and he is wondering why he can't succeed where there is clearly already another
Monobattles map on Page 2 that the majority of the community is
comfortable with playing.
I never said anything like that, and you really do come off as a pretty enormous douchebag.
edit: to keep this from derailing further, the viability or lack thereof for my map is irrelevant, I'm asking a general question of what the next step is after completing a map to find players.
edit: to keep this from derailing further, the viability or lack thereof for my map is irrelevant, I'm asking a general question of what the next step is after completing a map to find players.
In no particular order; get yourself newsed here, make a video (or two) on YouTube, create a website, find friends to spread by word of mouth, post on Team Liquid, and post on BNET forums.
The truth is that it won't be easy. As hinted at above, your task is even harder because you will be butting heads with an already established map.
You may want to consider teaming up with the author of the other aforementioned map if possible...
Meh, I am direct and that is usually associated with being an ass. If I didn't care about the community, helping people or giving advice, I would kindly stfu.
Your question has already been answered multiple times with varying answers.
You can either try to advertise it on TeamLiquid, try to get someone famous to help you, Sixen/Husky/Day9/HD which is very unlikely, or you can accept the fact that you may be beating a dead horse, cut your losses, and work on another project.
Teaming up with the author of the other maps is pointless, because you have already established yourself as a map maker.
I say the best way is to get it on the Map Night that sc2mapster holds and hope for a reset soon after. If everyone saw your map during map night or heard that the group was playing it and the next day the pop resets than there is a good chance it'll be up there. At least that's how it looked for Mafia, I remember playing it in Map night and a day or so later pop reset and it stayed up since.
I'll give it to you, you've got good motives. You do put it very harshly though. Lets just say the guy is just at the starting line with minimal mapping experience. You come along and lay the smack down, crushing his hopes by telling him his map is total shit. Did you consider how discouraging that might be for him to up the ante and improve? Keep in mind, Not everyone can take that kind of criticism, and might just give up overall. Considering from his point of view, he probably put in a lot of effort.
With all due respect, you're clearly more experienced, and in a higher league than many in this community. But I'm sorry I have to disagree, you're not the best. There's always someone better. I'm not implying that someone is me, but by thinking you're the best, you really are giving yourself a false sense of security. I'm sure there are many people in this community that could outdo you and still reach the finish line respected, rather than hated at the end of the day. Don't expect me to step up and prove myself though, I've got more important things to do than quibble over elitism in a war of "I'm better than you". As far as I'm concerned, the best way for an individual to grow is to continually thrive to outdo themselves. The moment you say you're the best and stop trying to outdo yourself, is the moment you lose.
That's all I have to say. I shall not be returning to this thread.
In this thread there are trolls. . . the bad kind. . . either you get along or I'll start bashing heads.
If that isn't clear to you, I will invoke moderator powers the likes of which you have never seen and make you beg for mercy upon the insignificant waste of space that your prostrated body inhabits!
Hey. . . that sounded pretty cool actually. . .
REGARDLESS! Cut the childishness. The guy has a legitimate concern, stop being complete and utter tools.
@Myrkridian - What you need to do depends entirely on what your goals are. For now, let's pick 3 different degrees of dedication:
1) I want to be able to play my map with other people
This is the easiest to achieve. If you visit the IRC channel there are times of the day when a sizable group of individuals would love to test your map or, if beyond that, simply play it with you. If they like the map, they are going to be interested in playing it again down the road. You can turn this into a sort of "club" with a forum thread, play times and your own #IRC channel.
2) I want other people to be able to play my map frequently
Hit all of the popular sites: SC2Mapster, TeamLiquid, Battle.net, SC2Legacy etc.
Make a YouTube Release Trailer and any number of Gameplay Vids
Remember to update all of your threads and continue to release YouTube videos if you are updating your content
DO NOT RELY ON CELEBRITIES: Don't expect anyone to pick up your map and advertise it for you. They are more likely to spotlight your map if you impress them when they play it than if you send them the map and say "PICK ME PICK ME PICK ME!" It is exactly like playing hard to get.
3) I want to create a community for my map (Think Smashcraft by Mephs or SOTIS by Eckolnovkol)
Create your own website and possibly even a themed YouTube Channel (as opposed to any other channel)
Setup a forum on your site to communicate with fans
Dedicate external forums to advertisement/updates and internal forums to everything else
One final note: DO NOT FALL IN LOVE WITH YOUR GAME! Wait what? Why not?
Because you can't take criticism or even listen to players who want to make it better if you do. You will fall into a mindset where nobody else appreciates what you've created and they're all out to attack your map. This simply isn't true. People rarely bash a game because it's the most horrible thing they've ever seen. The bash a game because they played it, liked some feature about it and then discovered problems that prevented them from enjoying it. They then voice their concern in one way or another to try to fix this.
Yes, that means even trolls are helping you. If someone says "your game is awful, this sucks" and it's not the first time you've heard this, then you should be asking yourself if there is something about your game that annoys people. But don't assume that everything people say is true. You need to get used to hearing what a wide range of people are saying and figure out just how common certain issues are.
To be fair Dogmai, your first post said "My suggestion is don't waste your time working on Team Monobattles, because honestly, it is a map I am going to polish like a bitch after I finish Tofu...", and then in your third you call Stan "too ignorant to even fully read a post and instead will continually take out of context a specific sentence in my whole post to prove your point valid...". Now I've read that first post a couple of times, but I honestly see no real way how he took your sentence out of context. Perhaps you didn't literally say "don't make the map because I will do it better", but you damn well insinuated it - I see no other reason for that "it is a map I am going to polish like a bitch after I finish Tofu" to be there.
That said; I know the direction you're coming from, really, I do. Finding faults in companies and bruising a couple of ego's along the way because people aren't doing their job right is something I have quite some experience with. You can however, be direct without being an asshole - you can save the latter for when it's really needed.
That's not to say you don't have a point though; it's just that the retorts you've had are relatively weak, so instead of actual discussion or usefulness on the topic it's turned into a "you're an asshole" - "no, I'm not" fest. I guess Prozaic took care of warning people, though.
Recently, a custom melee map has become popular on the NA servers called Team Monobattles. I really enjoyed the map a lot - it's 4v4 where each player can only make 1 type of unit - but it had some flaws. I felt like I could do better and it would be a nice small project, so over about two weeks I cranked out a playable alpha version called Hyper Team Monobattles with some new features, like new/campaign units, a new map, the ability to see your allies unit picks, better random functionality etc.
The problem is, I have no idea where to go from here. I don't know enough bnet people to even get a full 4v4 going, I have no idea where to promote the map. I know there's an audience, but I don't really know how I would go about informing people of this version. I haven't even really been able to play a full game from start to finish to test it, so I've kept it private.
How can I find players interested in playing something like this? Are there chat channels for people that like to play custom maps? What do I do with this map now that its playable?
Now what you need to do, is do your part to make the community better, if everyone tried a little harder to make the community better, the maps would suck less, and the people would be more willing to try new maps. This is possible, and this is what I preach. The longer we wait to ingrain our community spirit into SC2, the harder it's gonna be. We can change things, not just Blizzard. I suppose your wondering how to promote your map. I think the best way is to ask, "is my map going to go to the top?", if it's not that definitely means something's wrong. Star Battle worked it's way up from the bottom to the top. But all of it's copies failed their test. Oftentimes, however, a map never gets the same momentum it once had. Rodrigo's Nexus Word Wars was not the kind of map that people would look at and find "cool". Nexus Word Wars? Do I really want to play that? Rodrigo had to boost it higher and higher till it could get to the top. When it was republished, boosting was removed and that was it for Nexus Word Wars.
Clones won't do, you'll have to think of something more original, I'm sorry.
I never said anything like that, and you really do come off as a pretty enormous douchebag.
edit: to keep this from derailing further, the viability or lack thereof for my map is irrelevant, I'm asking a general question of what the next step is after completing a map to find players.
In no particular order; get yourself newsed here, make a video (or two) on YouTube, create a website, find friends to spread by word of mouth, post on Team Liquid, and post on BNET forums.
The truth is that it won't be easy. As hinted at above, your task is even harder because you will be butting heads with an already established map.
You may want to consider teaming up with the author of the other aforementioned map if possible...
@Myrkridian: Go
Meh, I am direct and that is usually associated with being an ass. If I didn't care about the community, helping people or giving advice, I would kindly stfu.
Your question has already been answered multiple times with varying answers.
You can either try to advertise it on TeamLiquid, try to get someone famous to help you, Sixen/Husky/Day9/HD which is very unlikely, or you can accept the fact that you may be beating a dead horse, cut your losses, and work on another project.
Teaming up with the author of the other maps is pointless, because you have already established yourself as a map maker.
I say the best way is to get it on the Map Night that sc2mapster holds and hope for a reset soon after. If everyone saw your map during map night or heard that the group was playing it and the next day the pop resets than there is a good chance it'll be up there. At least that's how it looked for Mafia, I remember playing it in Map night and a day or so later pop reset and it stayed up since.
Forgive me for the derailment.. But I just have to voice out my two cents.
@DogmaiSEA: Go
I'll give it to you, you've got good motives. You do put it very harshly though. Lets just say the guy is just at the starting line with minimal mapping experience. You come along and lay the smack down, crushing his hopes by telling him his map is total shit. Did you consider how discouraging that might be for him to up the ante and improve? Keep in mind, Not everyone can take that kind of criticism, and might just give up overall. Considering from his point of view, he probably put in a lot of effort.
With all due respect, you're clearly more experienced, and in a higher league than many in this community. But I'm sorry I have to disagree, you're not the best. There's always someone better. I'm not implying that someone is me, but by thinking you're the best, you really are giving yourself a false sense of security. I'm sure there are many people in this community that could outdo you and still reach the finish line respected, rather than hated at the end of the day. Don't expect me to step up and prove myself though, I've got more important things to do than quibble over elitism in a war of "I'm better than you". As far as I'm concerned, the best way for an individual to grow is to continually thrive to outdo themselves. The moment you say you're the best and stop trying to outdo yourself, is the moment you lose.
That's all I have to say. I shall not be returning to this thread.
@FuzzYD: Go
I'll see what I can do to work on that.
prozaic muze lol
In this thread there are trolls. . . the bad kind. . . either you get along or I'll start bashing heads.
If that isn't clear to you, I will invoke moderator powers the likes of which you have never seen and make you beg for mercy upon the insignificant waste of space that your prostrated body inhabits!
Hey. . . that sounded pretty cool actually. . .
REGARDLESS! Cut the childishness. The guy has a legitimate concern, stop being complete and utter tools.
@Myrkridian - What you need to do depends entirely on what your goals are. For now, let's pick 3 different degrees of dedication:
1) I want to be able to play my map with other people
2) I want other people to be able to play my map frequently
3) I want to create a community for my map (Think Smashcraft by Mephs or SOTIS by Eckolnovkol)
One final note: DO NOT FALL IN LOVE WITH YOUR GAME! Wait what? Why not?
Because you can't take criticism or even listen to players who want to make it better if you do. You will fall into a mindset where nobody else appreciates what you've created and they're all out to attack your map. This simply isn't true. People rarely bash a game because it's the most horrible thing they've ever seen. The bash a game because they played it, liked some feature about it and then discovered problems that prevented them from enjoying it. They then voice their concern in one way or another to try to fix this.
Yes, that means even trolls are helping you. If someone says "your game is awful, this sucks" and it's not the first time you've heard this, then you should be asking yourself if there is something about your game that annoys people. But don't assume that everything people say is true. You need to get used to hearing what a wide range of people are saying and figure out just how common certain issues are.
@DogmaiSEA: Go
To be fair Dogmai, your first post said "My suggestion is don't waste your time working on Team Monobattles, because honestly, it is a map I am going to polish like a bitch after I finish Tofu...", and then in your third you call Stan "too ignorant to even fully read a post and instead will continually take out of context a specific sentence in my whole post to prove your point valid...". Now I've read that first post a couple of times, but I honestly see no real way how he took your sentence out of context. Perhaps you didn't literally say "don't make the map because I will do it better", but you damn well insinuated it - I see no other reason for that "it is a map I am going to polish like a bitch after I finish Tofu" to be there.
That said; I know the direction you're coming from, really, I do. Finding faults in companies and bruising a couple of ego's along the way because people aren't doing their job right is something I have quite some experience with. You can however, be direct without being an asshole - you can save the latter for when it's really needed.
That's not to say you don't have a point though; it's just that the retorts you've had are relatively weak, so instead of actual discussion or usefulness on the topic it's turned into a "you're an asshole" - "no, I'm not" fest. I guess Prozaic took care of warning people, though.
Now what you need to do, is do your part to make the community better, if everyone tried a little harder to make the community better, the maps would suck less, and the people would be more willing to try new maps. This is possible, and this is what I preach. The longer we wait to ingrain our community spirit into SC2, the harder it's gonna be. We can change things, not just Blizzard. I suppose your wondering how to promote your map. I think the best way is to ask, "is my map going to go to the top?", if it's not that definitely means something's wrong. Star Battle worked it's way up from the bottom to the top. But all of it's copies failed their test. Oftentimes, however, a map never gets the same momentum it once had. Rodrigo's Nexus Word Wars was not the kind of map that people would look at and find "cool". Nexus Word Wars? Do I really want to play that? Rodrigo had to boost it higher and higher till it could get to the top. When it was republished, boosting was removed and that was it for Nexus Word Wars.
Clones won't do, you'll have to think of something more original, I'm sorry.