And how would make you make a dota map better, than LOL?
I dont see your point... you want to clone the dota game in the myth, that you can make it better than the professionals...
I have many ideas for good dota, but it would be more like W3 TGS. I think no one here has the taste (including me) to clone maps....
keep in mind that making a game friendlier to new player, makes it less popular for hardcore players. The kind of players, who, say, might be willing to pay to play a game with other highly skilled players. Example: Is there a single hardcore WoW player left that isn't getting paid to play?
The problem I see is that you don't want to pay someone until their work is "Satisfactory" in your eyes. What does this mean? you want the game to be better than all existing DOTA games before you will pay? There is a huge difference between your ideas, and what will actually work in a fair and balanced game with a high skill curve. If your ideas prevent a person from creating the gameplay you want, are they the ones held responsible?
I agree with the many above comments that you should find someone who is truly interested in making a game of this style. Unless you can pay them a fair wage, there is no way someone is going to do "work" for you under the context that they might not get paid at all if you aren't pleased with the results, be them exactly what you wanted or not. Find someone interested in your style of map, by giving an elaborate description, and then offer to pay them to work with you on it. If the basis for your map is "balance" and "perfection" then you are looking at hiring someone on who needs to get deeply involved with this game for a year+. Even paying someone 2 dollars an hour, I think you might break your budget. In a year of updates, plus the creation time; you can assume 10 hours a week for a year, on average. that is 1000 dollars; if you can find someone to work for that cheap. 500 hours of work is nothing for a high quality game. Also, you need to think of how you will get feedback on this game. No player feedback is no balance. Do you want to pay this person to test it with a friend 10,000 times? Are you going to hire someone to create a website and advertise for the game/site? Without player feedback, you have no game.
So, simple question, yes or no, do you have at least 5,000 dollars ready to invest into the creation of a game that may only be played by 16 people ever? Answer yes, and you will get some replies.
And how would make you make a dota map better, than LOL?
I dont see your point... you want to clone the dota game in the myth, that you can make it better than the professionals...
I have many ideas for good dota, but it would be more like W3 TGS. I think no one here has the taste (including me) to clone maps....
Also the problem with creating a Dota like map is that you are going up against games which have entire platforms built around them, ie, LoL, Hon and Dota 2. You can reconnect, keep track of stats, better UI situated to that type of game. This is currently impossible with Starcraft II, not to mention people need to download Sc2 @ 6gb, rather than a few hundred mb download. Battle net is a closed system, you are playing by blizzards rules and sometimes they do not make the best decisions.
Wow, nobody seems to understand that this thread is not a debate about how good an idea it is to make another DotA map. I do not care at all if you think it will succeed or not, keep your opinions to yourself. Only post in this thread if you're offering to work with me.
You do not know what my plans are, you do not know what my goals are, you do not know what my means are, and you are making assumptions you shouldn't be. Once my map is done you can judge it all you want, until then your speculation is unwelcome. Find some other means of entertaining yourself.
P.S. - If you are butthurt now and respond with more thread derailing posts, I will just report you like I did DogmaiSEA. As the mods said, contribute something useful or get out.
The problem I see is that you don't want to pay someone until their work is "Satisfactory" in your eyes. What does this mean? you want the game to be better than all existing DOTA games before you will pay? There is a huge difference between your ideas, and what will actually work in a fair and balanced game with a high skill curve. If your ideas prevent a person from creating the gameplay you want, are they the ones held responsible?
I already said that I would pay money up front, and full payment when they have met the terms agreed to before they began working on the features. Wrap your head around that, because it is how real businesses write contracts. Contracts exist to ensure both parties receive what they agreed to exchange. Are you a parachute account for DogmaiSEA by chance?
I thought I had asked many valid questions, that interested workers would like to know the answer to. If someone wants me to do a drywalling job, I dont say "yeah, I will do it" there are things that need to be known. Maybe you want a skylight installed. Skylights are problematic in terms of electrical, and leaks from the roof. This could mean that I have to get up on the roof and shingle. Maybe the person has 14 ft tall walls and getting a sheet of drywall up to the ceiling is nothing something I can do with my normal tools.
I think it is very reasonably to ask beforehand exactly how much money you are willing to spend, how much work is expected to be done, and more than a very brief description of what you want done. Serious people dont jump blindly into positions like that. If they take your "up front" payment, then decide a month into it that you are too difficult to work for, what happens? Do you demand all of your money back? do you pay for the time they spent? I am trying to express to you, as many people have, that you need to have a lot more of your plans written out if you want anyone to take this seriously. Can you not understand this?
I think it is very reasonably to ask beforehand exactly how much money you are willing to spend, how much work is expected to be done, and more than a very brief description of what you want done. Serious people dont jump blindly into positions like that. If they take your "up front" payment, then decide a month into it that you are too difficult to work for, what happens? Do you demand all of your money back? do you pay for the time they spent? I am trying to express to you, as many people have, that you need to have a lot more of your plans written out if you want anyone to take this seriously. Can you not understand this?
What I understand is that you fancy yourself some kind of advocate for people that did not ask you to speak for them. I already have 3 people that offered to work with me in pm and if people like you would stop derailing this thread I could have more. Reported.
This is last warning, only post if you of legitimate question because YOU are interested in working for the OP. Any OT post will be removed from this point
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I need cash. Ignore the kiddies who are bankrolled by mummy and daddy. $400 is what I'd expect for half a months work (2 weeks, full time @35 hours a week).
What I would need from you is a detailed game design document or concept sheet. I also have extensive knowledge of SC2Layout editing, a valid 3D Studio Max license, extensive character modelling, texturing and animation. These, I am afraid, would cost you extra.
Send me a private message if you wish to discuss this further. If not, you seriously need to evaluate your understanding of time and money - since $5.70 per hour is half of what I can earn cleaning dirty plates in a fast food joint.
A more realistic method of payment would be for you to outline certain design goals. Eg, a working hero with x abilities, y features, and z whatever else. I estimate how long it will take to complete set design goal. I complete it within 20% of estimation and you pay the agreed amount to within 20%.
Edit: Also, don't worry about me 'stealing' your idea. I'm confident I could design something better - no offense meant, I find conceptual design to be a very subjective and individualistic field. And I wouldn't create it if I wasn't being paid for it.
Edit Edit: Also, bear in mind that it is Christmas and an available start might be punctuated by two weeks of down time.
I know this is OT but I feel the OP won't mind. You guys are all a bunch of idiots. The OP is right 100%. I haven't encountered such stupidity on these forums in awhile.
It seems people don't understand the concept of pay to work. How many people here enjoy their jobs as much as a hobby? 0. He is compensating you fairly to work. He is not paying you to design the game, that is his role. So, he doesn't give two shits what you think about the idea. You just need to do the job. I can't fathom why you would attack the idea. Don't like the idea? Move the fuck on.
@DogmaiSEA: $20 an hour at a supermarket? What the fuck you smoking dude.
PS: To keep it somewhat OT, if the OP is not looking for a monopoly on game design then I'd be interested.
I just have to say... Let the guy do what he wants. He is asking for help, not what you think of his idea. Let him pay what he wants. It was helpful to tell him that he was very vague at first :). I think it would be helpful if you listed what you needed done, but in a discrete way. Meaning like someone to make UI. (But your hiding what your UI will look like to public. That's just an example.
Hmm, Idk... Don't know how much my mom would like if she found out I was getting paid for making a map, I probably shouldn't... And one thing, what makes you wan to work with me?
And how would make you make a dota map better, than LOL?
I dont see your point... you want to clone the dota game in the myth, that you can make it better than the professionals...
I have many ideas for good dota, but it would be more like W3 TGS. I think no one here has the taste (including me) to clone maps....
keep in mind that making a game friendlier to new player, makes it less popular for hardcore players. The kind of players, who, say, might be willing to pay to play a game with other highly skilled players. Example: Is there a single hardcore WoW player left that isn't getting paid to play?
The problem I see is that you don't want to pay someone until their work is "Satisfactory" in your eyes. What does this mean? you want the game to be better than all existing DOTA games before you will pay? There is a huge difference between your ideas, and what will actually work in a fair and balanced game with a high skill curve. If your ideas prevent a person from creating the gameplay you want, are they the ones held responsible?
I agree with the many above comments that you should find someone who is truly interested in making a game of this style. Unless you can pay them a fair wage, there is no way someone is going to do "work" for you under the context that they might not get paid at all if you aren't pleased with the results, be them exactly what you wanted or not. Find someone interested in your style of map, by giving an elaborate description, and then offer to pay them to work with you on it. If the basis for your map is "balance" and "perfection" then you are looking at hiring someone on who needs to get deeply involved with this game for a year+. Even paying someone 2 dollars an hour, I think you might break your budget. In a year of updates, plus the creation time; you can assume 10 hours a week for a year, on average. that is 1000 dollars; if you can find someone to work for that cheap. 500 hours of work is nothing for a high quality game. Also, you need to think of how you will get feedback on this game. No player feedback is no balance. Do you want to pay this person to test it with a friend 10,000 times? Are you going to hire someone to create a website and advertise for the game/site? Without player feedback, you have no game.
So, simple question, yes or no, do you have at least 5,000 dollars ready to invest into the creation of a game that may only be played by 16 people ever? Answer yes, and you will get some replies.
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
Also the problem with creating a Dota like map is that you are going up against games which have entire platforms built around them, ie, LoL, Hon and Dota 2. You can reconnect, keep track of stats, better UI situated to that type of game. This is currently impossible with Starcraft II, not to mention people need to download Sc2 @ 6gb, rather than a few hundred mb download. Battle net is a closed system, you are playing by blizzards rules and sometimes they do not make the best decisions.
Reevaluate your thought processes.
A dota in Starcraft will not make success, I suggest looking to go into creative partnership with someone who knows how to use the UDK.
Wow, nobody seems to understand that this thread is not a debate about how good an idea it is to make another DotA map. I do not care at all if you think it will succeed or not, keep your opinions to yourself. Only post in this thread if you're offering to work with me.
You do not know what my plans are, you do not know what my goals are, you do not know what my means are, and you are making assumptions you shouldn't be. Once my map is done you can judge it all you want, until then your speculation is unwelcome. Find some other means of entertaining yourself.
P.S. - If you are butthurt now and respond with more thread derailing posts, I will just report you like I did DogmaiSEA. As the mods said, contribute something useful or get out.
I already said that I would pay money up front, and full payment when they have met the terms agreed to before they began working on the features. Wrap your head around that, because it is how real businesses write contracts. Contracts exist to ensure both parties receive what they agreed to exchange. Are you a parachute account for DogmaiSEA by chance?
I thought I had asked many valid questions, that interested workers would like to know the answer to. If someone wants me to do a drywalling job, I dont say "yeah, I will do it" there are things that need to be known. Maybe you want a skylight installed. Skylights are problematic in terms of electrical, and leaks from the roof. This could mean that I have to get up on the roof and shingle. Maybe the person has 14 ft tall walls and getting a sheet of drywall up to the ceiling is nothing something I can do with my normal tools.
I think it is very reasonably to ask beforehand exactly how much money you are willing to spend, how much work is expected to be done, and more than a very brief description of what you want done. Serious people dont jump blindly into positions like that. If they take your "up front" payment, then decide a month into it that you are too difficult to work for, what happens? Do you demand all of your money back? do you pay for the time they spent? I am trying to express to you, as many people have, that you need to have a lot more of your plans written out if you want anyone to take this seriously. Can you not understand this?
Skype: [email protected] Current Project: Custom Hero Arena! US: battlenet:://starcraft/map/1/263274 EU: battlenet:://starcraft/map/2/186418
What I understand is that you fancy yourself some kind of advocate for people that did not ask you to speak for them. I already have 3 people that offered to work with me in pm and if people like you would stop derailing this thread I could have more. Reported.
This is last warning, only post if you of legitimate question because YOU are interested in working for the OP. Any OT post will be removed from this point
@LoneVandal: Go
I need cash. Ignore the kiddies who are bankrolled by mummy and daddy. $400 is what I'd expect for half a months work (2 weeks, full time @35 hours a week).
What I would need from you is a detailed game design document or concept sheet. I also have extensive knowledge of SC2Layout editing, a valid 3D Studio Max license, extensive character modelling, texturing and animation. These, I am afraid, would cost you extra.
Send me a private message if you wish to discuss this further. If not, you seriously need to evaluate your understanding of time and money - since $5.70 per hour is half of what I can earn cleaning dirty plates in a fast food joint.
A more realistic method of payment would be for you to outline certain design goals. Eg, a working hero with x abilities, y features, and z whatever else. I estimate how long it will take to complete set design goal. I complete it within 20% of estimation and you pay the agreed amount to within 20%.
Edit: Also, don't worry about me 'stealing' your idea. I'm confident I could design something better - no offense meant, I find conceptual design to be a very subjective and individualistic field. And I wouldn't create it if I wasn't being paid for it.
Edit Edit: Also, bear in mind that it is Christmas and an available start might be punctuated by two weeks of down time.
@Nardival: Go
Check your inbox.
I feel like I need to say this again as I've gotten 2 PMs with no attached examples of work:
I will not hire you until I've seen the kind of work you do, so give me screen shots, videos, or actual maps to show off what you are capable of.
There will be a front page post about this thread soon, and in it I will explain more about the map's background plot and goals. Stay tuned.
@LoneVandal: Go
Bombarded you on Google Talk. You were idle. Speak soon hopefully.
For those interested in talking about this project in general, but not offering to work with me:
http://www.sc2mapster.com/forums/general/off-topic/29336-crater-of-carnage-off-topic-thread/
I know this is OT but I feel the OP won't mind. You guys are all a bunch of idiots. The OP is right 100%. I haven't encountered such stupidity on these forums in awhile.
It seems people don't understand the concept of pay to work. How many people here enjoy their jobs as much as a hobby? 0. He is compensating you fairly to work. He is not paying you to design the game, that is his role. So, he doesn't give two shits what you think about the idea. You just need to do the job. I can't fathom why you would attack the idea. Don't like the idea? Move the fuck on.
@DogmaiSEA: $20 an hour at a supermarket? What the fuck you smoking dude.
PS: To keep it somewhat OT, if the OP is not looking for a monopoly on game design then I'd be interested.
@Karawasa: Go
As this is my first SC2 map I am more than willing to take design advice and suggestions from more experienced mappers.
@LoneVandal: Go
Did you catch my Google Talk bombardment? I'll be online in about 20 minutes if you want to talk further.
@LoneVandal: Go
Hmm, Idk... Don't know how much my mom would like if she found out I was getting paid for making a map, I probably shouldn't... And one thing, what makes you wan to work with me?
Can't... Get... Past... This.