Is level designer a bad choice for a major in college? Starting college in the fall, and have been thinking about what I would want to be. Level designer is probably my dream job, but what's the likeliness of becoming one? I mean only decent sized companies even have them right? Google failed me when trying to look this up.
Ask yourself how much the job is worth to you, not what your chances are. If it really is your 'dream job', then go for it. Why even bother studying something else if you already know that job isn't going to make you happy. What good is money if you're not doing what you like with your life? Of course, if you would like job B 'moderately well, just not as much as game designing' and it's ten times as easy to get, that's when you should start weighing pros and cons. Is it worth to you to give up the 'dream' or not?
Cant weigh the pro's and con's when I dont know how many of these jobs are available. I have to think of my future and how I will be financially and if I just cant find a job for this anywhere. Also, while I said it's my dream job, there's no way to truly know until I experience it.
IMO it's a waste of time. To many people out there want video game jobs because they think it's all fun and games(pun not intended). But Mozared is completely right in that if you want something bad enough you can get it. But how much time can you invest in something that is that risky just because it'd be a "cool" job. Try to find a real job that's obtainable and could be fun. Just 'cause you're not playing games(rather tediously spending hours on end coding) you'd be doing something else but doesn't mean it wont be fun/fulfilling.
Problem is, there are always many people trying to get above everyone else in any position.
1. Any decision is 50% chance, and 50% effort.
2. If you want something so bad, you'll never stop knocking at the door.
3. Statistics require foretelling the future trend. What is now, may not be tomorrow.
4. Don't let other people decide for you. Follow your "destiny" your path.
5. Who you are now may not be who you are tomorrow.
If money is the goal, it's very easy to pick what potentially has a higher success rate. But there's one secret in success for any particular choice. Determination. This means that whatever your choice will be, you have to stick with it. Expand from it. Build upon it. Make connections that are related to it. Branch out to hone in on your target.
Asking if Level design is good, is like asking how many companies will need them in the future? At present? Will you be good enough and so much better than others that even in the most competitive environment you'd stand out? Are you willing to push to that limit? What will that cost you? How far can you go when push comes to shove?
There's this general advice everyone takes for granted:
1. Know thyself. Your limits, your capabilities, your weakness, strength. Then start from there.
2. Everyone is multi-talented. But not everyone is willing to unleash their potential.
3. Know what you want.
4. Know how to get there.
This is the best answer I can give. I hope it helps.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Whatever you do, wholeheartedly, moment by heartfelt moment, becomes a tool for the expression of your very soul.
I would say go for it, I too wanted to work in the video game industry however, until my family and I had a talk about my future and I realized that honing in on one thing isn't always the best thing. So I've decided that instead of putting all my efforts into something that could screw me over in the end, I will go broader giving me other options in other fun positions. In other words, I intend to major in Computer Science in general, instead of just 3D modeling, which I had originally intended to do.
Yeah, that's kinda what I was thinking. Either way though, Level designers are supposedly suppose to know code enough to read it and make minor adjustments/programs.
Thanks for all the replies, though I still cant make up my mind, but I guess I can major in more than one thing (right?)
The best advice I can give is go into a Programming or Art Degree(Based on computer design) or a hybrid of the two, which would be the best, and set yourself up to Intern at game companies, like Blizzard, or one of the many other Computer game companies, you wont really know how fun the job is until you intern at it.
The good thing about internships also is, the company is more likely to hire you after you intern with them.
Yeah, that's what I was thinking. I'm a little bit interested in art and a programing anyway. I also like designing levels and making terrain. Hints on why this job sounds perfect when it came down to reading a description about it. Would you happen to know how many years down the road in the degree I would need to start interning?
You could always start internships, make a little campaign or map and send it to some companies, just ask for an internship an maybe they offer it to you.
I'd suggest NOT going for programming or art degree first. Level design covers them all anyway, not at the same level of course, but you'll learn way enough of both to be able to work in the video game industry. If that's your "big dream", aim directly at it. If you want to get better in some field (let's say art), you could still learn it afterwards. Don't try to do both, it's a waste of time and, IMO, you can't be good at both. These are 2 completely different fields and it's better for you if you specialize later, after acquiring some experience.
Be careful though, the video game industry is flooded with gamers who think that because they play a lot, they're able to do a game. Companies can be really tough about recruiting people just because of this, which means you'll have to prove why you are better. As Alrik said, having a small project done completely on your own is a really good card to play during an interview. If you can start working on it right now, I'd suggest you do. This will give you some time to polish it. Try to go in games conventions a lot, and keep aware of which games and which technologies are out. The more you anticipate, the better. You can also give your resume in these places, there are often a lot of people from video games companies who are here in that purpose. You'll have to make the first step if you want to be noticed.
Anyway, just to give my point-of-view as a level designer (which I am... or should be, at the moment), you must be aware that level design and game design careers are almost dead ends. These kind of jobs pay well, especially after 3 or 5 years, but the hard part is to start because too many people wants to join game companies. Video games suffer a really bad reputation in society, you must be ready to work for free in the beginning because many companies are dying. I've come to a point were I had to choose between creating my own company (can't afford it), or leave my country to find a job. I'm leaving my country pretty soon, and if it fails, there are really high chances that I'll switch to a completely different career. You MUST know that, being a level or game designer is only worth when you have experience, and it's extremely hard to start your career. Seriously consider a secondary option in case your level design career fails.
lol its hard to go for one choice. in my opinion its best to apply for any job you can get because experience counts >.< eg: im nearly finishing uni in australia and graduate programs are available and it will be hard for me to get because they are limited and even if i do get it. i probs wont be doing something "fun" eg ill probs be doing analysis of stuff or documents and report writing even though im in a IT course and apply for IT area in a company because there are quite a few programmers out there and probably game companies aren't looking for someone that doesn't know alot in making games.
i think its just a case as to apply for all jobs available.
learn as much you can in lots of areas of IT/gaming/OTHER stuff but probs best to learn this design stuff that you would be learning in your own time eg: trial and error learning.
just my thoughts >.<
Videogames are a growing industry that demands qualified people, so yes, you'll have work. The only question you should ask yourself is how much would you like to work in that, and if you won't get bored easily. Just that :).
Videogames are a growing industry that demands qualified people, so yes, you'll have work. The only question you should ask yourself is how much would you like to work in that, and if you won't get bored easily. Just that :).
Lie why? videogame professionals are one of the most required positions, and you don't need to go to a big one, any local small developer would welcome you, and you can find those companies anywhere today, focused at mobile and browser games.
At least this is the situation at my country, Spain.
More important than that degree will be your portfolio. Remember that.
If the degree has some minimum of decency, he'll have his own portfolio at the end of it. The real good degree focuses on videogame projects that go together with the classes. No projects, no real learning, and yes, you'll have to work on your own to demonstrate you know what your CV says.
Because as you just said yourself, this is how it goes in Spain. I can only talk about France but it's a completely different matter, I was only able to get jobs when I was still a student. You're right about mobile phones games as far as I can tell, though browser games are done by a lot of amateurs now and it tends to apply to phone games too... So even about that, it's not as easy as it seems to get a job (again, in France). Video games companies here are dying, whatever they say. Our government had to put something in place to help these companies, by reducing taxes and encouraging innovation (we have very strong copyright policies, which applies to video games in addition to the music copyrights and such).
Most of the small developers cannot afford to pay you for the job, so they tend to choose the guys who have a really good portfolio and are ready to work no matter what happens to the company. There are too many demands and not enough jobs available, which is why it's slowly dying. My last year of study was almost entirely devoted to making a video game with my classmates, and even such a game project in our portfolio wasn't enough to get hired. We all have good resumes, but only 5 guys out of 20 have a job now (4 years after graduating), and 2 of them found their job out of France... Reality hurts.
Going for something specific like level design. Start researching job descriptions, determining what kind of salary you'll be getting, and the hours / week. Going specific loses flexibility, so you may have to make sacrifices for some things. Getting something more general like a 4 year degree has it's perks too and opens more doors depending on the merit.
Level design is one of those things you can 100% do better and Cheaper (free) outside of college.
It's also incredibly hard to get a job as a level designer at this point without prior experience. Your best bet at a job is find the hottest game out now with the best mod tools and hit it hard. If you make a popular map you may score a job.
If you want to learn level design at home then the best you could do would probably be creating levels for Crysis 2 in the CryEngine 3 and awesome looking stuff in Unreal Engine 3 (or UDK, it's free (www.udk.com)) :)
Is level designer a bad choice for a major in college? Starting college in the fall, and have been thinking about what I would want to be. Level designer is probably my dream job, but what's the likeliness of becoming one? I mean only decent sized companies even have them right? Google failed me when trying to look this up.
Ask yourself how much the job is worth to you, not what your chances are. If it really is your 'dream job', then go for it. Why even bother studying something else if you already know that job isn't going to make you happy. What good is money if you're not doing what you like with your life? Of course, if you would like job B 'moderately well, just not as much as game designing' and it's ten times as easy to get, that's when you should start weighing pros and cons. Is it worth to you to give up the 'dream' or not?
@Mozared: Go
Cant weigh the pro's and con's when I dont know how many of these jobs are available. I have to think of my future and how I will be financially and if I just cant find a job for this anywhere. Also, while I said it's my dream job, there's no way to truly know until I experience it.
IMO it's a waste of time. To many people out there want video game jobs because they think it's all fun and games(pun not intended). But Mozared is completely right in that if you want something bad enough you can get it. But how much time can you invest in something that is that risky just because it'd be a "cool" job. Try to find a real job that's obtainable and could be fun. Just 'cause you're not playing games(rather tediously spending hours on end coding) you'd be doing something else but doesn't mean it wont be fun/fulfilling.
To conclude, aint worth the energy.
Problem is, there are always many people trying to get above everyone else in any position.
1. Any decision is 50% chance, and 50% effort.
2. If you want something so bad, you'll never stop knocking at the door.
3. Statistics require foretelling the future trend. What is now, may not be tomorrow.
4. Don't let other people decide for you. Follow your "destiny" your path.
5. Who you are now may not be who you are tomorrow.
If money is the goal, it's very easy to pick what potentially has a higher success rate. But there's one secret in success for any particular choice. Determination. This means that whatever your choice will be, you have to stick with it. Expand from it. Build upon it. Make connections that are related to it. Branch out to hone in on your target.
Asking if Level design is good, is like asking how many companies will need them in the future? At present? Will you be good enough and so much better than others that even in the most competitive environment you'd stand out? Are you willing to push to that limit? What will that cost you? How far can you go when push comes to shove?
There's this general advice everyone takes for granted:
1. Know thyself. Your limits, your capabilities, your weakness, strength. Then start from there.
2. Everyone is multi-talented. But not everyone is willing to unleash their potential.
3. Know what you want.
4. Know how to get there.
This is the best answer I can give. I hope it helps.
Whatever you do, wholeheartedly, moment by heartfelt moment, becomes a tool for the expression of your very soul.
I would say go for it, I too wanted to work in the video game industry however, until my family and I had a talk about my future and I realized that honing in on one thing isn't always the best thing. So I've decided that instead of putting all my efforts into something that could screw me over in the end, I will go broader giving me other options in other fun positions. In other words, I intend to major in Computer Science in general, instead of just 3D modeling, which I had originally intended to do.
@TheAhlias: Go
Yeah, that's kinda what I was thinking. Either way though, Level designers are supposedly suppose to know code enough to read it and make minor adjustments/programs.
Thanks for all the replies, though I still cant make up my mind, but I guess I can major in more than one thing (right?)
The best advice I can give is go into a Programming or Art Degree(Based on computer design) or a hybrid of the two, which would be the best, and set yourself up to Intern at game companies, like Blizzard, or one of the many other Computer game companies, you wont really know how fun the job is until you intern at it.
The good thing about internships also is, the company is more likely to hire you after you intern with them.
@Lilianna: Go
Yeah, that's what I was thinking. I'm a little bit interested in art and a programing anyway. I also like designing levels and making terrain. Hints on why this job sounds perfect when it came down to reading a description about it. Would you happen to know how many years down the road in the degree I would need to start interning?
~Thanks.
You could always start internships, make a little campaign or map and send it to some companies, just ask for an internship an maybe they offer it to you.
I'd suggest NOT going for programming or art degree first. Level design covers them all anyway, not at the same level of course, but you'll learn way enough of both to be able to work in the video game industry. If that's your "big dream", aim directly at it. If you want to get better in some field (let's say art), you could still learn it afterwards. Don't try to do both, it's a waste of time and, IMO, you can't be good at both. These are 2 completely different fields and it's better for you if you specialize later, after acquiring some experience.
Be careful though, the video game industry is flooded with gamers who think that because they play a lot, they're able to do a game. Companies can be really tough about recruiting people just because of this, which means you'll have to prove why you are better. As Alrik said, having a small project done completely on your own is a really good card to play during an interview. If you can start working on it right now, I'd suggest you do. This will give you some time to polish it. Try to go in games conventions a lot, and keep aware of which games and which technologies are out. The more you anticipate, the better. You can also give your resume in these places, there are often a lot of people from video games companies who are here in that purpose. You'll have to make the first step if you want to be noticed.
Anyway, just to give my point-of-view as a level designer (which I am... or should be, at the moment), you must be aware that level design and game design careers are almost dead ends. These kind of jobs pay well, especially after 3 or 5 years, but the hard part is to start because too many people wants to join game companies. Video games suffer a really bad reputation in society, you must be ready to work for free in the beginning because many companies are dying. I've come to a point were I had to choose between creating my own company (can't afford it), or leave my country to find a job. I'm leaving my country pretty soon, and if it fails, there are really high chances that I'll switch to a completely different career. You MUST know that, being a level or game designer is only worth when you have experience, and it's extremely hard to start your career. Seriously consider a secondary option in case your level design career fails.
lol its hard to go for one choice. in my opinion its best to apply for any job you can get because experience counts >.< eg: im nearly finishing uni in australia and graduate programs are available and it will be hard for me to get because they are limited and even if i do get it. i probs wont be doing something "fun" eg ill probs be doing analysis of stuff or documents and report writing even though im in a IT course and apply for IT area in a company because there are quite a few programmers out there and probably game companies aren't looking for someone that doesn't know alot in making games.
i think its just a case as to apply for all jobs available.
learn as much you can in lots of areas of IT/gaming/OTHER stuff but probs best to learn this design stuff that you would be learning in your own time eg: trial and error learning.
just my thoughts >.<
Videogames are a growing industry that demands qualified people, so yes, you'll have work. The only question you should ask yourself is how much would you like to work in that, and if you won't get bored easily. Just that :).
More important than that degree will be your portfolio. Remember that.
Quoted for truth.
Quoted for lie.
Lie why? videogame professionals are one of the most required positions, and you don't need to go to a big one, any local small developer would welcome you, and you can find those companies anywhere today, focused at mobile and browser games.
At least this is the situation at my country, Spain.
If the degree has some minimum of decency, he'll have his own portfolio at the end of it. The real good degree focuses on videogame projects that go together with the classes. No projects, no real learning, and yes, you'll have to work on your own to demonstrate you know what your CV says.
Because as you just said yourself, this is how it goes in Spain. I can only talk about France but it's a completely different matter, I was only able to get jobs when I was still a student. You're right about mobile phones games as far as I can tell, though browser games are done by a lot of amateurs now and it tends to apply to phone games too... So even about that, it's not as easy as it seems to get a job (again, in France). Video games companies here are dying, whatever they say. Our government had to put something in place to help these companies, by reducing taxes and encouraging innovation (we have very strong copyright policies, which applies to video games in addition to the music copyrights and such).
Most of the small developers cannot afford to pay you for the job, so they tend to choose the guys who have a really good portfolio and are ready to work no matter what happens to the company. There are too many demands and not enough jobs available, which is why it's slowly dying. My last year of study was almost entirely devoted to making a video game with my classmates, and even such a game project in our portfolio wasn't enough to get hired. We all have good resumes, but only 5 guys out of 20 have a job now (4 years after graduating), and 2 of them found their job out of France... Reality hurts.
Going for something specific like level design. Start researching job descriptions, determining what kind of salary you'll be getting, and the hours / week. Going specific loses flexibility, so you may have to make sacrifices for some things. Getting something more general like a 4 year degree has it's perks too and opens more doors depending on the merit.
Level design is one of those things you can 100% do better and Cheaper (free) outside of college.
It's also incredibly hard to get a job as a level designer at this point without prior experience. Your best bet at a job is find the hottest game out now with the best mod tools and hit it hard. If you make a popular map you may score a job.
If you want to learn level design at home then the best you could do would probably be creating levels for Crysis 2 in the CryEngine 3 and awesome looking stuff in Unreal Engine 3 (or UDK, it's free (www.udk.com)) :)