Yeah I have no way of telling of its success in the time to come. The thinga bout casual vs. competitive players is that a casual focused game doesn't retain players, its the hardcore competitive players that breathe life into the game. Where would SC1 be if it didn't become an e-sport phenomenon? It'd have died years ago, how often do you play a lot of "old" games? Theres' very few that live as long as a game like SC1, and that primarily because of one thing: COMPETITION.
Same goes for Q3, that game would've been buried if not targetted for the competitive audience. Ultimately, a fun game for casuals has replay for a while, but soon loses its appeal, there has to be some kind of competitive spirit lingering around that draws players back to the game time and time again. Maybe you refuse to give my map a chance, and I don't know if you really care to (thats your decision), there are some epic games that've really made the game fun to watch, a lot of people are loving how fun it is to spectate Smashcraft games, and I'm hoping thats a good indicator of its future viability as a possible e-sport like DotA became.
Its going to be up to the sponsors if its worth retaining or not, basically. The game is still young so who knows.
@Mephs: Go
I played it a bit, but it was too much of the same 'ol grind for me to be fun. Call me spoiled.
Same goes for SC1 and SC2. I never liked the normal gameplay of those, to be honest. Only played SC1, because it came in a Box with all the other stuff back in the days. I tend to buy only very few games in general, because I think most of them are just not worth it. Hell, without the Editor SC2 could rot somewhere in a junk can, for all I care.
I never understood and will probably never understand the whole thing behind watching other people play games. But than again, I don't even get what's so fun about watching others in normal sport. Guess I just ain't the type (I tend to hear loud music and play games I didn't have a chance to look at yet during Football Worldcup). I can grasp high-level play when I see it, but I just don't care if that person isn't out to beat me with it. I realize there is a necessity to provide the players with this kind of stuff, but that doesn't mean I'll ever grasp why people would waste their time watching, instead of playing themselves.
You don't have to make a game "casual". What is important, is that everyone can have fun with it, even without m4d m!cr0 5k!llz, but people can always advance on their own gameplay and there is room for that higher level of play that "pros" want.
Overall, you get the same competition free stuff that SotIS has right now in SC2. There isn't anyone out to make something like that for the time being in a different/more interesting/better state. Overall, I wonder by now if we simply saw it all during WC3 and just get improved versions of it.
i loved Sniper Bald Locks cause it was competitive and required skill and while smashcraft also requires some skills it gets dillutend in the middle of all those abbilities
So yeah there's not much now, but like any other game I have no plan of stopping where its at now, there will be a lot of expansion in the future, but also remember I'm limited by BNET's limitations, and the editor's.
It's good to hear you're expanding in the future. But, as you said yourself there isn't a whole lot now. Not sure why you expect to stay at the top for long then. A bit premature maybe?
How are you limited by BNET? This is the system you are under. Everyone plays by the same rules. It's like saying life doesn't allow me to kill people at random and that's why I'm not the world leader. Well guess what? Tough shit that's how life works. Same applies here.
The editor is just fine. Doubt you have much, if anything, that you want to make that is simply impossible because of the editor. WC3 was powerful enough for DotA, and SC2 is even more powerful. Don't blame the editor.
A game like mine will most likely juggle itself between page 1 and 2 just because its a short game, so even with a lot of people playing, it gains less popularity than those longer DOTA clones with more players. Thats just the system though, nothing I can do to change that.
Again, assigning blame everywhere but yourself. You'll most likely be at page 2. I just don't see this appealing to a wide enough audience to be a page 1 game. The reason for this is not that your game is short. As I said elsewhere, it's not BNET's fault that people don't start a new game. If you had game A 60 minutes and game B 30 minutes...you can have 2 Bs before an A finishes. If people finish a B and don't play another B, well that's your fault.
ive played this but i just love how smexy it is wish i could mess with triggers what i would want to know how he did the health bars at the top during the game i know the rest is sc2layout files
I agree. But not with your reasoning. You said "can" but neglected to mention "will." I doubt most people would consider BC over SC2. The real reason is that his map is tailored to a niche audience. It doesn't have the nice learning curve that SotIS does. It doesn't have enough depth for the long run. The gameplay makes it a "in between rounds" type of thing for a lot of people.
Don't mind me trollin', but... SOTIS has a learning curve? I thought it was "Pick the Ghost or the DT before anyone else picks them".
The map is by far the most polished I've seen and is incredibly impressive. Just wanted to say that first :)
I do find it thou very overwhelming for new players, you literally get raped in your first few games. This is pretty bad as although you do want experienced players to beat beginners, there's so much to take in it requires alot of patience, perhaps too much?
Personally I think that's too many abilities, it's cool that you've made tactical ones on the sides, like dodge etc. But I think if you condescended it too less it would in fact end up being a better game overall.
For example rather than the 4 on the side abilities every Hero has, why not just have 1 'class' one, Support/Assault Hero etc.
To sum it up, what I'm saying is more is not always better.
Really nice video... total biscuit got undigested melee but he's great...
(will read the whole thread and then comment more... more forever more! and with proper punctuation (wink wink nudge nudge) but still no I for i if not called for by said artifact (punctuation)))
lot's of good (and not so good stuff) ... still love the showcasing... maybe best so far (as "presentation" (ie not teaser)... to date) .. (even though Evlyne's is enthralling...)
@ Mozared
"Don't mind me trollin', but... SOTIS has a learning curve? I thought it was "Pick the Ghost or the DT before anyone else picks them".
soo funny cause i'd say that about most "specialist in a group" type of mods... sign of times?
@Mephs specifically:
if i try it on eu... will i get raped if i don't take the tank...? and even then ?
Can you zoom ingame and does it affect the gameplay?
And finally, can i selfishly :) propose a map for terrain for your use with your mod...?
@Gorandor: Go
Yeah I have no way of telling of its success in the time to come. The thinga bout casual vs. competitive players is that a casual focused game doesn't retain players, its the hardcore competitive players that breathe life into the game. Where would SC1 be if it didn't become an e-sport phenomenon? It'd have died years ago, how often do you play a lot of "old" games? Theres' very few that live as long as a game like SC1, and that primarily because of one thing: COMPETITION.
Same goes for Q3, that game would've been buried if not targetted for the competitive audience. Ultimately, a fun game for casuals has replay for a while, but soon loses its appeal, there has to be some kind of competitive spirit lingering around that draws players back to the game time and time again. Maybe you refuse to give my map a chance, and I don't know if you really care to (thats your decision), there are some epic games that've really made the game fun to watch, a lot of people are loving how fun it is to spectate Smashcraft games, and I'm hoping thats a good indicator of its future viability as a possible e-sport like DotA became.
Its going to be up to the sponsors if its worth retaining or not, basically. The game is still young so who knows.
@Mephs: Go I played it a bit, but it was too much of the same 'ol grind for me to be fun. Call me spoiled. Same goes for SC1 and SC2. I never liked the normal gameplay of those, to be honest. Only played SC1, because it came in a Box with all the other stuff back in the days. I tend to buy only very few games in general, because I think most of them are just not worth it. Hell, without the Editor SC2 could rot somewhere in a junk can, for all I care.
I never understood and will probably never understand the whole thing behind watching other people play games. But than again, I don't even get what's so fun about watching others in normal sport. Guess I just ain't the type (I tend to hear loud music and play games I didn't have a chance to look at yet during Football Worldcup). I can grasp high-level play when I see it, but I just don't care if that person isn't out to beat me with it. I realize there is a necessity to provide the players with this kind of stuff, but that doesn't mean I'll ever grasp why people would waste their time watching, instead of playing themselves.
You don't have to make a game "casual". What is important, is that everyone can have fun with it, even without m4d m!cr0 5k!llz, but people can always advance on their own gameplay and there is room for that higher level of play that "pros" want.
Overall, you get the same competition free stuff that SotIS has right now in SC2. There isn't anyone out to make something like that for the time being in a different/more interesting/better state. Overall, I wonder by now if we simply saw it all during WC3 and just get improved versions of it.
@Mephs: Go
What is this casual vs competitive dichotomy you speak of?
i loved Sniper Bald Locks cause it was competitive and required skill and while smashcraft also requires some skills it gets dillutend in the middle of all those abbilities
It's good to hear you're expanding in the future. But, as you said yourself there isn't a whole lot now. Not sure why you expect to stay at the top for long then. A bit premature maybe?
How are you limited by BNET? This is the system you are under. Everyone plays by the same rules. It's like saying life doesn't allow me to kill people at random and that's why I'm not the world leader. Well guess what? Tough shit that's how life works. Same applies here.
The editor is just fine. Doubt you have much, if anything, that you want to make that is simply impossible because of the editor. WC3 was powerful enough for DotA, and SC2 is even more powerful. Don't blame the editor.
Again, assigning blame everywhere but yourself. You'll most likely be at page 2. I just don't see this appealing to a wide enough audience to be a page 1 game. The reason for this is not that your game is short. As I said elsewhere, it's not BNET's fault that people don't start a new game. If you had game A 60 minutes and game B 30 minutes...you can have 2 Bs before an A finishes. If people finish a B and don't play another B, well that's your fault.
ive played this but i just love how smexy it is wish i could mess with triggers what i would want to know how he did the health bars at the top during the game i know the rest is sc2layout files
Don't mind me trollin', but... SOTIS has a learning curve? I thought it was "Pick the Ghost or the DT before anyone else picks them".
Unfortunately, it is. But talk like you know.
The map is by far the most polished I've seen and is incredibly impressive. Just wanted to say that first :)
I do find it thou very overwhelming for new players, you literally get raped in your first few games. This is pretty bad as although you do want experienced players to beat beginners, there's so much to take in it requires alot of patience, perhaps too much?
Personally I think that's too many abilities, it's cool that you've made tactical ones on the sides, like dodge etc. But I think if you condescended it too less it would in fact end up being a better game overall.
For example rather than the 4 on the side abilities every Hero has, why not just have 1 'class' one, Support/Assault Hero etc.
To sum it up, what I'm saying is more is not always better.
Really nice video... total biscuit got undigested melee but he's great...
(will read the whole thread and then comment more... more forever more! and with proper punctuation (wink wink nudge nudge) but still no I for i if not called for by said artifact (punctuation)))
lot's of good (and not so good stuff) ... still love the showcasing... maybe best so far (as "presentation" (ie not teaser)... to date) .. (even though Evlyne's is enthralling...)
@ Mozared
"Don't mind me trollin', but... SOTIS has a learning curve? I thought it was "Pick the Ghost or the DT before anyone else picks them".
soo funny cause i'd say that about most "specialist in a group" type of mods... sign of times?
@Mephs specifically:
if i try it on eu... will i get raped if i don't take the tank...? and even then ?
Can you zoom ingame and does it affect the gameplay?
And finally, can i selfishly :) propose a map for terrain for your use with your mod...?