Also, as for the AoS subject, questions arise as to what should be changed in order to evolve in the genre? If you want to stick to the basic base vs base with creep lanes and heroes leveling up you'll probably never break through anything. When DotA Allstars was at it's young ages, heroes were clearly the innovative factor here because they would drift away from standard Wc3 heroes while keeping a meaningfull place to use them. As the genre evolves with HoN, LoL and DotA 2, we clearly see that innovation in heroes is starting to be meaningless as more and more comes out that only look like other ones.
Point is, adding general game mechanics to polish the experience such as money shops and customization is what you currently see as the trend. My best guess would revolve around redesigning the very foundations of the genre istead of trying to polish it as much as you think you can. Going away from the standard creep with timers, heroes with max levels and items.
As saltygrapes stated, SotIS did moev awawy from their mercenary mechanic that they implemented in the earlier versions of their map, but it evetually got dropped of because, for them, it probably wasn't a core mechanic and just an addon that didn't fit in their idea of a MobA/AoS game.
TL;DR, try to think of how to change basics of the genre instead of adding to it.
There's nothing to complain about, there's no point to make a new AoS if it's gonna be the same as DotA/HoN/LoL. SotiS and Hero Attack share the same idea but change small aspects, it wont innovate and that's normal. Until we see something very different, AoS won't be revolutionized in Sc2.
I'm having the same kind of problems. I'm not using the normal level up system, I just want to add abilities via triggers but I can't seem to find any way to add buttons on the fly.
I'm wondering how do you make passive abilities with icons without going through the command card?
I mean, I can add a button to the command card of the unit but what I'd like to do is add them on the fly via triggers. The problem is, you can't add buttons to units using triggers plus abilities do not have built in icons...
Project Cerberus is a PvP team oriented map focusing on 6v6 battles in melee maps.
General Idea.
Project Cerberus keeps the standard 1v1 match format of melee Sc2 matches and introduces a new element, Prime Units. Computers battle it out melee style, while 6 players per team control "Hero" units to wreak havoc on the field.
Prime Units
Prime units consists of standard Starcraft 2 units bought through Control Terminals (Command Centers, Hives and Nexuses) with slight buffs (Bonus HP, Energy, Movement Speed, etc) and abilities earned through ranks. Each player can only control one Prime Unit at a time and it is lost upon death.
Instead of a leveling system, units can earn Ranks by completing objectives (dealing X amount of damage, killing X amount of units, healing for X amount, etc.) and provides instant upgrades and bonuses for prime units. Ranks are lost upon death.
Basic units, such as Marines and SVCs, are free of cost and are always available throughout the game.
Control Terminals aka Shops
The terminal is the graphical window where players are able to spend their credits (Minerals) earned through battle. Options are listed below:
- Selecting / Changing current prime unit.
- Buying one time use items.
- Replenishment for health and energy.
Status
The project is still in development stage. Alpha will be released once Pre-Alpha milestones are completed and online testing will follow.
Feedback
Please feel free to give critics, suggestions or ask questions in this thread. It is highly appreciated.
I'm getting the hang of the data editor but I'm still struggling with weapon effects. I'm trying to copy a marine without duplicating everything so I just 'Add New' and base on stuff that I want.
Problem is, once I get to the Marine Gauss Effect (Damage) part it doesn't start with all the basic effects like sound and models etc.
Well the problem I have actually seems to not be related with the AI itself but the triggers in general. If I put units on my maps, let's say SCVs and Command Centers or anything, they just dissapear when I use triggers... If I disable every single triggers they will spawn normaly though. Do you know what might cause this kind of bug?
I'm just trying to put AIs to 2 computers but every time I use the "Initialize AI" it removes every units from the game... Is there any way to use the AI, without making my own, without melee settings?
Edit: What the hell, if I put any triggers in the map, the units that I already placed disappear...
Hello everyone, I've followed the Warcraft 3 mapping scene for a long time, I've made maps (also for Sc1), never really published any but I was very familiar with JASS and the editor. I've made and watched died 3 map makings clan in Wc3:RoC and Wc3:TFT, plus I've tried the Galaxy editor for Sc2.
I've seen the evolution of map making taking place from Starcraft 1, Warcraft 3 and Starcraft 2 and I wanted to share my point on the actual philosphy of making maps in Starcraft 2 and why I think it 'fails'.
First of all, Starcraft 2 gives you A LOT of freedom for original ideas, units, triggers, scripts and such but that doesn't mean the quality of maps has increased, in fact, it has decreased, here's, what I personally think, is the problem:
Innovation Factor
The problem here is not the ideas, it's why they're developed for in the first place. Let's take a random FPS mod for exemple, sure it's possible to make it in Starcraft 2, sure it works and you can make a nice map with it, but does it mean it belongs in Starcraft 2? Is it because you can make those kind of games in the engine that you should? Let's take another exemple, BeJeweled, sure cool it works and its doable in Starcraft 2, but why play it over a random java BeJeweled game from the internet? There's no point in making it in Starcraft 2.
Spells and Effects
There was a trend in the late Warcraft 3 Maps to make spells effect very blown out of proportions and very beautiful, it worked at a certain limit because Warcraft 3 Effects in themselves were lacking, they were, for the most part, simple glows, particles and sprites. In Starcraft 2 however, a simple tank explosion has refraction, smoke particles, debrits, shaders etc. which are already fully complete. Maps like SotIS have spells that create 5 psychic storms in line then electrocutes the ground and stuff, it's too much, you don't see the units and the game anymore, it's not enjoyable.
Main Unit Importance
This is mostly for maps that focus on on hero units, in Warcraft 3, your units were big, they glowed and you knew it was your hero, (the glow even had team color!) but in Starcraft 2, if you decide to make a map where your hero is a zergling, you barely see the team color, you barely see your unit at all. Focus on uniqueness of your controlled unit and to whom it belongs. At least increase it's size by a good amount.
Terrain and Doodads
Okay, there's a lot of good sprites, lightning sets and terrain tiles you can use in Sc2, you can even paint your terrain, wow! There's a problem though, your map has to be playable, it's not a work of art that you want your players to look at, you want them to, by looking at your terrain, understand exactly where they can and they cannot go. Here's an exemple from SotIS vs Blizzard's DotA
I was finally able to have players join my map to test a full 6v6 map but nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo, f*ing B.Net 2.0 doesn't want to, each time there's 7 or 8 players the lobby CRASHES, YES THAT'S RIGHT, IT ALWAYS CRASHES.
Thanks blizz, you suck and you've made me waste my map.
My goal is to get people to play it over BNet to test out bugs and stuff because it's a 6v6 game.
Overview
The game plays on a slightly modified metalopolis. There's 2 commanders (teams) and 10 mercenaries (5 per team).
Commanders: Their goal is to destroy their opponent, there's not much change from a normal Sc2 game, they build, train, upgrade, etc...
Green Team Race: Terran
Blue Team Race: Protoss
Mercenaries: Their goal is to assist their commanders in battle, they play as a single unit. You gain minerals by damaging enemy units, you then spend it on upgrades and other units. Mercenaries are normal Sc2 units with bonus (20% more HP for all of them)
There's 3 types of Mercenaries:
Ranger (Offensive, has offensive spells and +1,5% life regeneration)
Sentry (Defensive, has defensive spells and +40% more HP, instead of +20%)
Recon (Scout, has versatile spells and +20% more movement speed)
There's a lot of things yet to be implemented but I got the basic of the game done.
0
Also, as for the AoS subject, questions arise as to what should be changed in order to evolve in the genre? If you want to stick to the basic base vs base with creep lanes and heroes leveling up you'll probably never break through anything. When DotA Allstars was at it's young ages, heroes were clearly the innovative factor here because they would drift away from standard Wc3 heroes while keeping a meaningfull place to use them. As the genre evolves with HoN, LoL and DotA 2, we clearly see that innovation in heroes is starting to be meaningless as more and more comes out that only look like other ones.
Point is, adding general game mechanics to polish the experience such as money shops and customization is what you currently see as the trend. My best guess would revolve around redesigning the very foundations of the genre istead of trying to polish it as much as you think you can. Going away from the standard creep with timers, heroes with max levels and items.
As saltygrapes stated, SotIS did moev awawy from their mercenary mechanic that they implemented in the earlier versions of their map, but it evetually got dropped of because, for them, it probably wasn't a core mechanic and just an addon that didn't fit in their idea of a MobA/AoS game.
TL;DR, try to think of how to change basics of the genre instead of adding to it.
0
There's nothing to complain about, there's no point to make a new AoS if it's gonna be the same as DotA/HoN/LoL. SotiS and Hero Attack share the same idea but change small aspects, it wont innovate and that's normal. Until we see something very different, AoS won't be revolutionized in Sc2.
Even with Blizzard DotA.
0
I'm having the same kind of problems. I'm not using the normal level up system, I just want to add abilities via triggers but I can't seem to find any way to add buttons on the fly.
0
I'm wondering how do you make passive abilities with icons without going through the command card?
I mean, I can add a button to the command card of the unit but what I'd like to do is add them on the fly via triggers. The problem is, you can't add buttons to units using triggers plus abilities do not have built in icons...
0
Project Cerberus
Project Cerberus is a PvP team oriented map focusing on 6v6 battles in melee maps.
General Idea.
Project Cerberus keeps the standard 1v1 match format of melee Sc2 matches and introduces a new element, Prime Units. Computers battle it out melee style, while 6 players per team control "Hero" units to wreak havoc on the field.
Prime Units
Prime units consists of standard Starcraft 2 units bought through Control Terminals (Command Centers, Hives and Nexuses) with slight buffs (Bonus HP, Energy, Movement Speed, etc) and abilities earned through ranks. Each player can only control one Prime Unit at a time and it is lost upon death.
Instead of a leveling system, units can earn Ranks by completing objectives (dealing X amount of damage, killing X amount of units, healing for X amount, etc.) and provides instant upgrades and bonuses for prime units. Ranks are lost upon death.
Basic units, such as Marines and SVCs, are free of cost and are always available throughout the game.
Control Terminals aka Shops The terminal is the graphical window where players are able to spend their credits (Minerals) earned through battle. Options are listed below:
- Selecting / Changing current prime unit. - Buying one time use items. - Replenishment for health and energy.
Status
The project is still in development stage. Alpha will be released once Pre-Alpha milestones are completed and online testing will follow.
Feedback
Please feel free to give critics, suggestions or ask questions in this thread. It is highly appreciated.
0
I'm getting the hang of the data editor but I'm still struggling with weapon effects. I'm trying to copy a marine without duplicating everything so I just 'Add New' and base on stuff that I want.
Problem is, once I get to the Marine Gauss Effect (Damage) part it doesn't start with all the basic effects like sound and models etc.
What am I doing wrong?
0
Getting back right now, Diablo 3 isn't worth the time I spend in it.
0
@ZealNaga: Go
Well the problem I have actually seems to not be related with the AI itself but the triggers in general. If I put units on my maps, let's say SCVs and Command Centers or anything, they just dissapear when I use triggers... If I disable every single triggers they will spawn normaly though. Do you know what might cause this kind of bug?
0
I'm just trying to put AIs to 2 computers but every time I use the "Initialize AI" it removes every units from the game... Is there any way to use the AI, without making my own, without melee settings?
Edit: What the hell, if I put any triggers in the map, the units that I already placed disappear...
0
Hello everyone, I've followed the Warcraft 3 mapping scene for a long time, I've made maps (also for Sc1), never really published any but I was very familiar with JASS and the editor. I've made and watched died 3 map makings clan in Wc3:RoC and Wc3:TFT, plus I've tried the Galaxy editor for Sc2.
I've seen the evolution of map making taking place from Starcraft 1, Warcraft 3 and Starcraft 2 and I wanted to share my point on the actual philosphy of making maps in Starcraft 2 and why I think it 'fails'.
First of all, Starcraft 2 gives you A LOT of freedom for original ideas, units, triggers, scripts and such but that doesn't mean the quality of maps has increased, in fact, it has decreased, here's, what I personally think, is the problem:
Innovation Factor
The problem here is not the ideas, it's why they're developed for in the first place. Let's take a random FPS mod for exemple, sure it's possible to make it in Starcraft 2, sure it works and you can make a nice map with it, but does it mean it belongs in Starcraft 2? Is it because you can make those kind of games in the engine that you should? Let's take another exemple, BeJeweled, sure cool it works and its doable in Starcraft 2, but why play it over a random java BeJeweled game from the internet? There's no point in making it in Starcraft 2.
Spells and Effects
There was a trend in the late Warcraft 3 Maps to make spells effect very blown out of proportions and very beautiful, it worked at a certain limit because Warcraft 3 Effects in themselves were lacking, they were, for the most part, simple glows, particles and sprites. In Starcraft 2 however, a simple tank explosion has refraction, smoke particles, debrits, shaders etc. which are already fully complete. Maps like SotIS have spells that create 5 psychic storms in line then electrocutes the ground and stuff, it's too much, you don't see the units and the game anymore, it's not enjoyable.
Main Unit Importance
This is mostly for maps that focus on on hero units, in Warcraft 3, your units were big, they glowed and you knew it was your hero, (the glow even had team color!) but in Starcraft 2, if you decide to make a map where your hero is a zergling, you barely see the team color, you barely see your unit at all. Focus on uniqueness of your controlled unit and to whom it belongs. At least increase it's size by a good amount.
Terrain and Doodads
Okay, there's a lot of good sprites, lightning sets and terrain tiles you can use in Sc2, you can even paint your terrain, wow! There's a problem though, your map has to be playable, it's not a work of art that you want your players to look at, you want them to, by looking at your terrain, understand exactly where they can and they cannot go. Here's an exemple from SotIS vs Blizzard's DotA
SotIS
Blizzard DotA
0
@Twinmold20: Go
Sorry 4 days, and my lack of faith is explained by a series of annoying, near unsupportable, situations caused by the new battle.net.
0
Yeah that's right beta ends in f*ing 3 days and it's working PERFECTLY as intended, awesome fucking game.
0
I was finally able to have players join my map to test a full 6v6 map but nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo, f*ing B.Net 2.0 doesn't want to, each time there's 7 or 8 players the lobby CRASHES, YES THAT'S RIGHT, IT ALWAYS CRASHES.
Thanks blizz, you suck and you've made me waste my map.
0
So I just published my map, everything's fine but then, when I try to move players around (I'm the host) I just can't... What's wrong?
0
I just managed to get a "playable" version of my map on BNet US and I decided I'd make a thread and a project.
http://www.sc2mapster.com/maps/lone-lone-commanders/
My goal is to get people to play it over BNet to test out bugs and stuff because it's a 6v6 game.
Overview
The game plays on a slightly modified metalopolis. There's 2 commanders (teams) and 10 mercenaries (5 per team).
Commanders: Their goal is to destroy their opponent, there's not much change from a normal Sc2 game, they build, train, upgrade, etc...
Mercenaries: Their goal is to assist their commanders in battle, they play as a single unit. You gain minerals by damaging enemy units, you then spend it on upgrades and other units. Mercenaries are normal Sc2 units with bonus (20% more HP for all of them)
There's 3 types of Mercenaries:
There's a lot of things yet to be implemented but I got the basic of the game done.