Note: Yes, ik this has nothing to do with sc2mapster but I can't find it.
Me and my mother are having this dispute, she thinks dubstep is the same as hip hop. And that michael jackson invented it with his "moon walk"
NO, me and my 3 brothers all agree that dubstep is nothing close to hip hop, it even has it's own genre!
Now, lets have a look at some videos, eh?
DUBSTEP
Pretty good right? Maesque Scott is awesome, (sorry if I spelled his first name wrong) Now lets see some hip hop,
Hip Hop
BIG BIG DIFFERENCE...
Anyways, dubstep moves currently to the beat, and is slower, hip hop just screws around, does flips, fancy footwork, and etc. Someone wanna simplify it in a way to understand it for my mom?
Some dubstep may sound similar to rap. Some rap tracks use similar beat steps.
So yea. they may sound similar in some cases with difference that there's more vocal in rap (obvious), more repetition and music is more in background focus.
But that's only illusion for someone without good ear.
Dubstep have more synthesized/sharper/electric sounds with rare exception to drums.
In Rap sounds are usually more real, especially kicks which are usually soft.
Take this for example (add wobble, remove few hi hats and you have dubstep (in generic understanding)) :
Well i assumed your mom (as most of them) doesn't see difference between rap and hip hop.
EDIT: Wait, your talking about dances?
-First video shows simple robot style dance which originates from break dance (or earlier).
-Second video shows break-dance which is mainly from break beat genre (or earlier).
Hip hop doesn't really have dance. They just wave their hands ^^ and swing.
Dubstep doesn't really have own dance too. Currently people try to mix some tecktonic-like and robot, usually slowed down. Due slower and unpredictable nature is really hard to dance to. You can do something for a while for show but it's not really a viable dance.
Only truly danceable genres are those without breaks or 'step' modification where beat kicks every 4th time.
you seem to be talking about dancing like Nerfpl stated. Thats a fair bit more involved to talk and really requires a discussion. The music istelf is obvious for the most part between dubstep and hip hop.
The way I see the dancing vids;
Vid 1-
LOTS of different styles
Robot, gliding, waving, locking, ticking, liquid, probably more diverse genres on and on.... (this guys pretty incredible)
Youtube any1 of these styles and you should see how each is incorporated into the style of the video. IMO yes, MJ started it all, maybe some1 else really did, but MJ brought it to the masses and for everyone to enjoy and be a part of FOR THE MOST PART. GREAT dancers don't do ONE style, they usually take from all styles and make their own movements out of them by putting them all together with varying patterns.
Vid 2-
Lots of different styles as well (less ones that I know about TBH though as im an EDM dancer)
break dancing (all the specifics of windmills, 7 point steps etc...), tutting, acrobatics, dunno wtf else as i don't investigate this 'style' too much
Dubstep is very much heavily influenced by hip hop. at all the edm parties (most people say raves) i grew up going to the 'drum n bass / break beat / dub step' tents / rooms would be very much dressed with a hip hop style. Its a great music to mix with hip hop as the BPM are so compatible. this would be an analogy your mom would most likely agree with;
hip hop is to dubstep as hip hop is to trip hop
OR
hip hop is to rap as hip hop is to dub step
point being there is a hip hop influence. dub step grew from breaks and drum n bass, which came with a heavy reggae influence, and blah blah blah..... its art. just dig it. :D
truth be told you can talk with any friend and while discussing music one of you will disagree on the 'style' of a certain song, albeit rock, rap, techno, coutry. IE (progressive house vs progressive trance, trance vs house, indie rock vs indie dance, blah blah blah)
This hwole discussion is just diahreah of the mouth to me. like politics or religion, each has their own opinion in the end. better off to just listen and enjoy, forcing others to accept your opinion is one TOUGH COOKIE!
oh yeah, heres some really good hip hop dancers that mix a lot of styles as the vid one and theyre ON BEAT, break dancers a lot of the time do just do 'tricks' off beat, but the good ones, dance and throw tricks in on beat, and THOSE are remarkable to watch....
heresthe sizzler;
hes got a lot of similiar styles he pulled from like the dub step dancer in vid #1, this is the guy i tried to learn from for YEARS....... im heavy on the waving / gliding too....
another good hip hop style, very clean;
something i aspire to attempt to be as good as out on the floor.... hah, yeah right
'cliche' dub step dancing IMO;
i really dont like what i currently am seeing of the younger crowd actually grinding to dubstep..... get a room and just fuck already.... leave the dance floor to the dancers.....
dancing from a drum n bass awards;
that nerd can GET DOWN (the 2nd guy)
heres an old man dancing at a fiddle festival
this looks a lot like EARLY RUDIMENTARY shuffling.... haha!
and watching that 2nd vid from post #1 i see some 'jerking' such as pin dropping and stuff too.... it all evolves, grows, borrows, and learn from other styles.
ill stop with this one, one of my favorites;
truly shows the joy of pure dancing (no matter the style to what music)
dunno why i posted these, maybe you enjoyed a few... :D
Why are you even argueing this? Hip Hop is a kind of rap, Dubstep is electronical techno/trance-like music with more scratches and mixes thrown in. Argueing labels is generally pretty petty, but no one would call the Black Eyed Peas dubsteb or Skrillex Hip Hop.
Dubstep is electronical techno/trance-like music with more scratches and mixes thrown in.
Thing is, which I think that SnyderGuy's mom has misunderstood as well, that there is UNBELIEVABLY much variation to be found in the dubstep genre.
I'll give you two examples of dubstep
THIS does NOT sound like HipHop, it's dubstep.
Neither does this, it's dubstep.
Inbetween, there might be something like HipHop and that might be what your mom has heard. But like I said dubstep is the, AFAIK, most community-driven genre. It's the genre that everyone, experienced producers as well as inexperienced ones, are doing. This leads to extremely many variants, combinations etc...
Also, had I not heard a lot of dubstep before, the "standard" drum-pattern for most dubstep I might easily misinterpret like a HipHop pattern. As said, dance has nothing to do with the dubstep genre^^
If anything, those videos are the ones that are not dubstep. Did you even read my post? Variations, variants, mix-ups, combinations of genres. You have some sort of misconception about dubstep. What you're saying is like separating rock and alternative rock altogether - I'd sum it up in the genre "rock". In that case, both your and my examples are the alternative rock, as those aren't anywhere near what dubstep started out with.
"The earliest dubstep releases date back to 1998 and were darker, more experimental, instrumental dub remixes"
There's almost more electro/liquid DnB than dubstep in your second example - combinations :-)
EDIT: It seems to me like you're talking more about the actual dancing than the music itself? In that case, I ain't to no help at all ^^
And this is why you don't argue labels into that depth. The point is, who the fuck are any of you to decide 'what dubstep is'? It's not like someone wrote a holy bible on music and divined clear rules for all to read about the definitions of dubstep. There's a bunch of vague definitions that seperate it from other genres, and that's it. You could call nearly anything in this thread posted so far dubstep, except the second and third videos.
The problem with your stuff is that it's genre-vague. To examplify a genre you look for the core values of it in a song - you don't grab a song that's on the edge to make your point, since songs and even parts of songs can be named under different genres. You're doing the exact opposite of what you need to do when examplifying genres, since a clear border can never be defined.
You want the easy way out? Then is Dubstep and is Hip Hop.
What I tried to do was to widen Snyder's horizon. Genres are to be interpreted personally as well, your mom might just not care enough to see the difference.
EDIT: Now that I think about it. While you make your point, the 'core values' that you are talking about are just as abstract as the edges. We have none of the variables - to determine the core we need to find the edges and the other way around.
It seems to me like you're talking more about the actual dancing than the music itself? In that case, I ain't to no help at all ^^
YES
Dubstep is a type of dancing, it refers to the beat of a song, the moves correspond to the beat, so if the beat rises and goes faster. You might want to go a little faster, But dubstep also messes with real songs, it makes it so the beat is more interesting. Thats what allows the dancing
If you watch at the dubstep videos I posted, you see Marquese is moving to the beat, his moves respond to it. That my friends, without the beat... You might as well have been lying on the ground absolutely still...
so whats it matter, they fact that you watched their video says something terrible about you lawl
but i guess that one video for the dubstep was cool, but i tried about 3 of his other ones and they were crap. so its just because its pumped up kicks.
either way you can tell that they are both uneducated people who have nothing better to do with their time.
dubstep is generally classified by the 'wobble bass' to put it in generic terms, from what ive heard most reputable sources say. IE producing tutorials etc...
hip hop is generally classified by well..... general larry platt said it, "pants on the ground"
Simple. Dubstep is House/Electronic music that can be used to alter songs in any genre of music. Hip-hop is upbeat music that could be danced to similar to rap music :3
And this is why you don't argue labels into that depth. The point is, who the fuck are any of you to decide 'what dubstep is'? It's not like someone wrote a holy bible on music and divined clear rules for all to read about the definitions of dubstep. There's a bunch of vague definitions that seperate it from other genres, and that's it. You could call nearly anything in this thread posted so far dubstep, except the second and third videos.
The problem with your stuff is that it's genre-vague. To examplify a genre you look for the core values of it in a song - you don't grab a song that's on the edge to make your point, since songs and even parts of songs can be named under different genres. You're doing the exact opposite of what you need to do when examplifying genres, since a clear border can never be defined.
You want the easy way out? Then this is Dubstep and this is Hip Hop.
Ahh lolz!!!
This thread has provided me with so much entertainment over the past day, because of this pointless argument. I could argue all day that Rap is just a beat with some poetry, but really its just pointless! Anyway Ive had my ten cents, - This is pointless and waste of time - except for those of us who like to sit on the fence and laugh.
Someone please tell me that Snyder is trolling us hard with these wild, uninformed allegations, whether they are the beliefs of him or his "mom." Michael Jackson invented dubstep??!?! Dubstep is a type of dance, not a musical genre??!? How anyone even believes that either of these is remotely true is beyond me. Since you admit to not even being in high school yet, making you at most 14 years old, I guess I will cut you some slack purely because I know how nieve you must be.
When I opened this topic I really had no idea what to expect, you might as well say "Is smooth jazz the same as '80s hair metal?" The only similarity I can possibly draw between these two fundamentally different forms of music is that they A) both are somewhat, sometimes influenced by house and electro music B) both happen to be popular this decade.
Note: Yes, ik this has nothing to do with sc2mapster but I can't find it.
Me and my mother are having this dispute, she thinks dubstep is the same as hip hop. And that michael jackson invented it with his "moon walk" NO, me and my 3 brothers all agree that dubstep is nothing close to hip hop, it even has it's own genre!
Now, lets have a look at some videos, eh?
DUBSTEP
Pretty good right? Maesque Scott is awesome, (sorry if I spelled his first name wrong) Now lets see some hip hop,
Hip Hop
BIG BIG DIFFERENCE...
Anyways, dubstep moves currently to the beat, and is slower, hip hop just screws around, does flips, fancy footwork, and etc. Someone wanna simplify it in a way to understand it for my mom?
Some dubstep may sound similar to rap. Some rap tracks use similar beat steps.
So yea. they may sound similar in some cases with difference that there's more vocal in rap (obvious), more repetition and music is more in background focus.
But that's only illusion for someone without good ear.
Dubstep have more synthesized/sharper/electric sounds with rare exception to drums.
In Rap sounds are usually more real, especially kicks which are usually soft.
Take this for example (add wobble, remove few hi hats and you have dubstep (in generic understanding)) :
Hip hop, nots rap, dancing and music, not just singing random throw out words :D
Well i assumed your mom (as most of them) doesn't see difference between rap and hip hop.
EDIT: Wait, your talking about dances?
-First video shows simple robot style dance which originates from break dance (or earlier).
-Second video shows break-dance which is mainly from break beat genre (or earlier).
Hip hop doesn't really have dance. They just wave their hands
^^
and swing.Dubstep doesn't really have own dance too. Currently people try to mix some tecktonic-like and robot, usually slowed down. Due slower and unpredictable nature is really hard to dance to. You can do something for a while for show but it's not really a viable dance.
Only truly danceable genres are those without breaks or 'step' modification where beat kicks every 4th time.
you seem to be talking about dancing like Nerfpl stated. Thats a fair bit more involved to talk and really requires a discussion. The music istelf is obvious for the most part between dubstep and hip hop.
The way I see the dancing vids;
Vid 1- LOTS of different styles Robot, gliding, waving, locking, ticking, liquid, probably more diverse genres on and on.... (this guys pretty incredible) Youtube any1 of these styles and you should see how each is incorporated into the style of the video. IMO yes, MJ started it all, maybe some1 else really did, but MJ brought it to the masses and for everyone to enjoy and be a part of FOR THE MOST PART. GREAT dancers don't do ONE style, they usually take from all styles and make their own movements out of them by putting them all together with varying patterns.
Vid 2- Lots of different styles as well (less ones that I know about TBH though as im an EDM dancer) break dancing (all the specifics of windmills, 7 point steps etc...), tutting, acrobatics, dunno wtf else as i don't investigate this 'style' too much
Dubstep is very much heavily influenced by hip hop. at all the edm parties (most people say raves) i grew up going to the 'drum n bass / break beat / dub step' tents / rooms would be very much dressed with a hip hop style. Its a great music to mix with hip hop as the BPM are so compatible. this would be an analogy your mom would most likely agree with; hip hop is to dubstep as hip hop is to trip hop OR hip hop is to rap as hip hop is to dub step
point being there is a hip hop influence. dub step grew from breaks and drum n bass, which came with a heavy reggae influence, and blah blah blah..... its art. just dig it. :D
truth be told you can talk with any friend and while discussing music one of you will disagree on the 'style' of a certain song, albeit rock, rap, techno, coutry. IE (progressive house vs progressive trance, trance vs house, indie rock vs indie dance, blah blah blah)
This hwole discussion is just diahreah of the mouth to me. like politics or religion, each has their own opinion in the end. better off to just listen and enjoy, forcing others to accept your opinion is one TOUGH COOKIE!
:)
/rant
oh yeah, heres some really good hip hop dancers that mix a lot of styles as the vid one and theyre ON BEAT, break dancers a lot of the time do just do 'tricks' off beat, but the good ones, dance and throw tricks in on beat, and THOSE are remarkable to watch....
heresthe sizzler; hes got a lot of similiar styles he pulled from like the dub step dancer in vid #1, this is the guy i tried to learn from for YEARS....... im heavy on the waving / gliding too....
another good hip hop style, very clean; something i aspire to attempt to be as good as out on the floor.... hah, yeah right
'cliche' dub step dancing IMO;
i really dont like what i currently am seeing of the younger crowd actually grinding to dubstep..... get a room and just fuck already.... leave the dance floor to the dancers.....
dancing from a drum n bass awards; that nerd can GET DOWN (the 2nd guy)
heres an old man dancing at a fiddle festival this looks a lot like EARLY RUDIMENTARY shuffling.... haha!
and watching that 2nd vid from post #1 i see some 'jerking' such as pin dropping and stuff too.... it all evolves, grows, borrows, and learn from other styles.
ill stop with this one, one of my favorites; truly shows the joy of pure dancing (no matter the style to what music)
dunno why i posted these, maybe you enjoyed a few... :D
Why are you even argueing this? Hip Hop is a kind of rap, Dubstep is electronical techno/trance-like music with more scratches and mixes thrown in. Argueing labels is generally pretty petty, but no one would call the Black Eyed Peas dubsteb or Skrillex Hip Hop.
It has its own genre though.
Because my mom thinks she knows everything, and that her family makes her life miserable, but she makes everyones life miserable
She just got really mad and got in the car and left.... Well, who knows what just happened!
Thing is, which I think that SnyderGuy's mom has misunderstood as well, that there is UNBELIEVABLY much variation to be found in the dubstep genre.
I'll give you two examples of dubstep
THIS does NOT sound like HipHop, it's dubstep.
Neither does this, it's dubstep.
Inbetween, there might be something like HipHop and that might be what your mom has heard. But like I said dubstep is the, AFAIK, most community-driven genre. It's the genre that everyone, experienced producers as well as inexperienced ones, are doing. This leads to extremely many variants, combinations etc...
Also, had I not heard a lot of dubstep before, the "standard" drum-pattern for most dubstep I might easily misinterpret like a HipHop pattern. As said, dance has nothing to do with the dubstep genre^^
@Neonsz: Go
Those two videos are not dubstep :)
This, is dubstep....
Those two videos you showed were nothing like this...
If anything, those videos are the ones that are not dubstep. Did you even read my post? Variations, variants, mix-ups, combinations of genres. You have some sort of misconception about dubstep. What you're saying is like separating rock and alternative rock altogether - I'd sum it up in the genre "rock". In that case, both your and my examples are the alternative rock, as those aren't anywhere near what dubstep started out with.
"The earliest dubstep releases date back to 1998 and were darker, more experimental, instrumental dub remixes"
There's almost more electro/liquid DnB than dubstep in your second example - combinations :-)
EDIT: It seems to me like you're talking more about the actual dancing than the music itself? In that case, I ain't to no help at all ^^
And this is why you don't argue labels into that depth. The point is, who the fuck are any of you to decide 'what dubstep is'? It's not like someone wrote a holy bible on music and divined clear rules for all to read about the definitions of dubstep. There's a bunch of vague definitions that seperate it from other genres, and that's it. You could call nearly anything in this thread posted so far dubstep, except the second and third videos.
The problem with your stuff is that it's genre-vague. To examplify a genre you look for the core values of it in a song - you don't grab a song that's on the edge to make your point, since songs and even parts of songs can be named under different genres. You're doing the exact opposite of what you need to do when examplifying genres, since a clear border can never be defined.
You want the easy way out? Then is Dubstep and is Hip Hop.
@Mozared: Go
IKR ^^
What I tried to do was to widen Snyder's horizon. Genres are to be interpreted personally as well, your mom might just not care enough to see the difference.
EDIT: Now that I think about it. While you make your point, the 'core values' that you are talking about are just as abstract as the edges. We have none of the variables - to determine the core we need to find the edges and the other way around.
YES
Dubstep is a type of dancing, it refers to the beat of a song, the moves correspond to the beat, so if the beat rises and goes faster. You might want to go a little faster, But dubstep also messes with real songs, it makes it so the beat is more interesting. Thats what allows the dancing
If you watch at the dubstep videos I posted, you see Marquese is moving to the beat, his moves respond to it. That my friends, without the beat... You might as well have been lying on the ground absolutely still...
@SnyderGuy: Go
The truth? neither dancer has passed highschool.
so whats it matter, they fact that you watched their video says something terrible about you lawl
but i guess that one video for the dubstep was cool, but i tried about 3 of his other ones and they were crap. so its just because its pumped up kicks.
either way you can tell that they are both uneducated people who have nothing better to do with their time.
@Taintedwisp: Go
Who? Marquese scott? Or Mozard and Neonz? If it is Marquese, those dubsteps I posted are all him...
And I am not even in high school yet, so I wouldn't criticize them about that.
dubstep is generally classified by the 'wobble bass' to put it in generic terms, from what ive heard most reputable sources say. IE producing tutorials etc...
hip hop is generally classified by well..... general larry platt said it, "pants on the ground"
that is all...
Simple. Dubstep is House/Electronic music that can be used to alter songs in any genre of music. Hip-hop is upbeat music that could be danced to similar to rap music :3
Ahh lolz!!!
This thread has provided me with so much entertainment over the past day, because of this pointless argument. I could argue all day that Rap is just a beat with some poetry, but really its just pointless! Anyway Ive had my ten cents, - This is pointless and waste of time - except for those of us who like to sit on the fence and laugh.
Someone please tell me that Snyder is trolling us hard with these wild, uninformed allegations, whether they are the beliefs of him or his "mom." Michael Jackson invented dubstep??!?! Dubstep is a type of dance, not a musical genre??!? How anyone even believes that either of these is remotely true is beyond me. Since you admit to not even being in high school yet, making you at most 14 years old, I guess I will cut you some slack purely because I know how nieve you must be.
When I opened this topic I really had no idea what to expect, you might as well say "Is smooth jazz the same as '80s hair metal?" The only similarity I can possibly draw between these two fundamentally different forms of music is that they A) both are somewhat, sometimes influenced by house and electro music B) both happen to be popular this decade.
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