From what I've heard a lot of games announced this year are basically "yet another FPS/TPS where you just shoot like crazy and find cover, à la Gears of War", at least this game brings more than this and it looks really nice. Assassin's Creed looks interesting as well, I think Ubisoft is the most deserving company this year, that is if their games are as good as they look... Please Ubisoft, don't disappoint us again with another shitty DRM... Pretty please, with a sugar on top!
Back on topic now, I don't like the way Halo turns out... Sounds like the only option they found was to turn its scenario into another "we discover a civilization that will lead us straight to our doom". We should call it the Lost syndrom: When you lack of ideas, put some zombies or aliens in your story. In times of crisis, add both.
I'm still planning to go to Canada for a year, so yes. It was delayed for health reasons, but at some point this year (hopefully before September) I should be able to upload all my maps on the NA servers. If the Arcade allows cross-region, it should happen even sooner.
After reading reviews on the Arcade it looks like my maps are bugged. Localization doesn't work well and I don't know how to fix it. I heard editing the MPQ is not safe, so I'm looking for a better way to do this... Any clue?
EDIT: Because of the absurdity of the situation, I've decided to remove both The Last Hour and Ikari Warriors from the Arcade beta (temporarily, until I find a work around). I'd rather not publish them instead of having my maps flamed because localization is not done properly, thus making the maps completely unplayable... I tried SC2Localizer, but then publishing was forbidden for the following reasons:
The term "Slave" is prohibited in Spanish (esMX)... OK, fair enough.
The term "own " is prohibited in Spanish (esMX)... You've got to be kidding me...
The term "trans" is prohibited in Italian (itIT)... So basically "transport" is prohibited? Way to go, censorship!
I'll probably have to make proper translations but I obviously do not speak italian or spanish well enough to do this, so... I'll find another way. Until then, sorry but you'll have to stick to the versions published on the "official" servers, not the 1.5 beta...
Since this map made it to the front page of SC2Mapster (thanks Zeldarules, for being the curious type), I'm keeping a trace here of the feedback I've received so far, from reviews on the Arcade beta:
The beginning of the game is kind of slow and boring (I agree on that one and I really need to fix it ASAP)
"Balancing issues" (whatever that means, anyway I guess it's either too easy or too hard for the guy)
¿Qué tengo que hacer, senior? (literally, "what do I have to do?!?!"... sigh, kids these days...)
I did it on another map, but it doesn't seem to change much... Looks like hiding the lobby just does literally what it's meant for: skipping the lobby to be able to enter the game more quickly (thus enabling streaming).
The lag with model loading from hard disk was always existent. Try to add more to the preload or create and kill units with different effects to force a loading of the most common models in your map.
I already have (in Ikari Warriors, at least). I have an entire trigger dedicated to preloading models and VFXs used on the fly (drop pods etc)... It did improve the map back at the time, but with patch 1.5 it looks like the latency is back again... actually it's even worse because it even happens when placed units die or have any change applied to them! That's why I'm suspecting streaming, but maybe it's something completely unrelated. I don't know why my HDDs could be the cause (they work fine with D3 and other games), but who knows...
In Ikari Warriors, I noticed my projectiles are not working correctly anymore... Basically it should be a projectile going in a straight line, but now it just stops where the target is (or was) instead of continuing beyond that point as it should. It even remains at the target for a few seconds before vanishing, fortunately it doesn't check collisions once it has reached its target so it won't blow on your face if you stand next to it. There is also a problem with height, it seems like the projectile goes completely wild when it goess up/down a cliff and the target (unit?) is not on the same spot anymore... I have no idea where to start to fix this.
There are also issues with localization, seems like applying a text to all locales doesn't really work from within the editor. I have the EnglishUK version of the game, but since the beta runs in EnglishUS, I can't see any text properly. The weird thing though is that other players can, as far as I know... So it may just be me.
I also encountered a lot of issues with data just like SoulFicher, basically buttons not showing the name or tooltip correctly. I also had a custom unit based on the ghost (with laser line) and even though it has a different name (sniper) it is named "ghost" while playing. Some abilities/behaviors (buffs) are also displayed as "unknown" ingame if you check their tooltip, but I think their effects still apply anyway. For some reason I also had a few issues with the Train ability on a customized barracks, it seems like some buttons have been switched for no reason, like a button being replaced by the button for a completely different unit AND producing a unit that wasn't even close to any unit it should be.
The lag has increased (probably due to the streaming system), which makes any WASD movement completely unplayable. I've noticed more than a second of delay sometimes, between pressing the key and seeing its effect applied! Units created via triggers also make the game lag for a few seconds while its model is being loaded for the first time. Same goes for VFXs (explosions, bloodsplats and such)... I think I'm going to hate the streaming system from now on...
Gameplay based on luck is the worst gameplay you could find, in terms of game design. As people said before me, the problem is you can end up with a terrible combo and you'll probably lose, or have the best combo and people will most certainly hate you and rage quit. Let's have a look at Diablo 3 for a second: some parts are randomized in this game, but if you look closely they're actually presets/patterns repeated a certain amount of time, with a probably of showing which is set for the current game. This is as far as randomness should go, I advise VERY STRONGLY you do not give a 100% randomized army to each player...
If you really want to make the game different each time it's played, let the game pick among a few presets of units you've made. It goes without saying you will have to define these presets so that it can basically counter any kind of preset that the opponent can have, or players will feel like it's either way too hard or way too easy, not because they played badly but because luck was (or wasn't) on their side. Frustrating gameplay is neither fun or addictive, people will just hate it after 2 or 3 attempts at getting a decent combo... The more units there are, the less they'll get lucky.
However, if you REALLY REALLY want to make something random, as far as I know nobody has ever done a "Welcome to Las Vegas" kind of map, where you'd have to use your cash in machines (black jack, jackpot, poker, you name it...). It should be quite easy to make a game where players would have to bet in a series of card/money games to earn tokens, then use these tokens as resources to train units and/or build structures! You will still have to figure what to do when players are completely broke (if they just lose, they'll hate the game), and to make sure they have at least one source of permanent income to stand long enough against rushing idiots.
...and I can tell you the article is right. Game designers have a slight notion of cognitive sciences. This is something we actually study a bit to make it through game design graduation. I repeated it very often around here, but not anyone can become a good game/level designer. There are things like this you won't learn by yourself just by making custom maps, because you didn't even know there was a strong link between cognitive sciences and video games.
Basically, by "slight notion of cognitive sciences" I mean we know how brains work and what makes them want something. I said it earlier on other topics but it's a loop of fun, then challenge, then reward, all mixed up with a little bit of frustration to make you want even more. Pretty much like training your dog to jump over a fence for a candy, making a donkey walk for miles with a carrot on a stick, or inviting your hamster to pass through a maze of tubes before reaching his wheel. Yes, it's that insulting and demeaning. We're conditioning players to spend more time on our products and we force them to wish for more so that they'll end up loving it anyway, and will be in the mood to spend more money... Yes we're gurus, yes you're being brainwashed.
It works just like any media, in case you didn't notice. Look at your TV programs with their sponsors and advertisements, look how long it takes before a movie starts in any cinema, how many papers are dropped in our mailboxes... We advertise things because, when people are in a good mood for it (like "we've been waiting for this game for 15 years"), it will purely and simply work without any effort. People happy with their life won't buy, you buy things in HOPE to make your life better (basically, looking for fun because "life sucks"). This entire "parade" is just here to make people buy more, and trust me it works or they wouldn't spend millions in it! Once you're a little bit more aware of this scam you tend to buy less frenetically, and you're less affected by advertisement, but it doesn't make your life any better so you'll fall back into it at some point... I recommend the movie "99 Francs" which is partially about how manipulative the medias can be:
Of course not all video games are following this "make the player enjoy it like a hamster" policy on purpose, but they're still fucking with your brain anyway. Look at how Minecraft is done (farm like the crazy digger you are in dangerous caves, in search for the rare minerals needed to build this awesome whatever-it-is you don't even need but is supposed to make your life better), you'll understand pretty fast why it's so addictive even to casual players... Look at how Skyrim made us spend hours in search for quests and people to loot. Look at how Nintendo games are made: they're ugly but FUN, and that's exactly what people expect from video games. Fun, challenge, reward, and counter the "life sucks" effect at least for a moment. That's it.
disabled buffs cannot be affected by the Remove Behavior effect.
Dude, you just helped me find the source of a bug that's been pissing me off since forever. I would never have guessed it was coming from this. Thanks! (I still need to find a way to make the behavior last for a minute no matter if it's been disabled or not though, but at least I know where to look now!).
Now if only we could ENGULF THE POPULARITY SYSTEM then we'd be set.
Now that I think about it, maybe the popularity system isn't so bad. I mean yes, it is, but it could work IF there were more shoutcasters like Husky, Day9, or Pomf&Thud (shoutcasters of the Iron Squid tournament), or whoever, spending time on interesting custom maps and presenting them to a large audience.
There is nobody so far who's famous enough in the e-sports scene who would actually show custom maps regularly on their channel, so that the maps that deserve some popularity will get it. I've noticed how popular the MonoBattles maps became famous when Day9 talked about them, and the same happened when Pomf&Thud spoke of Star Strikers.
Let's be honest here, as a player we generally don't care about random maps, we just want something new, something fun to play that won't take days to finish. That's what the popularity system is partially about, what it does is put on top the map that players spent the most time on. The issue is that new and fun to play maps (which is mainly what we're focused on around here) are almost ignored in the process.
I really think we need shoutcasters to help us a bit on that part. SC2Mapster members streaming our own maps is nice but won't get us much attention, because we're basically sharing it among ourselves... We need someone who already has a huge number of followers, willing to help our community (and not only the mappers from the TL forums who are dedicated mostly to melee maps). My point being: too much e-sport kills the custom maps scene.
It depends if the issue only occurs with a specific map, or with any map you create. Try creating a new map from scratch just for testing purpose, put a few marines, zerglings, and zealots (owned by the same player at first, then try a little mix including neutrals, hostiles and such), and see what happens (don't forget to remove the initial trigger starting the melee rules). Have you tested your map on BNet or just by launching it directly from the editor? Have you edited anything in the actor events that could remove a unit somehow when it's being built/created/placed? Do you use a mod for your map that is not a standard mod from Blizzard?
I once did a Zelda clone with this program. Even though I haven't used this engine for something like 3 or 4 years now (if not more), maybe I can help...
I'm not sure if it's exactly what you're trying to achieve, but I use the default melee AI in The Last Hour without actually having control of workers or a base, or even the winning conditions like in the usual melee rules. It just helps computer players handle groups of units and their abilities/behaviors while hunting down enemies and protecting the structures and allies. I'm not entirely sure yet, but I think you can also make some trigger actions from the AI category (and AI advanced) work.
It's a little bit of a cheat, but basically you just have to place a SCV/probe/drone somewhere on your map (owned by the computer player that needs AI), hide it and make it unavailable for attack waves (unit properties in the editor), pause it (trigger action to prevent him from attacking units in range while in game). The presence of the worker itself initiates the melee AI for the owning computer player, as long as you have the "start the melee AI" action somewhere in one of your triggers and this player has a starting point.
I've spent half a day figuring out what makes an AI actually starts, it looks like you CAN'T make the AI work unless the player owns a worker somewhere and a starting point. So if you want the AI to work, but have no need for a SCV/probe/drone, just make sure it's hidden, unavailable for attacks, and paused. The only issue I've found so far is that when you check a replay of one of your games, the worker seems to be counted in the units panel even though it's not a unit that can be used in any way.
(perform a check here that will test if someone has won, in which case you have to break the loop)
Create a timer
Wait until timer expires
Set a couple of variables (basically which one of the X players should be playing next, based on an integer variable that will be incremented every turn, then reset to 1 to at some point to let the first player take his next turn)
Check if it's a player's turn then do actions accordingly: either pause its units/commands (if it's not his turn), or let him do whatever he wants (if he's playing)
...It's very generic because it's hard to tell what you're trying to achieve besides the time-based turns system. But basically, the idea behind a turn-based system is to repeat a loop that will execute a few actions, according to a few variables changing every time a new player takes his turn.
0
From what I've heard a lot of games announced this year are basically "yet another FPS/TPS where you just shoot like crazy and find cover, à la Gears of War", at least this game brings more than this and it looks really nice. Assassin's Creed looks interesting as well, I think Ubisoft is the most deserving company this year, that is if their games are as good as they look... Please Ubisoft, don't disappoint us again with another shitty DRM... Pretty please, with a sugar on top!
0
You made my day, Moz'...
Back on topic now, I don't like the way Halo turns out... Sounds like the only option they found was to turn its scenario into another "we discover a civilization that will lead us straight to our doom". We should call it the Lost syndrom: When you lack of ideas, put some zombies or aliens in your story. In times of crisis, add both.
0
@Sandman366: Go
I'm still planning to go to Canada for a year, so yes. It was delayed for health reasons, but at some point this year (hopefully before September) I should be able to upload all my maps on the NA servers. If the Arcade allows cross-region, it should happen even sooner.
After reading reviews on the Arcade it looks like my maps are bugged. Localization doesn't work well and I don't know how to fix it. I heard editing the MPQ is not safe, so I'm looking for a better way to do this... Any clue?
EDIT: Because of the absurdity of the situation, I've decided to remove both The Last Hour and Ikari Warriors from the Arcade beta (temporarily, until I find a work around). I'd rather not publish them instead of having my maps flamed because localization is not done properly, thus making the maps completely unplayable... I tried SC2Localizer, but then publishing was forbidden for the following reasons:
I'll probably have to make proper translations but I obviously do not speak italian or spanish well enough to do this, so... I'll find another way. Until then, sorry but you'll have to stick to the versions published on the "official" servers, not the 1.5 beta...
0
Since this map made it to the front page of SC2Mapster (thanks Zeldarules, for being the curious type), I'm keeping a trace here of the feedback I've received so far, from reviews on the Arcade beta:
0
I did it on another map, but it doesn't seem to change much... Looks like hiding the lobby just does literally what it's meant for: skipping the lobby to be able to enter the game more quickly (thus enabling streaming).
I already have (in Ikari Warriors, at least). I have an entire trigger dedicated to preloading models and VFXs used on the fly (drop pods etc)... It did improve the map back at the time, but with patch 1.5 it looks like the latency is back again... actually it's even worse because it even happens when placed units die or have any change applied to them! That's why I'm suspecting streaming, but maybe it's something completely unrelated. I don't know why my HDDs could be the cause (they work fine with D3 and other games), but who knows...
0
Here's another one... I kind of felt like it fitted with the current topic (since everyone is trolling like a champ).
http://www.rferl.org/content/russian-internet-sensation-mr-trololo-dies-eduard-khil/24602718.html
...You're welcome. (guys, this thread is seriously going nowhere...)
0
In Ikari Warriors, I noticed my projectiles are not working correctly anymore... Basically it should be a projectile going in a straight line, but now it just stops where the target is (or was) instead of continuing beyond that point as it should. It even remains at the target for a few seconds before vanishing, fortunately it doesn't check collisions once it has reached its target so it won't blow on your face if you stand next to it. There is also a problem with height, it seems like the projectile goes completely wild when it goess up/down a cliff and the target (unit?) is not on the same spot anymore... I have no idea where to start to fix this.
There are also issues with localization, seems like applying a text to all locales doesn't really work from within the editor. I have the EnglishUK version of the game, but since the beta runs in EnglishUS, I can't see any text properly. The weird thing though is that other players can, as far as I know... So it may just be me.
I also encountered a lot of issues with data just like SoulFicher, basically buttons not showing the name or tooltip correctly. I also had a custom unit based on the ghost (with laser line) and even though it has a different name (sniper) it is named "ghost" while playing. Some abilities/behaviors (buffs) are also displayed as "unknown" ingame if you check their tooltip, but I think their effects still apply anyway. For some reason I also had a few issues with the Train ability on a customized barracks, it seems like some buttons have been switched for no reason, like a button being replaced by the button for a completely different unit AND producing a unit that wasn't even close to any unit it should be.
The lag has increased (probably due to the streaming system), which makes any WASD movement completely unplayable. I've noticed more than a second of delay sometimes, between pressing the key and seeing its effect applied! Units created via triggers also make the game lag for a few seconds while its model is being loaded for the first time. Same goes for VFXs (explosions, bloodsplats and such)... I think I'm going to hate the streaming system from now on...
0
Gameplay based on luck is the worst gameplay you could find, in terms of game design. As people said before me, the problem is you can end up with a terrible combo and you'll probably lose, or have the best combo and people will most certainly hate you and rage quit. Let's have a look at Diablo 3 for a second: some parts are randomized in this game, but if you look closely they're actually presets/patterns repeated a certain amount of time, with a probably of showing which is set for the current game. This is as far as randomness should go, I advise VERY STRONGLY you do not give a 100% randomized army to each player...
If you really want to make the game different each time it's played, let the game pick among a few presets of units you've made. It goes without saying you will have to define these presets so that it can basically counter any kind of preset that the opponent can have, or players will feel like it's either way too hard or way too easy, not because they played badly but because luck was (or wasn't) on their side. Frustrating gameplay is neither fun or addictive, people will just hate it after 2 or 3 attempts at getting a decent combo... The more units there are, the less they'll get lucky.
However, if you REALLY REALLY want to make something random, as far as I know nobody has ever done a "Welcome to Las Vegas" kind of map, where you'd have to use your cash in machines (black jack, jackpot, poker, you name it...). It should be quite easy to make a game where players would have to bet in a series of card/money games to earn tokens, then use these tokens as resources to train units and/or build structures! You will still have to figure what to do when players are completely broke (if they just lose, they'll hate the game), and to make sure they have at least one source of permanent income to stand long enough against rushing idiots.
0
...and I can tell you the article is right. Game designers have a slight notion of cognitive sciences. This is something we actually study a bit to make it through game design graduation. I repeated it very often around here, but not anyone can become a good game/level designer. There are things like this you won't learn by yourself just by making custom maps, because you didn't even know there was a strong link between cognitive sciences and video games.
Basically, by "slight notion of cognitive sciences" I mean we know how brains work and what makes them want something. I said it earlier on other topics but it's a loop of fun, then challenge, then reward, all mixed up with a little bit of frustration to make you want even more. Pretty much like training your dog to jump over a fence for a candy, making a donkey walk for miles with a carrot on a stick, or inviting your hamster to pass through a maze of tubes before reaching his wheel. Yes, it's that insulting and demeaning. We're conditioning players to spend more time on our products and we force them to wish for more so that they'll end up loving it anyway, and will be in the mood to spend more money... Yes we're gurus, yes you're being brainwashed.
It works just like any media, in case you didn't notice. Look at your TV programs with their sponsors and advertisements, look how long it takes before a movie starts in any cinema, how many papers are dropped in our mailboxes... We advertise things because, when people are in a good mood for it (like "we've been waiting for this game for 15 years"), it will purely and simply work without any effort. People happy with their life won't buy, you buy things in HOPE to make your life better (basically, looking for fun because "life sucks"). This entire "parade" is just here to make people buy more, and trust me it works or they wouldn't spend millions in it! Once you're a little bit more aware of this scam you tend to buy less frenetically, and you're less affected by advertisement, but it doesn't make your life any better so you'll fall back into it at some point... I recommend the movie "99 Francs" which is partially about how manipulative the medias can be:
Of course not all video games are following this "make the player enjoy it like a hamster" policy on purpose, but they're still fucking with your brain anyway. Look at how Minecraft is done (farm like the crazy digger you are in dangerous caves, in search for the rare minerals needed to build this awesome whatever-it-is you don't even need but is supposed to make your life better), you'll understand pretty fast why it's so addictive even to casual players... Look at how Skyrim made us spend hours in search for quests and people to loot. Look at how Nintendo games are made: they're ugly but FUN, and that's exactly what people expect from video games. Fun, challenge, reward, and counter the "life sucks" effect at least for a moment. That's it.
0
Dude, you just helped me find the source of a bug that's been pissing me off since forever. I would never have guessed it was coming from this. Thanks! (I still need to find a way to make the behavior last for a minute no matter if it's been disabled or not though, but at least I know where to look now!).
0
Now that I think about it, maybe the popularity system isn't so bad. I mean yes, it is, but it could work IF there were more shoutcasters like Husky, Day9, or Pomf&Thud (shoutcasters of the Iron Squid tournament), or whoever, spending time on interesting custom maps and presenting them to a large audience.
There is nobody so far who's famous enough in the e-sports scene who would actually show custom maps regularly on their channel, so that the maps that deserve some popularity will get it. I've noticed how popular the MonoBattles maps became famous when Day9 talked about them, and the same happened when Pomf&Thud spoke of Star Strikers.
Let's be honest here, as a player we generally don't care about random maps, we just want something new, something fun to play that won't take days to finish. That's what the popularity system is partially about, what it does is put on top the map that players spent the most time on. The issue is that new and fun to play maps (which is mainly what we're focused on around here) are almost ignored in the process.
I really think we need shoutcasters to help us a bit on that part. SC2Mapster members streaming our own maps is nice but won't get us much attention, because we're basically sharing it among ourselves... We need someone who already has a huge number of followers, willing to help our community (and not only the mappers from the TL forums who are dedicated mostly to melee maps). My point being: too much e-sport kills the custom maps scene.
0
It depends if the issue only occurs with a specific map, or with any map you create. Try creating a new map from scratch just for testing purpose, put a few marines, zerglings, and zealots (owned by the same player at first, then try a little mix including neutrals, hostiles and such), and see what happens (don't forget to remove the initial trigger starting the melee rules). Have you tested your map on BNet or just by launching it directly from the editor? Have you edited anything in the actor events that could remove a unit somehow when it's being built/created/placed? Do you use a mod for your map that is not a standard mod from Blizzard?
0
I once did a Zelda clone with this program. Even though I haven't used this engine for something like 3 or 4 years now (if not more), maybe I can help...
0
I'm not sure if it's exactly what you're trying to achieve, but I use the default melee AI in The Last Hour without actually having control of workers or a base, or even the winning conditions like in the usual melee rules. It just helps computer players handle groups of units and their abilities/behaviors while hunting down enemies and protecting the structures and allies. I'm not entirely sure yet, but I think you can also make some trigger actions from the AI category (and AI advanced) work.
It's a little bit of a cheat, but basically you just have to place a SCV/probe/drone somewhere on your map (owned by the computer player that needs AI), hide it and make it unavailable for attack waves (unit properties in the editor), pause it (trigger action to prevent him from attacking units in range while in game). The presence of the worker itself initiates the melee AI for the owning computer player, as long as you have the "start the melee AI" action somewhere in one of your triggers and this player has a starting point.
I've spent half a day figuring out what makes an AI actually starts, it looks like you CAN'T make the AI work unless the player owns a worker somewhere and a starting point. So if you want the AI to work, but have no need for a SCV/probe/drone, just make sure it's hidden, unavailable for attacks, and paused. The only issue I've found so far is that when you check a replay of one of your games, the worker seems to be counted in the units panel even though it's not a unit that can be used in any way.
0
Repeat forever:
...It's very generic because it's hard to tell what you're trying to achieve besides the time-based turns system. But basically, the idea behind a turn-based system is to repeat a loop that will execute a few actions, according to a few variables changing every time a new player takes his turn.