Remember guys we have nothing against the mappers who made the winning maps, just complaining about blizzard choices.
And now we have the final comic part...
"Hey guys, I'm Mr. Blizzard and I gave you a cool keyboard / mouse movements but wait, if you used that features your map is disqualified because the game lags thanks to me"
just... LOL
Using single player map test??? Was that too hard?
P.S.
Arent't MAD and Photon Command using mouse click laggy controls? :D
Maybe that was harder to detect!
MAD and Photon Command didn't lag any more than a normal game on battle.net. They use a simple click which isn't as laggy as a loop checking for WASD keys or mouselook. In general, games using WASD movement have to be very responsive in order not to feel sluggish, and use client-side recognition instead of an authorative server like Blizzard is doing.
Blizzard didn't give us tools specifically for WASD movement, they gave us the tools to do almost anything. Map makers are simply creative in finding ways to use these tools, and one of those ways was to use triggers/data to detect keyboard input and order unit movement in a loop, a clever way of using WASD movement. Unfortunately it lags, but there are plenty of things you can do in the editor which will lag and be unresponsive, not just WASD movement.
And of course Blizzard wanted maps which were responsive and playable. Saying that Blizzard gave us the tools which causes a map to be disqualified is stretching it... very far. They wanted quick maps which could be played on battle.net and were easy to get into, simple as that. I think their map choices for this was great, but they could've been a bit more clear on this though.
The good news is Blizzard plans to implement a much better system for WASD movement (and possibly mouselook), but it will never feel as good or responsive on battle.net due to the authorative server as it will in single player.
Wow... that seems weird. Have you tried with an actual player? It's kind of difficult to pinpoint why that happens without seeing the code. There might be others here who have experienced this specific bug though.
Hey, noticed this thread and I thought I'd just throw in my 2 cents to this topic. Also I was lucky enough to run into one of the custom map contest judges at Blizzcon and had a chat with him.
500 entries are a lot to go through, but they managed to cut quite a few of them early on. One of the important things were what they were going to use the maps for. Basically the winning maps were set up on 16-20 pc's where people at Blizzcon could get in line and play them for about 15 mins before moving on. It was important that the player could sit down and immediately understand what was going on and get into the game, having a meaningful experience in the limited amount of time they could play. As such, a lot of the maps which required a lot of explanation/choices and/or wasn't easy to understand right off the bat were removed, as well as maps taking a long time to play.
Then there were a lot of maps which bugged out instantly when launching them, which could be because of poor design or that a patch broke them. There were maps which used WASD or other designs which lagged too much and didn't work well in multiplayer/battle.net, and they were also removed. After narrowing it down further they had to playtest the maps a lot making sure it didn't contain inappropriate content or totally crash/bug if you did specific things.
In the end I wouldn't disagree with anyone saying there were better maps out there, whether it's because they were more fun, or because they had more work put into them. But as Blizzard stated in the contest, the winning maps would be playable at Blizzcon, and as such they had to find entries which would suit the "Drive-By playing" they had planned. Did they pick the best maps for this? That's a matter of personal opinion I guess, but saying that maps like Photon Command and Zergling Round-Up were horrible and didn't deserve to win is very unfair in my opinion, when in fact they seemed like good choices for Blizzard's purpose. I saw with my own eyes many people sitting down and having fun playing all of the community maps.
Now, aside from mentioning that the winning maps would be played at Blizzcon, could Blizzard have been more specific of what they were looking for? Probably. But this is the first time Blizzard is doing something like this, and it's a learning experience for them as well as for us.
As for MAD winning, I can't really argue for or against it since it's my entry, but I will say a couple of things just so we can have more facts on the table. It was released during the SC2 Beta under the name RAD, and anyone who had access to the Beta could play it. Did this count as released or not to Blizzard? I don't know, but to put things in perspective; everyone with access to the Beta could also play Starcraft 2, and Starcraft 2 wasn't a released game. Maybe only the maps released in retail counted as released.
So when SC2 went retail I wanted to release RAD, but someone else had occupied the name, and as such it was delayed. That's why I changed the name to MAD, but I didn't get around to releasing it. Later on a lot of people (people here at mapster and friends, etc) recommended I send my map into the contest, so I did. Should it have been disqualified? It was never out in retail, so I don't know. Maybe, maybe not. I don't want to defend MAD winning, but I hope people want the facts on the table before jumping to conclusions.
In the end I hope people can enjoy both the contest winners as well as all the entries as they are released on battle.net without thinking of who should've won and not. They're all great maps, and if there are things we don't like we should be helping each other making them better, not trashing them and end up discouraging people from making maps.
If your map lags like hell on battle.net after the patch, you're experiencing the I did.
I couldn't understand why, because it worked great before, so I started deleting chunks of triggers, deleted the game variants, reseted all data fields, removed all regions, points and doodads, heck I even flattened the terrain...
Basically my map was completely stripped with 1 marine in it, and it still lagged.
And then I finally found it:
----------
Map Loading Screen:
You can choose between Melee/Custom, but if you want to use custom (like most of us do),
'Wait for key' must be checked. If it's unchecked, the map desyncs with battle.net somehow and causes extreme lag.
----------
Hope this helps, it certainly did for me and several others.
Now I'm finally able to upload Rocket Arena Deluxe! Hope to see you ingame :)
0
@OneTwoSC: Go
Awesome tutorial mate, this is definitely something I'll use at some point! :)
0
MAD and Photon Command didn't lag any more than a normal game on battle.net. They use a simple click which isn't as laggy as a loop checking for WASD keys or mouselook. In general, games using WASD movement have to be very responsive in order not to feel sluggish, and use client-side recognition instead of an authorative server like Blizzard is doing.
Blizzard didn't give us tools specifically for WASD movement, they gave us the tools to do almost anything. Map makers are simply creative in finding ways to use these tools, and one of those ways was to use triggers/data to detect keyboard input and order unit movement in a loop, a clever way of using WASD movement. Unfortunately it lags, but there are plenty of things you can do in the editor which will lag and be unresponsive, not just WASD movement.
And of course Blizzard wanted maps which were responsive and playable. Saying that Blizzard gave us the tools which causes a map to be disqualified is stretching it... very far. They wanted quick maps which could be played on battle.net and were easy to get into, simple as that. I think their map choices for this was great, but they could've been a bit more clear on this though.
The good news is Blizzard plans to implement a much better system for WASD movement (and possibly mouselook), but it will never feel as good or responsive on battle.net due to the authorative server as it will in single player.
0
@Phrosen: Go
Try experimenting with the variants. Start basic, test, add a few things, test again, and so on, until it bugs. Maybe you can figure out what's wrong.
0
@Phrosen: Go
Wow... that seems weird. Have you tried with an actual player? It's kind of difficult to pinpoint why that happens without seeing the code. There might be others here who have experienced this specific bug though.
0
Hey, noticed this thread and I thought I'd just throw in my 2 cents to this topic. Also I was lucky enough to run into one of the custom map contest judges at Blizzcon and had a chat with him.
500 entries are a lot to go through, but they managed to cut quite a few of them early on. One of the important things were what they were going to use the maps for. Basically the winning maps were set up on 16-20 pc's where people at Blizzcon could get in line and play them for about 15 mins before moving on. It was important that the player could sit down and immediately understand what was going on and get into the game, having a meaningful experience in the limited amount of time they could play. As such, a lot of the maps which required a lot of explanation/choices and/or wasn't easy to understand right off the bat were removed, as well as maps taking a long time to play.
Then there were a lot of maps which bugged out instantly when launching them, which could be because of poor design or that a patch broke them. There were maps which used WASD or other designs which lagged too much and didn't work well in multiplayer/battle.net, and they were also removed. After narrowing it down further they had to playtest the maps a lot making sure it didn't contain inappropriate content or totally crash/bug if you did specific things.
In the end I wouldn't disagree with anyone saying there were better maps out there, whether it's because they were more fun, or because they had more work put into them. But as Blizzard stated in the contest, the winning maps would be playable at Blizzcon, and as such they had to find entries which would suit the "Drive-By playing" they had planned. Did they pick the best maps for this? That's a matter of personal opinion I guess, but saying that maps like Photon Command and Zergling Round-Up were horrible and didn't deserve to win is very unfair in my opinion, when in fact they seemed like good choices for Blizzard's purpose. I saw with my own eyes many people sitting down and having fun playing all of the community maps.
Now, aside from mentioning that the winning maps would be played at Blizzcon, could Blizzard have been more specific of what they were looking for? Probably. But this is the first time Blizzard is doing something like this, and it's a learning experience for them as well as for us.
As for MAD winning, I can't really argue for or against it since it's my entry, but I will say a couple of things just so we can have more facts on the table. It was released during the SC2 Beta under the name RAD, and anyone who had access to the Beta could play it. Did this count as released or not to Blizzard? I don't know, but to put things in perspective; everyone with access to the Beta could also play Starcraft 2, and Starcraft 2 wasn't a released game. Maybe only the maps released in retail counted as released.
So when SC2 went retail I wanted to release RAD, but someone else had occupied the name, and as such it was delayed. That's why I changed the name to MAD, but I didn't get around to releasing it. Later on a lot of people (people here at mapster and friends, etc) recommended I send my map into the contest, so I did. Should it have been disqualified? It was never out in retail, so I don't know. Maybe, maybe not. I don't want to defend MAD winning, but I hope people want the facts on the table before jumping to conclusions.
In the end I hope people can enjoy both the contest winners as well as all the entries as they are released on battle.net without thinking of who should've won and not. They're all great maps, and if there are things we don't like we should be helping each other making them better, not trashing them and end up discouraging people from making maps.
0
@RainGame: Go
Happy to help! :)
0
After a ton of testing I found the problem. Posted it here:
http://forums.sc2mapster.com/development/map-development/4790-map-lag-bug-workaround/
Hope this helps. :)
0
If your map lags like hell on battle.net after the patch, you're experiencing the I did.
I couldn't understand why, because it worked great before, so I started deleting chunks of triggers, deleted the game variants, reseted all data fields, removed all regions, points and doodads, heck I even flattened the terrain...
Basically my map was completely stripped with 1 marine in it, and it still lagged. And then I finally found it:
----------Map Loading Screen:
You can choose between Melee/Custom, but if you want to use custom (like most of us do),
'Wait for key' must be checked. If it's unchecked, the map desyncs with battle.net somehow and causes extreme lag.
----------Hope this helps, it certainly did for me and several others.
Now I'm finally able to upload Rocket Arena Deluxe! Hope to see you ingame :)