@RodrigoAlves: Go
Lots of people do like TDs however. In life people are not always going to share you interests, this doesn't make them stupid or wrong.
Yeah, I'm done. First someone says I was complaining about my maps not being popular when I wasn't. Then someone says I was bashing Blizzard when I wasn't. You guyz are judging me angry for my maps not being popular when I was not even close to be mad!
And now.... where did these two words "stupid" and "wrong" come from? I said TDs suck for being obsolete and I made my point and explained why I think that way. Where did I call them "stupid or wrong?"
I won't stay here arguing with every new post that are seeing things that were never there in the first place. You have all the rights to criticize and disagree with me, but please, at least make sure I said the expression you're blaming me for.
If you feel like not reading this entire post, you can catch the main point at the very end.
Alright here I go, I am going to try and respond without taking any sides here.
First off, Rodrigo is right. In a way. Tower Defense maps are old school, and are no longer fun. It is my opinion that many of the tower defense maps that are in the making or that are being released (Squad TD, EleTD) are revolutionary enough to be considered something special. Rodrigo himself said that if you are going to make a TD, at least put a spin on it. Squad TD has a huge spin, whether or not it is a new feature or not. Also note that when I say "revolutionary", I mean in comparison to the traditional TD game. EleTD has the aspect of elements to the game, which makes it interesting. I actually spent a portion of my Data Monday yesterday explaining why I think that it fell, but the core concept is a good, even great one.
In pretty much everyone else's defense, Rodrigo was a bit harsh, and a bit unclear. He conflicted with himself in several of his statements, and left some key details out of his post. Oh and one more thing, give people a chance. Even if this post has motives other than what Rodrigo is saying, still treat his post as a legitimate one until proven otherwise.
Now back to what I was saying before. Rodrigo, you were to harsh. Notice the people who attacked you on this thread. Vexal, Karawasa, Chi-whatever is name is, etc. A majority of them are TD authors or co-devs. If you had instead of writing "TD's SUCK!" written something like "The average game of TD has become boring, and a major alteration of gameplay is required for the game to be fun", you would have gotten better results. Why? A, because it is true, and B because the authors that attacked you DID put a huge spin on their games! (I admit I have not played Vexal TD, but I have played EleTD and Squad TD)
Now back to what you were saying, Rodrigo. You have a valid point in this thread, and I do not think that it is one that was intended. Your OP was interesting and informative, as you said, but I do not think that is why this thread is important.
Everyone, almost everyone, in this thread attacked you. Perhaps this is a hint to you to be a little nicer in your threads? A little more, lenient and understanding? Maybe you should look into why your maps aren't popular? Have you considered that the average BNET player is NOT a nerd, and that they are already embarrassed to be playing a game called "Starcraft"? Maybe making the category "Warning- Nerds Only!" isn't the best idea.
As for everyone else, I can say the same to you about "being nicer". Rodrigo, even if he had backdoor intentions, made a legitimate thread that you completely destroyed and missed the point of. He is angry because he has made a couple of decent maps now, and they haven't become popular. It is natural to be bitter. He has kept his composure better than some of us as we watch our maps fall to the bottom. Don't forget what started the snowball on Nexus Word Wars. Did it not get banned without warning? Is that not a reason to be a bit angry?
That is my thread. If you tl;dr, here is the message that is to be taken away from this thread.
Nice = Good, Mean = Bad
Rodrigo, and everyone else for that matter, take a step back and try and think why the people on BNET don't play your maps. Have you considered, for example, that people ENJOY the simplicity of Nexus Wars, and that adding a micro element ruins that game for many people? Have you considered that 40% of the people I play with mention that they are smoking pot (exaggeration), and don't want to take the time to think, and that THAT is why they are playing custom games? To chillax, but in a competative way? Just something to think about.
Appologies I was clearly putting the words stupid and wrong in your mouth there. However, you are with out a doubt saying TDs suck and are obselete and along with Tacomanstan you are saying they are not fun. Your are both stateing this as if its fact. Yes its an old genere but people will decide what they find fun for themselves. Td's clearly are fun to the majority of gamers on battle.net.
It may not be your intention but its coming across as if your stating your opinion that td's sucks as fact and this looks very arrogant which might be why people are getting wound up by you. Your whole attitude towards the average battle.net player in other threads does make you come across as thinking the average person there is stupid or immature and cant be trusted to know whats fun and whats not for themselves.
TDs are not inherently boring. The fact is that people are just making boring games. TDs are easy to make, and the majority of people are incredibly lazy about it.
The best professionally developed games are not boring because stuff happens and the gameplay evolves over time. In most TDs, nothing ever happens! You just build a couple towers and just watch the same levels go by. The enemies will look different between levels, but it doesn't matter because the levels play out in the same way and the gameplay does not change much between 10 minutes into the game and 60 minutes into the game.
The TD genre is so stagnant, and developers seem to be content with just remaking the same stuff over and over without injecting new ideas to push the genre to a new place.
I can't speak for other mods, but I know with EleTD our initial goal was to recapture the magic of the WC3 version. Now that we've accomplished that goal, we've got big plans in the works to overhaul the gameplay and add some more engaging elements to keep things interesting all the way through.
I'm interested to see how people will react when it's complete :)
Thats why you invent a style of TD where it goes as follows:
First 5 rounds, standard TD
The screen fades out
A small minigame is randomly chosen, if you win you get 2 Vespene (Vespene is required to build towers) and the rest get 1.
Next 5 rounds, Standard TD
The Screen fades out
5 Leves of a Hero defense on part of the map is spawned, and the kills you earn in that give you Minerals to help upgrade towers.
Next 5 rounds, Standard TD
The screen fades out
Random Minigame
Next 5 rounds, Standard TD
The Screen fades out
5 Leves of a Hero defense on part of the map is spawned, and the kills you earn in that give you Minerals to help upgrade towers.
So on and so forth, so you combine multiple aspects of fun genres into 1 game that goes on longer than a standard tower defense, and its still fun!
Idea Copyrighted by Pshyched, no other person/s may not use this idea to create said map or game without consent from myself, Pshyched.
I wish I was cool like rodrigo...one can only dream...
Yeah, I'm done. First someone says I was complaining about my maps not being popular when I wasn't. Then someone says I was bashing Blizzard when I wasn't. You guyz are judging me angry for my maps not being popular when I was not even close to be mad!
And now.... where did these two words "stupid" and "wrong" come from? I said TDs suck for being obsolete and I made my point and explained why I think that way. Where did I call them "stupid or wrong?"
I won't stay here arguing with every new post that are seeing things that were never there in the first place. You have all the rights to criticize and disagree with me, but please, at least make sure I said the expression you're blaming me for.
@RodrigoAlves: Go
Rod.... your argument is something we all know as gamers.... and if you didnt Id have you say your intelligence dissapoints me....
The whole of your "research" which you just paraphrased some dude who wrote a book.
Ill sum it up way more.....
"KISS" = Keep it simple stupid
the majority of people like simple games they can pick up play and then come back to.
Thats all your wall of text is meant to say........ I dont see how it is intelligent to write a wall of text explaining this.
All of us here should be aware of this........
If you feel like not reading this entire post, you can catch the main point at the very end.
Alright here I go, I am going to try and respond without taking any sides here.
First off, Rodrigo is right. In a way. Tower Defense maps are old school, and are no longer fun. It is my opinion that many of the tower defense maps that are in the making or that are being released (Squad TD, EleTD) are revolutionary enough to be considered something special. Rodrigo himself said that if you are going to make a TD, at least put a spin on it. Squad TD has a huge spin, whether or not it is a new feature or not. Also note that when I say "revolutionary", I mean in comparison to the traditional TD game. EleTD has the aspect of elements to the game, which makes it interesting. I actually spent a portion of my Data Monday yesterday explaining why I think that it fell, but the core concept is a good, even great one.
In pretty much everyone else's defense, Rodrigo was a bit harsh, and a bit unclear. He conflicted with himself in several of his statements, and left some key details out of his post. Oh and one more thing, give people a chance. Even if this post has motives other than what Rodrigo is saying, still treat his post as a legitimate one until proven otherwise.
Now back to what I was saying before. Rodrigo, you were to harsh. Notice the people who attacked you on this thread. Vexal, Karawasa, Chi-whatever is name is, etc. A majority of them are TD authors or co-devs. If you had instead of writing "TD's SUCK!" written something like "The average game of TD has become boring, and a major alteration of gameplay is required for the game to be fun", you would have gotten better results. Why? A, because it is true, and B because the authors that attacked you DID put a huge spin on their games! (I admit I have not played Vexal TD, but I have played EleTD and Squad TD)
Now back to what you were saying, Rodrigo. You have a valid point in this thread, and I do not think that it is one that was intended. Your OP was interesting and informative, as you said, but I do not think that is why this thread is important.
Everyone, almost everyone, in this thread attacked you. Perhaps this is a hint to you to be a little nicer in your threads? A little more, lenient and understanding? Maybe you should look into why your maps aren't popular? Have you considered that the average BNET player is NOT a nerd, and that they are already embarrassed to be playing a game called "Starcraft"? Maybe making the category "Warning- Nerds Only!" isn't the best idea.
As for everyone else, I can say the same to you about "being nicer". Rodrigo, even if he had backdoor intentions, made a legitimate thread that you completely destroyed and missed the point of. He is angry because he has made a couple of decent maps now, and they haven't become popular. It is natural to be bitter. He has kept his composure better than some of us as we watch our maps fall to the bottom. Don't forget what started the snowball on Nexus Word Wars. Did it not get banned without warning? Is that not a reason to be a bit angry?
That is my thread. If you tl;dr, here is the message that is to be taken away from this thread.
Nice = Good, Mean = Bad
Rodrigo, and everyone else for that matter, take a step back and try and think why the people on BNET don't play your maps. Have you considered, for example, that people ENJOY the simplicity of Nexus Wars, and that adding a micro element ruins that game for many people? Have you considered that 40% of the people I play with mention that they are smoking pot (exaggeration), and don't want to take the time to think, and that THAT is why they are playing custom games? To chillax, but in a competative way? Just something to think about.
Great to be back and part of the community again!
Stupid people say TDs arent fun.
@zenx1: Go
TDs can be a little fun at first, but they get boring really quickly.
@Nebuli2: Go
Every game gets boring at somepoint, your argument negated
@RodrigoAlves: Go
Appologies I was clearly putting the words stupid and wrong in your mouth there. However, you are with out a doubt saying TDs suck and are obselete and along with Tacomanstan you are saying they are not fun. Your are both stateing this as if its fact. Yes its an old genere but people will decide what they find fun for themselves. Td's clearly are fun to the majority of gamers on battle.net.
It may not be your intention but its coming across as if your stating your opinion that td's sucks as fact and this looks very arrogant which might be why people are getting wound up by you. Your whole attitude towards the average battle.net player in other threads does make you come across as thinking the average person there is stupid or immature and cant be trusted to know whats fun and whats not for themselves.
@zenx1: Go
TDs seem to get boring especially quickly.
TDs are not inherently boring. The fact is that people are just making boring games. TDs are easy to make, and the majority of people are incredibly lazy about it.
The best professionally developed games are not boring because stuff happens and the gameplay evolves over time. In most TDs, nothing ever happens! You just build a couple towers and just watch the same levels go by. The enemies will look different between levels, but it doesn't matter because the levels play out in the same way and the gameplay does not change much between 10 minutes into the game and 60 minutes into the game.
The TD genre is so stagnant, and developers seem to be content with just remaking the same stuff over and over without injecting new ideas to push the genre to a new place.
@SkrowFunk: Go
I can't speak for other mods, but I know with EleTD our initial goal was to recapture the magic of the WC3 version. Now that we've accomplished that goal, we've got big plans in the works to overhaul the gameplay and add some more engaging elements to keep things interesting all the way through.
I'm interested to see how people will react when it's complete :)
When will this die out already?
Thats why you invent a style of TD where it goes as follows:
First 5 rounds, standard TD
The screen fades out
A small minigame is randomly chosen, if you win you get 2 Vespene (Vespene is required to build towers) and the rest get 1.
Next 5 rounds, Standard TD
The Screen fades out
5 Leves of a Hero defense on part of the map is spawned, and the kills you earn in that give you Minerals to help upgrade towers.
Next 5 rounds, Standard TD
The screen fades out
Random Minigame
Next 5 rounds, Standard TD
The Screen fades out
5 Leves of a Hero defense on part of the map is spawned, and the kills you earn in that give you Minerals to help upgrade towers.
So on and so forth, so you combine multiple aspects of fun genres into 1 game that goes on longer than a standard tower defense, and its still fun!
Idea Copyrighted by Pshyched, no other person/s may not use this idea to create said map or game without consent from myself, Pshyched.
@Pshyched: Go
That's actually a pretty cool idea. You could call it something like.... "Everything TD Wars".
@Mozared: Go
Tower Defense Wars of the Ancients Party
Blizz actually made a map like that in war3.
It wasn't too successful thou keep in mind :p
They did?.... I dont recall anything like that.
The Many Games Game... Lol...
I think hes talking about Skibi TD... but i will still look into my idea....
Blizzard released a multiplayer td called Blizzard TD, it was a survivor map but I don't remember any minigames.