I've been criticized heavily for 'stealing' a map or plastering my name on a map that i've edited and popularized. I actually went through the necessary steps in getting the authors permission to edit his map. Also, that same author was the one that taught me everything on map editing back in Starcraft 1. So I've encountered those situations before. Having good intentions or not, editing someone's map is stealing and it is wrong. It is also unnecessary to show any kind of hostility towards the map stealer. The damage is done and there is nothing you can do.
Alongside with map stealing comes map evolutions. Some maps that have tons potential deviations are eventually made and you will find yourself playing different versions of the same map 'idea'. Would you call that map stealing? How about all those Cat and mouse, cannon D map versions. The first author who created the cat and mouse didn't want different maps however, the map itself is really easy to recreate and mappers found many ideas to implement on the CnM to keep it fresh.
So there is really a blur line between map stealing reinvention and pure original creation. What is funny is that I would browse playdota.com forums and read the many posts like "League of Legends is a fail clone" "Heroes of Newerth is a crime". DotA evolved from a STARCRAFT map, Aeon of strife. So what gives that community to declare things clones when they are playing just a evolved version of a blizzard map? (Don't get me wrong, DotA is really fun)
The answer is mutual agreement to a map genre. Once Starcraft and Age of Empires 2 came out, many Tower Defense maps were made, mainly because that was what you can make creatively at that time. Blizzard then creates an official TD map and publishes it with Warcraft and then you eventually see tons of flash made TD game version inevitably having its own genre.
Okay back to the original post/thread. Taking a map idea and changing IS stealing and it IS wrong but inadvertently when there is many fun variations it becomes a certain group of maps (ie map genre). Some cases fit this general trend (TD maps) which we all don't care. And in some cases its when that unique map published like an distinct RPG or RP and someone copies the EXACT same one and adds 99999 minerals to player one =/
Over run is a defensive map where the objective is to not allow comp to destroy the center tower. There are 4 humans players, each player is responsible of fending off one side as waves of unit enemies come flooding in.
Overall, I enjoy the game especially its replay value and variety of tactics. Unlike most TD maps, there are actually many viable strategies in successfully fending off the invaders. Being able to play the game differently each time keeps the game fresh. TD map Tank D, it is easy and too common strat to get that early immortal.
I enjoy the unique game's challenge progression. You upgrade buildings to build better units but at the same time it RESTRICTS you from producing other unit.
Lol, it is like the evolution of evees:
If you evolve your evee to a one of these pokemon, you will not be able to evolve once again to another pokemon.
Each level really provides a fun ongoing challenge. One minor mishap and your defenses will crumble. At this state, the map isn't finish. There are more waves coming soon as well as new building upgrades and units. Fortunately the map is playable up to a certain level.
Anyway, yah i agree, Nexus shouldn't be on the list twice however, but I would rather see the old gamelist back that shows all the live game lobbies. There you would see games titled - 3v3 BGH now!! or Helms Deep!!!! many many times.
Another thing, i saw like 4 versions of Income wars in like page 2, 3 with different names like - Income wars no BS, Income wars fixed, etc.
THe only reason I look at this site is to help othes in the dev forums, sunday I did nothing the whole day but refresh and answer what i could (with loads of tys lol) granted every now and the ill have an actor question myself, but answering questions is my main focus, so id love to help out with something like this.
I was hoping someone would confirm this situation. Thank you! So yah, Molsterr and others here are just answering questions all day on a sunday =P.
I've worked as a paid math/physics tutor. From my experience, the idea of sharing and showing what you can and cannot do can significantly reduce trial and error efforts. The practice of providing helpful links can give new map makers a more focus purpose rather than be frustrated in trying to search through the forums and tutorials. Keep in mind i am not implying that this conceptual system should REPLACE forums; this should rather coincide with the original forums. Everyone learns and analysis things differently. If we have enough people willing to attend to others' special needs, it will work.
Maybe its just me, but shouldnt people just enjoy making their maps and not worry about how popular thier maps are.
Quit your bitching please, most of your maps are probably less fun / more complicated then Nexus Wars
..... so what do you expect
people play custom games to relax. If they want a real game they play a real game.
I mean seriously there are 1000's of people making custom maps. Do you really think people want to play your map that bad. Think again.
Should really come to the map making with a view that chances are nobody is gonna play your map except you and your friends. Granted Blizz has already stated that they will be revamping the whole custom games list / search features. Be patient and enjoy your creatations.
This
I've said that many times. Map making is a hobby, not a job. If you want recognition, do something actually productive in real life.
Enjoy what you can with the map editor. Feel free to create worlds you alone or friends can appreciate. You cannot expect everyone to enjoy or play what you make.
A user of the above account has recently been involved in actions deemed inappropriate for StarCraft II by the In-Game Support staff of Blizzard Entertainment. This decision was made after a thorough investigation of the situation as a whole.
Any disputes or questions concerning the following account action can only be addressed by Account Administration. If you have any further enquiries regarding your account status, please use the web form at the following address: https://us.blizzard.com/support/webform.xml?locale=en_US
.
Account Action:
Offense: Inappropriate Map - Obscene/Vulgar
A map published under this account was found to have contained:
Is crude and offensive in nature
Is an inappropriate reference to human anatomy or bodily functions
). Please be aware that additional inappropriate actions may result in further disciplinary action, up to or including account closure.
We understand that these policies may seem harsh, but they are in place to ensure that every player is able to fully enjoy their time in StarCraft II. Thank you in advance for respecting our position.
Regards,
Game Master Julzana
Customer Services
Blizzard Entertainment www.blizzard.com/support <</quote>>
So, my map was taken down. I asked on another fan-site about the legitimacy of it, and it appears to be true. So, one of the suggestions was that people around SC2Mapster are reporting the maps because it advertises Staredit.net. Well, if this is true... you people are pathetic. So I advertised my more favored fan-site and not you. Too damn bad, I didn't get any help for it here.
I would say Heroes of Newerth is a clean Rip-off of dota where they practically just make their own version of DoTa heroes. League of Legend is more of a rip-off of the concept itself, but with additions like vision blockers like in SC2 and more unique heroes. Demi-god was a failed attempt of using the DoTa concept.
And there is more games out there already released or in the making that utilize the "Online Multiplayer Arena" game concept.
Pong was the first game with the joystick. Now all those other games that uses the joystick is a rip-off? What about the many TD maps and flash games. I guess they are all ripoffs
Everything is a ripoff of something but that doesn't mean they are good. DotA is not a Rip off of AoS. Its an evolved version of it.
Sixen had an idea on having some kind of Mentor system and thought this should be discussed in a separate thread. There are many people who are willing to learn to how to use the editor and create custom maps but do not have the guidance (they certainly have the resources like this site =D). There are also those individuals who come to these forums and just help out answering simple to complex map editing questions. The mentor system will tie both groups together
My idea: I was thinking having another set of teams, more like a list of individuals who are willing to answer private questions and do live semnars via instant messengers at a certain schedule and allow members in sc2mapster to join in and participate. We can also have a new section in our own forum profiles that list apprentices learning with those individuals, reviews of certain mentors and a calender schedule of map edit excerises.
This concept will be a great asset along with our helping forums. It will help teach individuals who cannot guide themselves to just play around with the editor/cannot learn using just video tutorial. It will give map experts a chance to help individuals on a more personal level. They will be able to actively answer many of the same questions as well as provide map excerises.
Another Idea was to have a Custom map called: Galaxy Editor Helper Map. The map will automonously help many individuals who joined the map. Think of it like the sc2 game tutorials except, it explains simple terrain edit and triggering. I made this on Broodwar and it both helped give interest in map making as well as provide fun easy FAQs while ingame. The map will have things like a big tip list, a map edit trivia, and map edit excerises explained ingame. Whats fun with a Galaxy Editor Helper map is that individuals can work at their own pace choosing what to do while the host of the map (preferably a map expert) can help answer questions while the individuals go through the game.
Back to the Mentor System. So yah, i think it would be a great idea alongside with the forums. This will definately bring up efficiency around here. It will prevent some newcomers who accidently post a map question and get flamed by someone saying "jeez, this has been asked too many times, use the search, noob." It will also help provide some kind of kiosk to the list of the hundreds of tutorials we have. Having a mentor will guide us what tutorials to look for instead of having to go through the 20 pages listing tutorials that is not even right for you. Mentor will explain some Wiki's more in depth as well as API Docs.
I didn't like it at first but now that i understand, i can't complain now. At the end of the day, the people that rage against blizz map policies are just ones that don't have good ideas. Like you said Aenigma, Original ideas open up so many more creative opportunities.
To everyone concern about map popularity: If you enjoy creating maps, then you shouldn't let others affect your interests. SC2 Mapping is a hobby, not a job. If you want to create a sc2 world full of things others wouldn't appreciate, go ahead; do what makes you happy. To Vexal, I hope you get to finish your Comp Sci degree, good luck.
As for your map, I enjoy playing it. It is really fun and hard for me. If your goal is to satisfy everyone then you shouldn't do what they ask such as add weapon to bunkers or something. If you want a map to work with your preferences then i think its unnecessary to give a reason of map change decisions based on history; changes based on experience and interest is better. Spiral D on Broodwar were auto shooting bunkers. They do not follow the romans; they are built with rines. Does that mean Spiral D is wrong? Lastly, kudos on the cheat codes statement, yup its lame.
The reason why people think bunkers can shoot is that in a 'typical' D game, anything that is buildable is intuitively thought to have an offensive strike against invaders. Playing Overun the 1st time and i thought the bunker i built was gonna do something. You said you need help finding ways to tell new players that bunkers are empty. One suggestion is to have a text display tied to some kind of alarm sound when a player builds their first bunker, center camera to that bunker. "Tip - put units in bunkers to fire"
This and many other statements of yours seems to stem from being frustrated by the accumulation of many fans complaining about random crap. Do not let it get to you. This is your map and unless people present you with constructive criticisms, don't change anything. It all really boils down to map preferences. For example, in my desert strike map, lots of ppl complained that resources were coming slow which made the game boring. Instead of telling everyone rational rebuttals like - "well, in a melee match, you start income slow and don't get 9999 minerals till later". I simply state this in the map loading screen - "Slow income for challenge endurance". See? Control it. "Added different armors for variety of defense tactics". Again, if anyone doesn't present to you a good feedback, just ignore.
Income Wars is a fun Custom map on Starcraft II. The objective of the game is to destroy your opponents single protoss cannon using different units you purchase up top in the market. Although this game is quite fun, there is a major flaw.
Players usually nuke the 'market' where you purchase units ruining the game. Nuking that area will destroy unit buying. The author simply forgot to put invincibility at that place.
Imagine playing Nexus wars and when your teammate nukes your base, it kills your nexus, units, buildings and your scv. Fail
What is funny is that it is one of the top custom maps only because people enjoy nuke race - whoever can nuke the top in the first second of the game wins.
0
Is there any chance I can embed the Ajax chatroom in my own team pages?
0
@Molsterr: Go
I've been criticized heavily for 'stealing' a map or plastering my name on a map that i've edited and popularized. I actually went through the necessary steps in getting the authors permission to edit his map. Also, that same author was the one that taught me everything on map editing back in Starcraft 1. So I've encountered those situations before. Having good intentions or not, editing someone's map is stealing and it is wrong. It is also unnecessary to show any kind of hostility towards the map stealer. The damage is done and there is nothing you can do.
Alongside with map stealing comes map evolutions. Some maps that have tons potential deviations are eventually made and you will find yourself playing different versions of the same map 'idea'. Would you call that map stealing? How about all those Cat and mouse, cannon D map versions. The first author who created the cat and mouse didn't want different maps however, the map itself is really easy to recreate and mappers found many ideas to implement on the CnM to keep it fresh.
So there is really a blur line between map stealing reinvention and pure original creation. What is funny is that I would browse playdota.com forums and read the many posts like "League of Legends is a fail clone" "Heroes of Newerth is a crime". DotA evolved from a STARCRAFT map, Aeon of strife. So what gives that community to declare things clones when they are playing just a evolved version of a blizzard map? (Don't get me wrong, DotA is really fun)
The answer is mutual agreement to a map genre. Once Starcraft and Age of Empires 2 came out, many Tower Defense maps were made, mainly because that was what you can make creatively at that time. Blizzard then creates an official TD map and publishes it with Warcraft and then you eventually see tons of flash made TD game version inevitably having its own genre.
Okay back to the original post/thread. Taking a map idea and changing IS stealing and it IS wrong but inadvertently when there is many fun variations it becomes a certain group of maps (ie map genre). Some cases fit this general trend (TD maps) which we all don't care. And in some cases its when that unique map published like an distinct RPG or RP and someone copies the EXACT same one and adds 99999 minerals to player one =/
0
@Eaglesight: Go
Over run is a defensive map where the objective is to not allow comp to destroy the center tower. There are 4 humans players, each player is responsible of fending off one side as waves of unit enemies come flooding in.
Overall, I enjoy the game especially its replay value and variety of tactics. Unlike most TD maps, there are actually many viable strategies in successfully fending off the invaders. Being able to play the game differently each time keeps the game fresh. TD map Tank D, it is easy and too common strat to get that early immortal.
I enjoy the unique game's challenge progression. You upgrade buildings to build better units but at the same time it RESTRICTS you from producing other unit.
Lol, it is like the evolution of evees:
If you evolve your evee to a one of these pokemon, you will not be able to evolve once again to another pokemon.
Each level really provides a fun ongoing challenge. One minor mishap and your defenses will crumble. At this state, the map isn't finish. There are more waves coming soon as well as new building upgrades and units. Fortunately the map is playable up to a certain level.
0
@Vexal: Go
Why don't we have Vexal Tower D twice instead =O?
Anyway, yah i agree, Nexus shouldn't be on the list twice however, but I would rather see the old gamelist back that shows all the live game lobbies. There you would see games titled - 3v3 BGH now!! or Helms Deep!!!! many many times.
Another thing, i saw like 4 versions of Income wars in like page 2, 3 with different names like - Income wars no BS, Income wars fixed, etc.
0
I was hoping someone would confirm this situation. Thank you! So yah, Molsterr and others here are just answering questions all day on a sunday =P.
I've worked as a paid math/physics tutor. From my experience, the idea of sharing and showing what you can and cannot do can significantly reduce trial and error efforts. The practice of providing helpful links can give new map makers a more focus purpose rather than be frustrated in trying to search through the forums and tutorials. Keep in mind i am not implying that this conceptual system should REPLACE forums; this should rather coincide with the original forums. Everyone learns and analysis things differently. If we have enough people willing to attend to others' special needs, it will work.
0
@RiotingQueen: Go
I agree, i would love to teach others what i know as well as learn from others that know the editor better than me!
0
This
I've said that many times. Map making is a hobby, not a job. If you want recognition, do something actually productive in real life.
Enjoy what you can with the map editor. Feel free to create worlds you alone or friends can appreciate. You cannot expect everyone to enjoy or play what you make.
0
Just in case he tries to edit his 1st post lol
0
0
Pong was the first game with the joystick. Now all those other games that uses the joystick is a rip-off? What about the many TD maps and flash games. I guess they are all ripoffs
Everything is a ripoff of something but that doesn't mean they are good. DotA is not a Rip off of AoS. Its an evolved version of it.
0
Sixen had an idea on having some kind of Mentor system and thought this should be discussed in a separate thread. There are many people who are willing to learn to how to use the editor and create custom maps but do not have the guidance (they certainly have the resources like this site =D). There are also those individuals who come to these forums and just help out answering simple to complex map editing questions. The mentor system will tie both groups together
My idea: I was thinking having another set of teams, more like a list of individuals who are willing to answer private questions and do live semnars via instant messengers at a certain schedule and allow members in sc2mapster to join in and participate. We can also have a new section in our own forum profiles that list apprentices learning with those individuals, reviews of certain mentors and a calender schedule of map edit excerises.
This concept will be a great asset along with our helping forums. It will help teach individuals who cannot guide themselves to just play around with the editor/cannot learn using just video tutorial. It will give map experts a chance to help individuals on a more personal level. They will be able to actively answer many of the same questions as well as provide map excerises.
Another Idea was to have a Custom map called: Galaxy Editor Helper Map. The map will automonously help many individuals who joined the map. Think of it like the sc2 game tutorials except, it explains simple terrain edit and triggering. I made this on Broodwar and it both helped give interest in map making as well as provide fun easy FAQs while ingame. The map will have things like a big tip list, a map edit trivia, and map edit excerises explained ingame. Whats fun with a Galaxy Editor Helper map is that individuals can work at their own pace choosing what to do while the host of the map (preferably a map expert) can help answer questions while the individuals go through the game.
Back to the Mentor System. So yah, i think it would be a great idea alongside with the forums. This will definately bring up efficiency around here. It will prevent some newcomers who accidently post a map question and get flamed by someone saying "jeez, this has been asked too many times, use the search, noob." It will also help provide some kind of kiosk to the list of the hundreds of tutorials we have. Having a mentor will guide us what tutorials to look for instead of having to go through the 20 pages listing tutorials that is not even right for you. Mentor will explain some Wiki's more in depth as well as API Docs.
0
@zifoon: Go
I didn't like it at first but now that i understand, i can't complain now. At the end of the day, the people that rage against blizz map policies are just ones that don't have good ideas. Like you said Aenigma, Original ideas open up so many more creative opportunities.
0
To everyone concern about map popularity: If you enjoy creating maps, then you shouldn't let others affect your interests. SC2 Mapping is a hobby, not a job. If you want to create a sc2 world full of things others wouldn't appreciate, go ahead; do what makes you happy. To Vexal, I hope you get to finish your Comp Sci degree, good luck.
As for your map, I enjoy playing it. It is really fun and hard for me. If your goal is to satisfy everyone then you shouldn't do what they ask such as add weapon to bunkers or something. If you want a map to work with your preferences then i think its unnecessary to give a reason of map change decisions based on history; changes based on experience and interest is better. Spiral D on Broodwar were auto shooting bunkers. They do not follow the romans; they are built with rines. Does that mean Spiral D is wrong? Lastly, kudos on the cheat codes statement, yup its lame.
The reason why people think bunkers can shoot is that in a 'typical' D game, anything that is buildable is intuitively thought to have an offensive strike against invaders. Playing Overun the 1st time and i thought the bunker i built was gonna do something. You said you need help finding ways to tell new players that bunkers are empty. One suggestion is to have a text display tied to some kind of alarm sound when a player builds their first bunker, center camera to that bunker. "Tip - put units in bunkers to fire"
This and many other statements of yours seems to stem from being frustrated by the accumulation of many fans complaining about random crap. Do not let it get to you. This is your map and unless people present you with constructive criticisms, don't change anything. It all really boils down to map preferences. For example, in my desert strike map, lots of ppl complained that resources were coming slow which made the game boring. Instead of telling everyone rational rebuttals like - "well, in a melee match, you start income slow and don't get 9999 minerals till later". I simply state this in the map loading screen - "Slow income for challenge endurance". See? Control it. "Added different armors for variety of defense tactics". Again, if anyone doesn't present to you a good feedback, just ignore.
For the Swarm -QueenGambit
0
Income Wars is a fun Custom map on Starcraft II. The objective of the game is to destroy your opponents single protoss cannon using different units you purchase up top in the market. Although this game is quite fun, there is a major flaw.
Players usually nuke the 'market' where you purchase units ruining the game. Nuking that area will destroy unit buying. The author simply forgot to put invincibility at that place.
Imagine playing Nexus wars and when your teammate nukes your base, it kills your nexus, units, buildings and your scv. Fail
What is funny is that it is one of the top custom maps only because people enjoy nuke race - whoever can nuke the top in the first second of the game wins.
0
@bologna3421: Go why did you ask the date? that was random...
thanks dooms111 and bologna for these speedy replies