Which games on the arcade would you consider "hardcore"?
What I mean by hardcore:
1. for players / users (playing said map) You think the game is hard and yet you/someone keep at it trying to "finish" it.
2. for mapmakers (doing the map)
(self ad: my map is such a hardcore player map / ps: i would argue that as a mapmaker too, my map is a hardcore map, but in another thread :kappaross: )
micro intensive / macro required / multitasking / "wtf" open "live" world / puzzle solving / high score ranking
hopefully through a "movie" experience
2 adverse users/players are submersed into a city and have to scout/find specific buildings/units to destroy/move/capture/etc)..
the discovering it yourself in an open world is in itself a skill required.
Two heroes with one set to "end the game", while the other requires more subtlety but is rewarded by a separate rank/high score (tm soon).
The idea being that both these heroes can destroy the map and/or each other indefinitely, it is their reaching their specific / confrontational goals first that matters, the way in which that is done is up to the users.
The map yields resources (min/gas/terr) and these are required for certain abilities, some abilities use the life of the hero as resource.
Secondary heroes / map bosses
These are all "steal-able" provided you have a unit that has the appropriate ability (agent or other).
The distribution is not meant to be balanced .. the evil forces are meant to overwhelm by brute force (the ai and the invading user/player will have more assets than the "saving" party).
xxx is meant to fight as little as possible so as to allow others to be freed and brought to safety, restoring "democracy" to Babylone. The agents are meant to be used freely, as counterweight to the tide of darkness and destruction that is unavoidably near.
z is suppose to be a ragnarok like weapon / loony taking over every place he sets foot in. He has specific assets that once gained lead to overwhelming game ending odds.
(winning with z is easy, winning with xxx is hard.. in a sense this was designed thoroughly to allow for different player skill level to be scaled when setting up the game)
This remains a melee map, if you lose your last building .. you lose. So awarding some of your buildings protection is paramount.
The camera "work" will soon be omni present..
(trust me, i do not wish to impair the starcraft/god mode view by zooming (again like a loony), i mean to make events / fights more cinematic .. which in turn will add another layer of multitasking/focus/skill required).
Soon (hashtag) i will be adding stuff that require the players to zoom and pan to see/overcome/understand specific targets/goals/etc
.. right now it is a "try and play it like this and you will die extra fast"
The "reaching win goal" (for each hero) is a puzzle in itself (besides destroying all opposition / melee trigger).
How to get control of assets requires to scout/discover the map's hiding places (generally spotted by the presence of a doodad/effect), and soon (hashtag tm) .. to resolve little riddles.
ps: i would add 8 players that can ally to one or the other "prime" user, but it is the (tm) next challenge, not yet done. When i do .. the team aspect will be present too :P !
Psionic Warfare: Total Destruction (shameless plug)
After you complete beginner mode, you will be hard pressed to find a mod on the Arcade that requires more twitch skill then Total Destruction. Even with a team full of veterans, you will very rarely be able to beat it. Its also hardcore in the sense that it takes a long time (1 full playthrough can take about 2,5 hours) and the entire time it is just relentless.
after beating easy, normal, or hard modes, there is still very hard and extreme modes; extreme being to this day undefeated- even by me, the creator.
(you dont have to beat a difficulty mode to advance to the next. you can play your first game on hard for example) battlenet://starcraft/map/1/253683
Going to agree, and as an addendum, all maps of the same genre have the same vein. So Undead Assault 3. Night of the Dead, The Rising Dead, Undead Assault Chronicles all are pretty hardcore and very unforgiving, especially in higher difficulties where even minor mistakes can lead to catastrophic full team wipes (complete with cursing in Vent, and much rage). Often games stretch for over an hour (real time).
objectively, the arcade doesn't have much "strictly competitive maps" because most of it is a bunch of T.D in different forms . Those maps require knowledge but dont really require any mechanical skill hence why they are so laid back. The same can be said for the maps like desert strike. For such maps its really a question of game knowledge rather than any sort of skill or dexterity that will be needed. So while one can rate these maps hard, they aren't "as hard" as other competitive maps when compared because the maps i am about to mention require a lot of game knowledge and "micro".
If we are talking about truly competitive maps that require Strategy/dexterity and speed that aren't the standard starcraft 2 melee game.
Then having played all top 20 maps on sc2 arcade, i'd say the top 3 truly competitive maps are
-Heroes of the storm.
These maps all pit the players against each other in a game of micro and overall strategy. Like you cant just play these maps once or twice and expect to win. It takes time. So i'd say those in the order i listed are the most competitive.
I think pictionary is a pretty hardcore map. I came in an innocent child and came out an old man no longer oblivious to the dark realities of human lives.
:D i <3 u
I cast my vote on photon cycles (even though it is broken right now) ..
as temp4141 typed, I feel competitiveness (pure user versus users) is the most hardcore!
While there is a definite difference between spending hours finding solutions items or other (figuring out the map) and reaching (teaching yourself) the micro/mechanics required to succeed in it (versus users mainly (the ai too to a lesser degree)) .. both are limitless ...
the map can be updated to add further story (stuff to figure out / act out) and the game play mechanics can have no skill ceiling (again mostly in user vs user context).
So in a sense, puzzles can always be added but gameplay mechanics rule!
What makes a game hardcore?
(putting aside the quality/genre of the game itself) So far:
Previous play / knowledge of the map required
Teamwork sync required
Long to get to the "end" / Stamina required
Hard to understand
Hard to micro
Hard to multitask
Too many gameplays coexisting to cope
Hard to get help with the map (from the map itself and users ingame)
I am kind of surprised.. you all answered the what.. but ignored the why...?!
Why do players try to beat those maps?
Of course one can answer "coz its da bomb", but which gameplays/puzzles/events do players enjoy so much that they submit themselves willingly to them?
Is it social? (people like to be in the game where everyone is and shine there/whatever)
Is it the lore?
Is it the game mechanics?
Am I getting through? :D between the spambots
ps: my map is meant to be funny to play, i think that is the magic ingredient (not sure you can make "funny" for everyone.. but i'm here trying!)