It is Ajax (his bnet name, not sure if he wants me posting his real name/project here yet). I've helped him a good bit with his project, but he has spent a lot of time in the editor learning to do stuff just so that his project could be made. A game maker who makes a game cuz he wants to play it; the best kind!
If I understand correctly, it is the same game, except that the 2nd map is just a harder difficulty? that would be allowed. Similarly if someone had a campaign that had a "starting map" which loaded you into the current mission map; a "boot screen" map, so to speak.
I have a friend with a good arcade map; but he isn't ready either; he was hoping for February; time to get an AI working; since it is a multiplayer only game; and an AI would make it much easier for us to test.
Hey all! As most of you know, the first monthly test went off really well; and is starting to simmer down already (As is to be expected). Thanks to everyone who participated already. Anyone who hasn't taken a look yet can find the thread here: https://www.sc2mapster.com/forums/player-zone/map-review/131403-monthly-test-december-scbis-by-cacho56/#p1 The project is being updated as reviews come in, so even if you are late to the party; check it out and leave feedback.
I am also looking for more map submissions for upcoming months! There are a couple "maybe/later" maps on deck, but not a whole lot. Ideally, I would like to alternate between "arcade maps", and "campaign maps"; if anyone out there is still working on arcade maps. I know looking a month or two ahead has everyone "ehh, i dont know if I will be ready/still interested"; but if you are interested, PM me or post here. If I can get a good sized list of interested people, I can temporarily switch back to a bi-weekly format to try to get everyone tested in a timely manner. If you want your project tested a few months from now (you currently dont teel it is ready, but that it may be later) you can PM me about it as well; I will ask you again as the time nears.
Author asking to invest time into their creation and then being defensive about anything sends the message that author really isn't open about what they want to hear. From feedback providers point of view - if you don't want to hear something - fine, you needed it more than me, I simply won't invest further time into this communication. It grinds my gears to see people shoot themselves in the foot because they don't realize concepts of demographics, personal preferences and the randomness of circumstances.
I agree, but you and I also must understand that authors may have spend hundreds-thousands of hours on their project. I assume, when giving feedback, that the author will be defensive; especially when it comes to game design. I think a very common reply (and I have said this) is "this game is for a target audience, if you are too stupid to understand how to play it, you aren't the audience." That is a poor attitude to have, and both tester and editor need to overcome it. You are absolutely correct that the mapmaker needs the feedback far more than the person giving it needs to give it. really, I feel it is much more difficult for the mapmaker to remain calm than the player. but this is why I am strongly against insults. It is fine to dislike something. refrain from calling it stupid is all. "I had no clue what I needed to do to win the game." might piss a mapmaker off, but is also good feedback. "There are too many words, I'm not gonna read all that!" might inspire a mapmaker to shout "WELL THEN YOU WONT KNOW HOW TO PLAY THE GAME!" again, good feedback, bad mapmaker.
It is a giant crapshoot to know who will be offended by what. If I feel someone has offered very rude advice, I will send them a PM about it. It really isn't a major concern. For how small of a community is left here, most of the members are reasonably professional. That is why we have this initiative. a 1 star review on the arcade "boring" is not very good feedback; and anyone can publish their map to get a simple review. People here know the work that goes into the editor, and can offer possible solutions, without that entitled opinion that you owe them something (found in many game critics these days).
The "Don't be an asshole" rule, is slightly annoying. I mean, even if someone is an asshole in their feedback - someone else can go clarify the points and go in more detail, catch and elaborate the train of thought. Discussion at the expense of hurting someones feels is more beneficial than nothing at all, no?
I guess everyone has their own thoughts about being an asshole, and what that entails. I do not think that negative feedback is a bad thing; but personal attacks are. Everyone is entitled to not like a game. Calling a project "stupid" or saying the mapmaker "doesn't know anything" isn't helping anyone. Saying that the game is entirely too confusing, or is horribly balance, or that it simply isn't fun; well, that is all opinion.
Just avoid personal attacks; and try not to take things as a personal attack. "Person A: I hated the intro, it wasted my time" "Person B: unlike person A, i liked the intro" (Now person A and B do not start to argue about the intro, they respect each others opinions and leave it at that)
As I mentioned via PM (might as well let everyone know) The power behind the initiative is not in (me/the organizers) but in the people who takes the time to test the projects and leave feedback. I have a project lined up to start on the 1st, and will be making a new thread for it on the 1st. Hopefully the calm between holidays will mean that people have a little extra time they can spare to test out a project.
To all the potential testers out there: Rather than 1 more game of DOTA, an episode of south park, 30 minutes of sleep... Whatever part of your personal life you are busy with (Everyone is busy, it cannot be helped) try to pitch in to support the mapmaking community, and hopefully the good deed will come back around to you.
Ehh, guess I will just do what I can by myself. It is more of a community effort than anything else anyway. All I gotta do is maybe 30 minutes of organization, and take part in the event. As long as the community is still interested in the initiative, I see no reason why it shouldn't start.
I can suggest my single player map, since I only got feedback from one user :(.
Here's the link to the map page.
I gotta ask; why isn't this just a map players can download and play? or find on battle.net? Rather than downloading and running an installer. I'm genuinely confused! I will see what Trieva thinks!
Are multiple maps/entire campaigns suitable submissions for a monthly testing initiative?
No. You can sign up a mission, and then sign up another one once that one has been tested. The goal here is to give pointed feedback, with a minimal time investment from people interested. To play through 5-10 hours of maps, and try to leave critical feedback, doesn't seem reasonable for most.
If you have a heap of missions ready, you can always create your own thread and get feedback there. Same goes for if you are looking for ideas on how to create a good campaign, or anything else. Our primary goal here (in my opinion) is to get people with mostly completed projects, feedback from fellow mapmakers; in terms of both "the how and the why", on how they can improve their projects in the final stages.
I agree, give some suggestions of projects even if they are not yours.
I would like to point out though. Make sure you get permission to request someone else's map, and make sure they know about it. Silly to give good feedback to someone who isn't interested.
I'm glad to see so many people are interested. Except uhhh, anyone have a project to suggest? Myself, treiva, and r0b do, but don't want to que ourselves up until we are short on participants.
My plan was to be the first tester, and post the project page myself, filling the above in. I would like to get a write up from the mapmaker though, a game description. 100 words or less (so they don't ruin their own game for us). I didn't want to over clutter the intro post here, so left a lot out, like December 1 is the starting date!
@R0binicus: Go
It is Ajax (his bnet name, not sure if he wants me posting his real name/project here yet). I've helped him a good bit with his project, but he has spent a lot of time in the editor learning to do stuff just so that his project could be made. A game maker who makes a game cuz he wants to play it; the best kind!
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
@R0binicus: Go
If I understand correctly, it is the same game, except that the 2nd map is just a harder difficulty? that would be allowed. Similarly if someone had a campaign that had a "starting map" which loaded you into the current mission map; a "boot screen" map, so to speak.
I have a friend with a good arcade map; but he isn't ready either; he was hoping for February; time to get an AI working; since it is a multiplayer only game; and an AI would make it much easier for us to test.
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
You still interested in having your map up?
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
Hey all! As most of you know, the first monthly test went off really well; and is starting to simmer down already (As is to be expected). Thanks to everyone who participated already. Anyone who hasn't taken a look yet can find the thread here: https://www.sc2mapster.com/forums/player-zone/map-review/131403-monthly-test-december-scbis-by-cacho56/#p1 The project is being updated as reviews come in, so even if you are late to the party; check it out and leave feedback.
I am also looking for more map submissions for upcoming months! There are a couple "maybe/later" maps on deck, but not a whole lot. Ideally, I would like to alternate between "arcade maps", and "campaign maps"; if anyone out there is still working on arcade maps. I know looking a month or two ahead has everyone "ehh, i dont know if I will be ready/still interested"; but if you are interested, PM me or post here. If I can get a good sized list of interested people, I can temporarily switch back to a bi-weekly format to try to get everyone tested in a timely manner. If you want your project tested a few months from now (you currently dont teel it is ready, but that it may be later) you can PM me about it as well; I will ask you again as the time nears.
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
From the land of the rising sun I guess. I'll get on it!
EDIT: https://www.sc2mapster.com/forums/player-zone/map-review/131403-monthly-test-december-scbis-by-cacho56/
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
I agree, but you and I also must understand that authors may have spend hundreds-thousands of hours on their project. I assume, when giving feedback, that the author will be defensive; especially when it comes to game design. I think a very common reply (and I have said this) is "this game is for a target audience, if you are too stupid to understand how to play it, you aren't the audience." That is a poor attitude to have, and both tester and editor need to overcome it. You are absolutely correct that the mapmaker needs the feedback far more than the person giving it needs to give it. really, I feel it is much more difficult for the mapmaker to remain calm than the player. but this is why I am strongly against insults. It is fine to dislike something. refrain from calling it stupid is all. "I had no clue what I needed to do to win the game." might piss a mapmaker off, but is also good feedback. "There are too many words, I'm not gonna read all that!" might inspire a mapmaker to shout "WELL THEN YOU WONT KNOW HOW TO PLAY THE GAME!" again, good feedback, bad mapmaker.
It is a giant crapshoot to know who will be offended by what. If I feel someone has offered very rude advice, I will send them a PM about it. It really isn't a major concern. For how small of a community is left here, most of the members are reasonably professional. That is why we have this initiative. a 1 star review on the arcade "boring" is not very good feedback; and anyone can publish their map to get a simple review. People here know the work that goes into the editor, and can offer possible solutions, without that entitled opinion that you owe them something (found in many game critics these days).
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
I guess everyone has their own thoughts about being an asshole, and what that entails. I do not think that negative feedback is a bad thing; but personal attacks are. Everyone is entitled to not like a game. Calling a project "stupid" or saying the mapmaker "doesn't know anything" isn't helping anyone. Saying that the game is entirely too confusing, or is horribly balance, or that it simply isn't fun; well, that is all opinion.
Just avoid personal attacks; and try not to take things as a personal attack. "Person A: I hated the intro, it wasted my time" "Person B: unlike person A, i liked the intro" (Now person A and B do not start to argue about the intro, they respect each others opinions and leave it at that)
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
As I mentioned via PM (might as well let everyone know) The power behind the initiative is not in (me/the organizers) but in the people who takes the time to test the projects and leave feedback. I have a project lined up to start on the 1st, and will be making a new thread for it on the 1st. Hopefully the calm between holidays will mean that people have a little extra time they can spare to test out a project.
To all the potential testers out there: Rather than 1 more game of DOTA, an episode of south park, 30 minutes of sleep... Whatever part of your personal life you are busy with (Everyone is busy, it cannot be helped) try to pitch in to support the mapmaking community, and hopefully the good deed will come back around to you.
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
Ehh, guess I will just do what I can by myself. It is more of a community effort than anything else anyway. All I gotta do is maybe 30 minutes of organization, and take part in the event. As long as the community is still interested in the initiative, I see no reason why it shouldn't start.
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
I gotta ask; why isn't this just a map players can download and play? or find on battle.net? Rather than downloading and running an installer. I'm genuinely confused! I will see what Trieva thinks!
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
@EDHRIANO: Go
We have a handful to pick from, but no one wants to go first ><
Anyone who wants to be the first in line, step-right-up!
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
No. You can sign up a mission, and then sign up another one once that one has been tested. The goal here is to give pointed feedback, with a minimal time investment from people interested. To play through 5-10 hours of maps, and try to leave critical feedback, doesn't seem reasonable for most.
If you have a heap of missions ready, you can always create your own thread and get feedback there. Same goes for if you are looking for ideas on how to create a good campaign, or anything else. Our primary goal here (in my opinion) is to get people with mostly completed projects, feedback from fellow mapmakers; in terms of both "the how and the why", on how they can improve their projects in the final stages.
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
I would like to point out though. Make sure you get permission to request someone else's map, and make sure they know about it. Silly to give good feedback to someone who isn't interested.
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
I'm glad to see so many people are interested. Except uhhh, anyone have a project to suggest? Myself, treiva, and r0b do, but don't want to que ourselves up until we are short on participants.
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
My plan was to be the first tester, and post the project page myself, filling the above in. I would like to get a write up from the mapmaker though, a game description. 100 words or less (so they don't ruin their own game for us). I didn't want to over clutter the intro post here, so left a lot out, like December 1 is the starting date!
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418