I'm working on a competitive Arcade map and nearly have all the game rules in place, which has led me to wonder - am I better off releasing it in a bare bones fashion and tweaking and polishing it as I gather feedback, or should I polish it up to a gleaming shine before I let anybody see it? The former usually results in a better game, but I'm not familiar with the SC2 community (I downloaded SC2 specifically to build this game - hello!) so I have no idea if that would work here.
PS: I'd like to apologise for my weird username. It's a result of a glitch in the Curse network and will hopefully be cleaned up soon. Please call me Farbs. Thanks, and hello!
Try creating a project and go from there. Scmapster environment is very friendly for the type of map your working on, you can launch a testing or beta stage on your project and get comments or suggestions from the people who tested it. You may aswell get some help if anyone likes what you'r doing.
@Farbs: Go
my 5 cents:
if you release it early and get ratings lower than 4 stars you wont be able to get enough ppl for further testing or at least it takes way more time to fill the lobby. thx to bnet 2.0.
you have to polish the map to a degree that it is playable and winable, terrain must be good enough (functional but not without any eye candys) and ofc no major bugs that crash or stop the map.
if you polish it too much you might be too biased for further changes because you spend already so much time with your map.
Release as soon as your map works. The problem with mods and maps alike is that they rarely get finished. Mapmakers get a surge of creativity, but this tends to only carry them so far, and often doesn't last for the length of time that it takes to make a map. Starting a map is fast, fun, and so creative, but that feeling will be replaced by the grind eventually. The grind to finish off all those little details and systems, and suddenly the whole project feels like a complete chore. I'd say that this is where most projects end up lingering.
Why release early? Because seeing your map work and perhaps even enjoyed can refresh the above motivation. Alternatively it can save you a lot of time if you realize that your project isn't as good as you thought it might be.
A little from column A and a little from column B. I agree much with what Funky said. Especially since a lot of users will leave a bad review up and never come back to change/edit it, which could leave you with several 1 star reviews that could be from when you even had it in the game description that the game was alpha or beta stage. Of course, you could potentially reupload the same map under a new name which has its positives and negatives.
Wow, thanks everyone! I have to admit after reading "SC2 is dead" all over the internet I'd assumed it would take days to get a response here. I'm really glad to see that I was wrong.
From all this advice I'm now thinking I'd be best off releasing as soon as the core gameplay and feedback is in place and solid - it's a pretty simple concept so that shouldn't take long. My plan is to release the map under a different name with ALPHA BUILD in the title, then re-release under a non-alpha title when I think it's ready for people to rate it. Does that sound like a reasonable plan?
Again, I'm really pleased to see that this community is alive and thumping. Awesome stuff. I am excited.
SC2 is not dead yet! I do find that showing screenshots really helps a lot specially for the visual mapsters like me and to top it off a vid. and a continue update of the tread as far as progress goes and more screen shots. Fixing bugs, new abilities. new eye candy ect. good luck with your project.
Why release early? Because seeing your map work and perhaps even enjoyed can refresh the above motivation. Alternatively it can save you a lot of time if you realize that your project isn't as good as you thought it might be.
Let me play devil's advocate and respond to that: by publishing early you're also showing your unfinished, crappy prototype map to the entire arcade, and a lot of people may jump into it, decide it's crap, and simply never come back again. This used to be a way bigger problem when the popularity system was still a thing, but that doesn't mean you should disregard this entirely.
Just to point out the dark side of releasing early...
It all depends if it is playable and worth playing. You should never subject players to a "waste of time" which is what many good projects are in a very early stage of development. If what you have is fun and playable then publish it even if it is highly incomplete with key features missing. An example would be an AoS map where you have only 10 our of the intended 40 heroes finished. As long as the mechanics are fun and those 10 heroes work you can always add the 40 later.
What you want to avoid is the situation that "Mission Frontier" suffered from where he released it to the public long before the final mechanics and save system was implemented. Even though he warned users of possible save wipes they were still pissed at him for wiping their progress after 40 odd hours playing. He also had to wipe many times due to critical bugs and faults with the save system. The result was a map that is actually pretty mechanically cleaver was given bad reviews and has faded into obscurity.
If you plan on having any form of save feature with progress you want to finalize that before a public release. You cannot make major modifications to the save system or progress system once you go live as doing so will kill your map even if it was popular before.
Let me play devil's advocate and respond to that: by publishing early you're also showing your unfinished, crappy prototype map to the entire arcade, and a lot of people may jump into it, decide it's crap, and simply never come back again. This used to be a way bigger problem when the popularity system was still a thing, but that doesn't mean you should disregard this entirely.
Just to point out the dark side of releasing early...
You're absolutely right, it's always a risk. Whether that risk is worth taking boils down to how confident you are that you'll finish your project without that extra bit of motivation, in my opinion!
I find releasing projects at all to be somewhat of a waste of time. I build projects for an internal audience, and they tend not to hear much of it until it's either complete or dead. Kind of like my current project, where the absolute most I've shown to associates and the public is an extremely outdated AI concepts video, when I have considerably more on the table and demonstrable than that media may allude to.
Don't give a shit about whether the game is dead or not - if you're worried about a game being dead and that has bearing on your project, you're already making it for the wrong reasons to begin with, and you'll never truly be satisfied. In that case, you should stop immediately and move on to another hobby/lifestyle. Keep in mind that even in "dead" games there's a million projects just like yours, and in all likelihood not a single one of them will actually be considered complete. Ask yourself what you want out of your project, and go from there.
Hi,
I'm working on a competitive Arcade map and nearly have all the game rules in place, which has led me to wonder - am I better off releasing it in a bare bones fashion and tweaking and polishing it as I gather feedback, or should I polish it up to a gleaming shine before I let anybody see it? The former usually results in a better game, but I'm not familiar with the SC2 community (I downloaded SC2 specifically to build this game - hello!) so I have no idea if that would work here.
PS: I'd like to apologise for my weird username. It's a result of a glitch in the Curse network and will hopefully be cleaned up soon. Please call me Farbs. Thanks, and hello!
Hey Farbs.
Try creating a project and go from there. Scmapster environment is very friendly for the type of map your working on, you can launch a testing or beta stage on your project and get comments or suggestions from the people who tested it. You may aswell get some help if anyone likes what you'r doing.
Good luck!
@Farbs: Go my 5 cents:
if you release it early and get ratings lower than 4 stars you wont be able to get enough ppl for further testing or at least it takes way more time to fill the lobby. thx to bnet 2.0.
you have to polish the map to a degree that it is playable and winable, terrain must be good enough (functional but not without any eye candys) and ofc no major bugs that crash or stop the map.
if you polish it too much you might be too biased for further changes because you spend already so much time with your map.
Release as soon as your map works. The problem with mods and maps alike is that they rarely get finished. Mapmakers get a surge of creativity, but this tends to only carry them so far, and often doesn't last for the length of time that it takes to make a map. Starting a map is fast, fun, and so creative, but that feeling will be replaced by the grind eventually. The grind to finish off all those little details and systems, and suddenly the whole project feels like a complete chore. I'd say that this is where most projects end up lingering.
Why release early? Because seeing your map work and perhaps even enjoyed can refresh the above motivation. Alternatively it can save you a lot of time if you realize that your project isn't as good as you thought it might be.
A little from column A and a little from column B. I agree much with what Funky said. Especially since a lot of users will leave a bad review up and never come back to change/edit it, which could leave you with several 1 star reviews that could be from when you even had it in the game description that the game was alpha or beta stage. Of course, you could potentially reupload the same map under a new name which has its positives and negatives.
Wow, thanks everyone! I have to admit after reading "SC2 is dead" all over the internet I'd assumed it would take days to get a response here. I'm really glad to see that I was wrong.
From all this advice I'm now thinking I'd be best off releasing as soon as the core gameplay and feedback is in place and solid - it's a pretty simple concept so that shouldn't take long. My plan is to release the map under a different name with ALPHA BUILD in the title, then re-release under a non-alpha title when I think it's ready for people to rate it. Does that sound like a reasonable plan?
Again, I'm really pleased to see that this community is alive and thumping. Awesome stuff. I am excited.
SC2 is not dead yet! I do find that showing screenshots really helps a lot specially for the visual mapsters like me and to top it off a vid. and a continue update of the tread as far as progress goes and more screen shots. Fixing bugs, new abilities. new eye candy ect. good luck with your project.
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Let me play devil's advocate and respond to that: by publishing early you're also showing your unfinished, crappy prototype map to the entire arcade, and a lot of people may jump into it, decide it's crap, and simply never come back again. This used to be a way bigger problem when the popularity system was still a thing, but that doesn't mean you should disregard this entirely.
Just to point out the dark side of releasing early...
It all depends if it is playable and worth playing. You should never subject players to a "waste of time" which is what many good projects are in a very early stage of development. If what you have is fun and playable then publish it even if it is highly incomplete with key features missing. An example would be an AoS map where you have only 10 our of the intended 40 heroes finished. As long as the mechanics are fun and those 10 heroes work you can always add the 40 later.
What you want to avoid is the situation that "Mission Frontier" suffered from where he released it to the public long before the final mechanics and save system was implemented. Even though he warned users of possible save wipes they were still pissed at him for wiping their progress after 40 odd hours playing. He also had to wipe many times due to critical bugs and faults with the save system. The result was a map that is actually pretty mechanically cleaver was given bad reviews and has faded into obscurity.
If you plan on having any form of save feature with progress you want to finalize that before a public release. You cannot make major modifications to the save system or progress system once you go live as doing so will kill your map even if it was popular before.
You're absolutely right, it's always a risk. Whether that risk is worth taking boils down to how confident you are that you'll finish your project without that extra bit of motivation, in my opinion!
I find releasing projects at all to be somewhat of a waste of time. I build projects for an internal audience, and they tend not to hear much of it until it's either complete or dead. Kind of like my current project, where the absolute most I've shown to associates and the public is an extremely outdated AI concepts video, when I have considerably more on the table and demonstrable than that media may allude to.
Don't give a shit about whether the game is dead or not - if you're worried about a game being dead and that has bearing on your project, you're already making it for the wrong reasons to begin with, and you'll never truly be satisfied. In that case, you should stop immediately and move on to another hobby/lifestyle. Keep in mind that even in "dead" games there's a million projects just like yours, and in all likelihood not a single one of them will actually be considered complete. Ask yourself what you want out of your project, and go from there.
Simple idea: release the unpolished version under a different name