Hi. I've made an interior mission taking place in an underground cave. I've been using the roll and pitch feature on doodads to help tilt the rocks to give it a cave feeling.
I'd very much like to show it off and get some feedback on the terrain on this mission. As this mission is one in a series of three underground missions I could use some advice on which features of the terrain I should build upon.
First of all what a great start. I'd say add more small rocks and even some zealot sized rocks as well. Also try and paint the terrain under the water and just at the shore so it looks like the water has been there a while. I really like that waterfall by the way :)
Especially that first picture is really well done. The high rocks sticking out at the players' camera give a feeling of claustrophobia, which is exactly what's needed for a convincing cave. It's the opposite of the 'far off background' low-ground areas we've seen in some maps. Great job overall!
That said; your current terrain seems like more of a basic area to start off with. As mentioned, it needs some whistles and bells. The ground is empty, and I think you could do a lot in the form of stalagmites, vines, and/or other doodads hanging off the cave 'walls' (the rocks). I'll be sure to try your mission once I get back on my StarCraft PC.
Ya I gave the mission a go. Its a decent start but a long aways off as there are something things off in the map itself. The biggest issue i found was the lighting has tons of errors as in your applying several different types to the same units and areas without removing any of them or providing a smooth transition. There is little to no interaction campaign wise; you just wondering around with your speedy zealots without much micro or engagment with the environment (granted there is some environmental effects but very little especially with the size of the map.) It was funny in that i had always thought that in the waterfall pic you would have the units move down and to the right but found out in the game it was actually opposite. The starting area is far to large and there are a couple areas what seem off sized too. I did do some work other with another member as you can see here (http://www.sc2mapster.com/forums/development/terrain/56632-feedback-needed-mini-mission/). Maybe it can provide a some ideas towards how you own map should go.
Yeah, the gameplay is lacking atm, and there are no story elements in the mission yet. It needs some transmissions and interactions. I will try to think up methods on how to make the gameplay more immersive. Thankfully I have a lot of space to tinker around with.
So the fact that the water was unpassable felt a bit off?
""The biggest issue i found was the lighting has tons of errors as in your applying several different types to the same units and areas without removing any of them or providing a smooth transition.""
I was a bit unsure what you meant with this?
I was a bit unsatisfied with the omni lights in the red foggy area of the map, but I thought the use of lightning was a somewhat big selling point on this map. I hope you can elaborate a bit on this, because I very much like to know more.
Also, I should have told everyone, it must be played at High graphics setting or higher or the tint of the doodads will look a bit weird.
Looks great, I like underground terrains! What you really miss is some rocks on the ground scattered throughout the paths. Stalactites, stalagmites any objects of that kind and piles of rocks.
The oasis is a good start, but it doesn't feel like it's underground. The lighting is too bright and uniform. You might try making it darker overall, with more clearly defined pools of sunlight leaking in to illuminate key areas.
It might also look better with fewer (but larger) sunbeam doodads.
This. You can try making it look like one of those huge caves with a big hole in the top/middle section through which light falls in - kind of a deeply secluded grove. That would probably make it feel a bit like Maraudon from World of WarCraft. Worth the try, anyhow.
I guess Tel's right, considering I actually thought that area was outside, based on the screenies.
I would see If you could make it work without trees, as that would make it slightly more realistic (at least I think that's more realistic), and maybe you could experiment with rocks (arches, towers) above the oasis, in front of the players vision, which could possibly make it seem more enclosed. Perhaps turn some rock tower doodads upside down, and make them into stalactites, trying to get the base high enough to be out of view.
Overall it's a good start, but could use some general additions like small rocks, more vines, and even some Zerus water plants in the water.
Edit: Also, you could possibly add some 'oasis patches' along the paths leading up to the oasis, to make the transition to it look a little better. By this I mean throwing some grass and sand patches here and there, slowly getting denser and denser until you enter the oasis.
Excellent advice that with the small patches of oasis along the way.
I'll work some more on this, I'm gonna redo a great part of the map. Make it a bit more dense and claustrophobic in other areas as well, and make more effficient use of the empty spaces.
Btw, do you guys have any ideas for undeground/cave enemy encounters? I need some inspiration.
For underground monsters, try experimenting with the hostile creeps found in the HotS evolution missions. Things like the one that splits upon death (Mito-scarab, I think). Those would be ideal, as to not segregate an entire race (most likely Zerg) as 'cave dwellers'.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I do terrain stuff.
...
And in a Starcraft haiku,
...
That's all I can do!
Hi. I've made an interior mission taking place in an underground cave. I've been using the roll and pitch feature on doodads to help tilt the rocks to give it a cave feeling.
I'd very much like to show it off and get some feedback on the terrain on this mission. As this mission is one in a series of three underground missions I could use some advice on which features of the terrain I should build upon.
Download Cave Mission
First of all what a great start. I'd say add more small rocks and even some zealot sized rocks as well. Also try and paint the terrain under the water and just at the shore so it looks like the water has been there a while. I really like that waterfall by the way :)
@GhostNova91: Go
Yes, the cave floor does kinda look a bit empty. I shall try to add some more small rocks and try out some terrain painting. Thanks
Be sure to give the mission a playthrought too ;)
Especially that first picture is really well done. The high rocks sticking out at the players' camera give a feeling of claustrophobia, which is exactly what's needed for a convincing cave. It's the opposite of the 'far off background' low-ground areas we've seen in some maps. Great job overall!
That said; your current terrain seems like more of a basic area to start off with. As mentioned, it needs some whistles and bells. The ground is empty, and I think you could do a lot in the form of stalagmites, vines, and/or other doodads hanging off the cave 'walls' (the rocks). I'll be sure to try your mission once I get back on my StarCraft PC.
@Mozared: Go
Ya I gave the mission a go. Its a decent start but a long aways off as there are something things off in the map itself. The biggest issue i found was the lighting has tons of errors as in your applying several different types to the same units and areas without removing any of them or providing a smooth transition. There is little to no interaction campaign wise; you just wondering around with your speedy zealots without much micro or engagment with the environment (granted there is some environmental effects but very little especially with the size of the map.) It was funny in that i had always thought that in the waterfall pic you would have the units move down and to the right but found out in the game it was actually opposite. The starting area is far to large and there are a couple areas what seem off sized too. I did do some work other with another member as you can see here (http://www.sc2mapster.com/forums/development/terrain/56632-feedback-needed-mini-mission/). Maybe it can provide a some ideas towards how you own map should go.
@hobbidude: Go
Yeah, the gameplay is lacking atm, and there are no story elements in the mission yet. It needs some transmissions and interactions. I will try to think up methods on how to make the gameplay more immersive. Thankfully I have a lot of space to tinker around with.
So the fact that the water was unpassable felt a bit off?
""The biggest issue i found was the lighting has tons of errors as in your applying several different types to the same units and areas without removing any of them or providing a smooth transition.""
I was a bit unsure what you meant with this?
I was a bit unsatisfied with the omni lights in the red foggy area of the map, but I thought the use of lightning was a somewhat big selling point on this map. I hope you can elaborate a bit on this, because I very much like to know more.
Also, I should have told everyone, it must be played at High graphics setting or higher or the tint of the doodads will look a bit weird.
@njordys: Go
Looks great, I like underground terrains! What you really miss is some rocks on the ground scattered throughout the paths. Stalactites, stalagmites any objects of that kind and piles of rocks.
@Eimtr: Go
Thanks for replies :)
I'm hoping for some feedback on the waterfall-oasises in the cave too. I've uploaded some new screens from that part of the map as well.
@njordys: Go
The oasis is a good start, but it doesn't feel like it's underground. The lighting is too bright and uniform. You might try making it darker overall, with more clearly defined pools of sunlight leaking in to illuminate key areas.
It might also look better with fewer (but larger) sunbeam doodads.
@Telthalion: Go
This. You can try making it look like one of those huge caves with a big hole in the top/middle section through which light falls in - kind of a deeply secluded grove. That would probably make it feel a bit like Maraudon from World of WarCraft. Worth the try, anyhow.
@Telthalion: Go
I guess Tel's right, considering I actually thought that area was outside, based on the screenies.
I would see If you could make it work without trees, as that would make it slightly more realistic (at least I think that's more realistic), and maybe you could experiment with rocks (arches, towers) above the oasis, in front of the players vision, which could possibly make it seem more enclosed. Perhaps turn some rock tower doodads upside down, and make them into stalactites, trying to get the base high enough to be out of view.
Overall it's a good start, but could use some general additions like small rocks, more vines, and even some Zerus water plants in the water.
Edit: Also, you could possibly add some 'oasis patches' along the paths leading up to the oasis, to make the transition to it look a little better. By this I mean throwing some grass and sand patches here and there, slowly getting denser and denser until you enter the oasis.
I've forgot to reply on this one, I have not abandoned it but have been a bit busy.
@HydraMannequin: Go
Excellent advice that with the small patches of oasis along the way.
I'll work some more on this, I'm gonna redo a great part of the map. Make it a bit more dense and claustrophobic in other areas as well, and make more effficient use of the empty spaces.
Btw, do you guys have any ideas for undeground/cave enemy encounters? I need some inspiration.
@njordys: Go
For underground monsters, try experimenting with the hostile creeps found in the HotS evolution missions. Things like the one that splits upon death (Mito-scarab, I think). Those would be ideal, as to not segregate an entire race (most likely Zerg) as 'cave dwellers'.
Or just make your own cave critter units. Remember there is that cool walking plant model nobody used.
Contribute to the wiki (Wiki button at top of page) Considered easy altering of the unit textures?
https://www.sc2mapster.com/forums/resources/tutorials/179654-data-actor-events-message-texture-select-by-id
https://media.forgecdn.net/attachments/187/40/Screenshot2011-04-17_09_16_21.jpg