A run down on the economy: Funding Centers give a tick of 1 cash based on a periodic timer more or less, they are affected by unit population and based on it's energy left the tick increases. Power generators are worthwhile as they basically give you a stable extra tick not based on your population.
Here is a run down on the timers:
Funding Centers:
100% energy: 3 sec
80: 6 s
60: 9 s
40: 12 s
20: 15 s
0: 18 s
Power Generators -give extra tick-
every 5 s
Command Beacons:
5 cash every 20 s
I have been debating on lower the command beacon's generation of cash and ammo to just 3 per tick. This might help things move along, I see your point on the cash generation. With this change a Command Beacon will be equal to 3 Fund Centers at full power. Also as it stands it takes a Power Generator 11.5 minutes to pay itself off and profit. I will lower its cost to 100 and reduce its tick rate to 3.6 s so that it will pay off in 6 minutes, day and will definitely pay off end game.
I do think the snipers need a slight adjustment too as they weren't necessarily meant for massing but special missions against other players no doubt they will have some combat ability, but snipers are the primary ones I planned to be used to fighting against natives.
That last post had a lot of nice info, but can you also please list what energy=how much army? I have been wondering how the energy on funding centers works forever.
100% Energy you must have (# of non trivial units (perimeter are trivial))/Fund Centers < 1.5
80% Energy you must have (# of non trivial units (perimeter are trivial))/Fund Centers < 3
60% Energy you must have (# of non trivial units (perimeter are trivial))/Fund Centers < 4.5
40% Energy you must have (# of non trivial units (perimeter are trivial))/Fund Centers < 6
20% Energy you must have (# of non trivial units (perimeter are trivial))/Fund Centers < 7.5
0% Energy you must have (# of non trivial units (perimeter are trivial))/Fund Centers < 9
I tried alot of different variations and 1.5 increments seemed to work fairly nicely, 2 was too easy and 1 was way too hard.
Also, I was planning on taking a break from the map to work on a game I am making for the Android OS but I splurged and have been working hard to finish this map out of beta, I am adding in new heroes.
There will be 3 to choose from, done so in the lobby as mentioned before. UPON release they will all function similarly, no huge differences aside from small things like attack, movement, etc. They will all have separate experience banks so you must level each of them separately. Still abilities will reset each new game.
After I release this I will try to think up some unique abilities for each of them as I want 4 UNIQUE abilities to each of the 3 in which the others don't have and you spend ability points on. I may need help getting ideas, so once this is released please check into it.
I wanted to use Nova as one of the Commanders so I am reworking most of the long range units.. which probably needed work anyways!
Newest version of the map is up, I don't believe there should be any bugs about, but let me know if you find any. Next up are unique abilities. Please give me suggestions/ideas on what you'd like to see.
So it seems that the ghosts (spies) no longer attack units that aren't basic. If you intentionally added this feature to discourage players from using ghosts, you should add something to their description so people know not to mass produce them. Also, now that you've changed the income of command beacons to be 3, you should adjust the description to reflect this since it still says 5. As of right now, it costs 30 to upgrade the basic marines and they barely gain hp or damage. Is there a reason why they are so expensive to upgrade? I recall reading somewhere that you get a good amount of xp if you beat hard mode (maybe I'm remembering wrong). It doesn't seem like you get any extra experience since I was barely able to get to level 2 after beating a game on hard (I started the game with half of the commander's level completed already).
I actually removed spies completely from the game, I think you are referring to Snipers? Or Commandos? Or perhaps Ghosts.
Snipers can attack biological units which does include the natives.
Commandos only attack Mechanical units, as they are intended mostly for PvP, they can do well with picking off engineerings over a fair distance.
Ghosts are intended as a way to eliminate the threat of light cloaked units. Thus they only attack light units, this does include some natives.
All of the descriptions should reflect the things I had here :).
Also assault specialists (marines) do get 2 abilities, teleport (to traverse cliffs instantly) and grenades, which can be quite powerful against groups.
the Rangers get stim packs which are also quite effective with medics and groups. Their ability to survive is nearly doubled too through armor, shields and hp.
As for popularity, I am not 100% positive of the drop, my guess would be because of the bugs in the beta made some stop playing. Now that its becoming more stable hopefully people will give it another chance. I will give this a couple days and update as needed to fix imbalances and bugs but I think I am done with all major things aside from hero abilities. I don't think I changed any critical elements in the game to make the game undesirable unless the Command Beacon massing made the game more fun, if thats a case I might have to bring it back somehow. Perhaps it just needs time too. I wish to remove the beta off it now so I will refrain from any major updates now until it is totally bug free and well balanced.
I edited the win exp from 250 per starting player to 400 per starting player on hard mode. And adjusted Command Beacon description to better reflect the 3 resource generation.
I was an avid CF masser, but I guess I'll leave that behind lol. Would building turrets hinder your energy? And also, I wished that the commandos and such at least did SOME damage to other units... Of course, i haven't played yet so I don't know.
The Commandos can throw down timed mines that can be used on natives quite effectively but is tricky to use as it needs a charge time to explode. However for there won't be a direct attack.
I do think I like where Command Beacons are at now, they are worth 3 funding centers if they are capped out on energy. And yes, turrets do take up energy. Pretty much all things do but perimeter markers and abandoned buildings. I am up for adjustments though.
Please let me know if you have ideas for hero abilities or upgrades that would be worthwhile.
How about one of them can drop in a small elite squad of soldiers, like a mix of soldiers/armored soldiers/medics, but only twice a game. Or something like that.
I was thinking something like that, perhaps the Mercenary Commander, I could have this ability at requiring 1 attack ability for every level you are to get of this ability, capping at lvl 4. It would be a 10 minute? cooldown. Each further upgrade would bring more powerful units in the transport.
Perhaps the units would only last a limited time?
Also an important note on popularity, my map is a longer map requiring up to 10 people. The way the popularity system works is the sheer number of time a map is played on bnet
My map will be competing against maps like bunker wars, DOTA, star battle and such that last shorter amount of times per game or use less players per game.
I believe my map was more popular before because people died easier, it was new, it more challenging, less approachable. For example a new person would play, die and find it interesting to try again. several times to get it right. Now I made it more approachable for new players to get the hang of things in a game or two. I am happy it has been as popular as it was with all the work I put into it, I hope to keep it within the first pages at the very least, thats my goal for now.
Just gotta get the bugs out now and remove the beta for good.
I've heard from a couple other players that it would be nice for pvp if the game didn't end with the death of the soul collector, maybe make it be the last one standing + the death of the soul collector?
Also, I think the new prices work well. I like the new heroes.
Alright, as requested I made a PvP option removing the need to worry about natives completely. Right now there can only be one winner but alliances can be formed admist the game, just eventually know it will have to be broken. The game goes endlessly until one is alive. Runs the same otherwise!
Exp is not saved but will be loaded, also exp gain is much faster in PVP than the other modes.
There's a bug regarding the ability points of the special ops ghost commander. My commander is currently level 4 but every time I start a new game, I only have 2 ability points that I can add. Not really sure if it applies to the other new commander or not since I haven't played him. Is it possible to repair or heal your scvs (engineers)? The technicians can't repair them and medics don't heal them. Also, your armored weapons and emergency ammo both have the hotkey V at the command beacon. Any chance you can change one of those hotkeys?
What are your character codes guys, I definitely have to game with you guys lol. And IDK about the pvp thing... seems fairly easy, as they don't have to worry about as many things. I have to test that avec mes amis... And, are you sure you can't change settings? I've seen games where you can change the settings of the game through the lobby. Ask Blizzard about it! That would make public games more dynamic. Another thing you could do is implement difficulty through the game... idk how it works... I should learn some of the map editor and such... used to do this stuff in wc3
I did fix Techs so they can fix engineers now, for some reason I thought they were mechanical all this time =). I am seeing heavy weapons with hotkey C and emergency ammo as hotkey V. It is odd you have experienced differently as I haven't changed this at all since I added the units. I believe I fixed the ability selector issue, it was a misfiring with mutli threads that potentially loaded things out of order, had to throw in some wait conditions but should be good now!
I will investigate keeping options unlocked for public maps, I would like this too, I already tried alot of stuff so I will ask some others and see what I find out.
A run down on the economy: Funding Centers give a tick of 1 cash based on a periodic timer more or less, they are affected by unit population and based on it's energy left the tick increases. Power generators are worthwhile as they basically give you a stable extra tick not based on your population.
Here is a run down on the timers:
Funding Centers:
100% energy: 3 sec
80: 6 s
60: 9 s
40: 12 s
20: 15 s
0: 18 s
Power Generators -give extra tick-
every 5 s
Command Beacons:
5 cash every 20 s
I have been debating on lower the command beacon's generation of cash and ammo to just 3 per tick. This might help things move along, I see your point on the cash generation. With this change a Command Beacon will be equal to 3 Fund Centers at full power. Also as it stands it takes a Power Generator 11.5 minutes to pay itself off and profit. I will lower its cost to 100 and reduce its tick rate to 3.6 s so that it will pay off in 6 minutes, day and will definitely pay off end game.
I do think the snipers need a slight adjustment too as they weren't necessarily meant for massing but special missions against other players no doubt they will have some combat ability, but snipers are the primary ones I planned to be used to fighting against natives.
That last post had a lot of nice info, but can you also please list what energy=how much army? I have been wondering how the energy on funding centers works forever.
@Grimshad: Go
100% Energy you must have (# of non trivial units (perimeter are trivial))/Fund Centers < 1.5
80% Energy you must have (# of non trivial units (perimeter are trivial))/Fund Centers < 3
60% Energy you must have (# of non trivial units (perimeter are trivial))/Fund Centers < 4.5
40% Energy you must have (# of non trivial units (perimeter are trivial))/Fund Centers < 6
20% Energy you must have (# of non trivial units (perimeter are trivial))/Fund Centers < 7.5
0% Energy you must have (# of non trivial units (perimeter are trivial))/Fund Centers < 9
I tried alot of different variations and 1.5 increments seemed to work fairly nicely, 2 was too easy and 1 was way too hard.
Also, I was planning on taking a break from the map to work on a game I am making for the Android OS but I splurged and have been working hard to finish this map out of beta, I am adding in new heroes.
There will be 3 to choose from, done so in the lobby as mentioned before. UPON release they will all function similarly, no huge differences aside from small things like attack, movement, etc. They will all have separate experience banks so you must level each of them separately. Still abilities will reset each new game.
After I release this I will try to think up some unique abilities for each of them as I want 4 UNIQUE abilities to each of the 3 in which the others don't have and you spend ability points on. I may need help getting ideas, so once this is released please check into it.
I wanted to use Nova as one of the Commanders so I am reworking most of the long range units.. which probably needed work anyways!
Newest version of the map is up, I don't believe there should be any bugs about, but let me know if you find any. Next up are unique abilities. Please give me suggestions/ideas on what you'd like to see.
So it seems that the ghosts (spies) no longer attack units that aren't basic. If you intentionally added this feature to discourage players from using ghosts, you should add something to their description so people know not to mass produce them. Also, now that you've changed the income of command beacons to be 3, you should adjust the description to reflect this since it still says 5. As of right now, it costs 30 to upgrade the basic marines and they barely gain hp or damage. Is there a reason why they are so expensive to upgrade? I recall reading somewhere that you get a good amount of xp if you beat hard mode (maybe I'm remembering wrong). It doesn't seem like you get any extra experience since I was barely able to get to level 2 after beating a game on hard (I started the game with half of the commander's level completed already).
this game used to be so much popular =\ I always wished there were more people, but its only like 37 games in the last hour nowadays...
I actually removed spies completely from the game, I think you are referring to Snipers? Or Commandos? Or perhaps Ghosts.
Snipers can attack biological units which does include the natives.
Commandos only attack Mechanical units, as they are intended mostly for PvP, they can do well with picking off engineerings over a fair distance.
Ghosts are intended as a way to eliminate the threat of light cloaked units. Thus they only attack light units, this does include some natives.
All of the descriptions should reflect the things I had here :).
Also assault specialists (marines) do get 2 abilities, teleport (to traverse cliffs instantly) and grenades, which can be quite powerful against groups.
the Rangers get stim packs which are also quite effective with medics and groups. Their ability to survive is nearly doubled too through armor, shields and hp.
As for popularity, I am not 100% positive of the drop, my guess would be because of the bugs in the beta made some stop playing. Now that its becoming more stable hopefully people will give it another chance. I will give this a couple days and update as needed to fix imbalances and bugs but I think I am done with all major things aside from hero abilities. I don't think I changed any critical elements in the game to make the game undesirable unless the Command Beacon massing made the game more fun, if thats a case I might have to bring it back somehow. Perhaps it just needs time too. I wish to remove the beta off it now so I will refrain from any major updates now until it is totally bug free and well balanced.
I edited the win exp from 250 per starting player to 400 per starting player on hard mode. And adjusted Command Beacon description to better reflect the 3 resource generation.
@Abacus142: Go
I was an avid CF masser, but I guess I'll leave that behind lol. Would building turrets hinder your energy? And also, I wished that the commandos and such at least did SOME damage to other units... Of course, i haven't played yet so I don't know.
The Commandos can throw down timed mines that can be used on natives quite effectively but is tricky to use as it needs a charge time to explode. However for there won't be a direct attack.
I do think I like where Command Beacons are at now, they are worth 3 funding centers if they are capped out on energy. And yes, turrets do take up energy. Pretty much all things do but perimeter markers and abandoned buildings. I am up for adjustments though.
Please let me know if you have ideas for hero abilities or upgrades that would be worthwhile.
@Abacus142: Go
How about one of them can drop in a small elite squad of soldiers, like a mix of soldiers/armored soldiers/medics, but only twice a game. Or something like that.
I was thinking something like that, perhaps the Mercenary Commander, I could have this ability at requiring 1 attack ability for every level you are to get of this ability, capping at lvl 4. It would be a 10 minute? cooldown. Each further upgrade would bring more powerful units in the transport.
Perhaps the units would only last a limited time?
Also an important note on popularity, my map is a longer map requiring up to 10 people. The way the popularity system works is the sheer number of time a map is played on bnet
My map will be competing against maps like bunker wars, DOTA, star battle and such that last shorter amount of times per game or use less players per game.
I believe my map was more popular before because people died easier, it was new, it more challenging, less approachable. For example a new person would play, die and find it interesting to try again. several times to get it right. Now I made it more approachable for new players to get the hang of things in a game or two. I am happy it has been as popular as it was with all the work I put into it, I hope to keep it within the first pages at the very least, thats my goal for now.
Just gotta get the bugs out now and remove the beta for good.
I've heard from a couple other players that it would be nice for pvp if the game didn't end with the death of the soul collector, maybe make it be the last one standing + the death of the soul collector?
Also, I think the new prices work well. I like the new heroes.
Perhaps a specific mode that is directed toward pvp and has no natives?
@Abacus142: Go
Exactly! The whole perimeter idea and fighting over the funding centers ideas are great and could definitely make a fun game in and of itself.
@Necrothe: Go
Alright, as requested I made a PvP option removing the need to worry about natives completely. Right now there can only be one winner but alliances can be formed admist the game, just eventually know it will have to be broken. The game goes endlessly until one is alive. Runs the same otherwise!
Exp is not saved but will be loaded, also exp gain is much faster in PVP than the other modes.
There's a bug regarding the ability points of the special ops ghost commander. My commander is currently level 4 but every time I start a new game, I only have 2 ability points that I can add. Not really sure if it applies to the other new commander or not since I haven't played him. Is it possible to repair or heal your scvs (engineers)? The technicians can't repair them and medics don't heal them. Also, your armored weapons and emergency ammo both have the hotkey V at the command beacon. Any chance you can change one of those hotkeys?
What are your character codes guys, I definitely have to game with you guys lol. And IDK about the pvp thing... seems fairly easy, as they don't have to worry about as many things. I have to test that avec mes amis... And, are you sure you can't change settings? I've seen games where you can change the settings of the game through the lobby. Ask Blizzard about it! That would make public games more dynamic. Another thing you could do is implement difficulty through the game... idk how it works... I should learn some of the map editor and such... used to do this stuff in wc3
I did fix Techs so they can fix engineers now, for some reason I thought they were mechanical all this time =). I am seeing heavy weapons with hotkey C and emergency ammo as hotkey V. It is odd you have experienced differently as I haven't changed this at all since I added the units. I believe I fixed the ability selector issue, it was a misfiring with mutli threads that potentially loaded things out of order, had to throw in some wait conditions but should be good now!
I will investigate keeping options unlocked for public maps, I would like this too, I already tried alot of stuff so I will ask some others and see what I find out.
Yeah, heavy weapons are assigned to the hotkey C (they cost 40). I'm referring to the armored soldiers that cost 15 and upgrade into rangers.