This would work even better once, say, Scenario 7 : The Insurgent , comes around. Instead of having just the High Templar, the Arbiters, and the Archons blocked from he Tech Tree, why not have the entire Khalai blocked and force the player to use Nerazim units? Of course, by that time the player will have the whole Nerazim tech tree unlocked, so it'd basically be Nerazim vs. Khalai for that mission.
And as a reward, Scenario 8 would have both tech trees in their entirety once again, just in time for the last mission.
That was basically my idea for a new take on the campaign; any interest in seeing this take place? Comments, critiques?
I'll post have I have so far for the parallel units:
Khalai / Nerazim = unlocked Scenario
NOTE: the "unlocked scenario" number is the number of the BW mission from Episode 4 where the player gets his/her earliest chance to produce that unit, not necessarily how early he/she get to use one in a mission without a Nexus and Probes. For this reason, Scenarios 1 and 5 are not found in the following list, and I think that Scenario 7 (The Insurgent) should have the whole tech tree unlocked.
Probe / (same name, maybe same model?) = 2
Zealot / Dark Templar (In truth, I think this is the best match for these two units.) = 2
Dragoon / Stalker (Yeah, nobody said that the units would completely parallel.) = 3
High Templar / ?? = ?
Archon / Dark Archon (Archon is a fighter, Dark Archon is a specialist. Rebalancing is required.) = 7
Observer / ?? (same? Mechanoids don't really need to be that different between the two tribes IMO, but what could be altered here?) = 6?
Reaver / ?? = 4?
Shuttle / Star Relic (take away the rumored "Phasing Mode" abilities and the OP attack power) = 4
Scout / ?? (could actually be the Corsair, actually, in which case the as-of-yet unnamed Nerazim Arbiter unit would have to be a bomber unit) = 6 (but some used in 5)
Carrier / Typhoon (Can't call it the "Tempest" because of the HotS unit, but this would theoretically be the same Tempest as the betas show.) = 7
Interceptor / Shuriken (Because we have yet to see a flying unit do melee damage that isn't suicidal.) = 7
Arbiter / ?? (unsure what, but something that works like the Oracle of HotS does) = ?
xx / Corsair (Introduced in Scenario 3 as the first new unit of Brood War. The fact that it was needed is probably explained by the fact that there is no Khalai parallel unit.) = 3
Oh, and an afterthought: The same way that SC2 randomly generates either a Dark Templar with a single blade or one with a double-scythe at random... that should apply to male / female Protoss infantry, too. Female Zealots, female Dark Templar, female High Templar, WHY NOT?
0
You probably answered this recently, but is there any tentative release date (on Mapster) for the next build of the mod (even if it isn't 2.0 yet)? This is such a great idea, and I'd like to get some balance testing done.
0
You gonna wait like 3 years? HotS just came out, for goodness sakes.
0
This is correct. I just couldn't find the right way to explain it, I guess. But I agree, having one Champion for every single unit might stretch the real need of Champions. (Champion Probe? Must see to believe!)
Well, perhaps the Champion/Judicator could simply be unlocked automatically once you are allowed to begin mass-producing that unit (sorta like how WoL does it, minus spending Credits). Then again, it all depends on how the campaign progresses; if you introduce / focus on one particular new unit per mission in the campaign, it would work out that way. It all has to do with the format that you want it in.
Egal was wir Dir empfehlen, es ist Deine Projekt, Küken. Es ist alle Deine Entscheidung, was Du bei Deine eigene Projekt haben willst.
(If you can't understand that, sorry, but I read Germany in
<== your little description on the side.)
0
That's a better idea. SoulFilcher has more experience with this than I do.
0
@epicprawntime
I've thought of a few names for Champion ("Judicators" in HotS) units. Use them if you want:
Zealot => Devout (A zealot is a fighter for his/her religion; a devout is also dedicated)
Dragoon => Revenant (Dragoons are fallen fighters who come back; a revenant is a spirit that comes back from the world of the dead)
Dark Templar => Wight (Dark Templar act like ghosts in that they disappear quickly; wights are ghosts)
Arbiter => Prosecutor (An arbiter is a judge; a prosecutor is a offensive lawyer)
Other names to consider:
Myrmidon (A type of mercenary)
Paladin (A strong warrior)
Wyvern (Some flying unit)
Halberd (A good unit that can attack both vAir and vGround would be a best match, maybe a Scout Champion/Judicator)
Keep in mind that WoL has a maximum of 8 Mercenary options; the Protoss should also have 8 Champion/Judicator options. Also, the name of the building could be Champion's (or Judicator's) Hall, too.
Also, I think a Healer of some sort wouldn't be too bad of an idea. Something like a Medic but for Protoss, only it doesn't need to heal as quickly as a Medic can Heal a Terran unit because of their shields.
Additionally, why not bring back the Vindicator/Soul Hunter? Perhaps make them available as an option if there's some issue warping-in Dragoons/Stalkers/Immortals.
Ah, that could be an idea for a map: a battle inside a Cybernetics Core / Robotics Facility / wherever those units warp-in from, where you couldn't really use them because the facility is under attack and construction is halted.
Just a few ideas.
Hier gibt's viele gute Ideen, Küken.
0
Here's one way that I thought up. When this "Capture" gets triggered on a building, the building's control is reverted to that player.
Beyond that, you can disallow certain actions (or allow other actions) to each building, which is relatively easy to do.
0
@SoulFilcher: Go
Concerning permanent effects: Doesn't the Hive Mind Emulator (Campaign building) convert a non-worker foe permanently?