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SquadCraft 2 [Beta][5 Videos]

This thread has been locked by Trieva.

I have abandoned this project.

    #1 Feb 05, 2012 at 06:11 UTC - 1 like

    SquadCraft 2

    Basic Description

    A highly strategic and tactical game. Players will alternate between commanding troops and customising them. Plenty of equipment, strategies, and game settings provide tonnes of replayability.

    Inspired by X-COMs designed by Julian Gollop

    Game Concepts

    • Easy to learn and play, hard to master
    • Can have short games, roughly between 30 mins to 1 hr
    • Can be played with plenty of friends (11 max)
    • Very rewarding towards players that make strategic decisions
    • Very dynamic gameplay that contributes to replayability
    • Realistic, including a destructible environment
    • Balanced gameplay
    • Very enjoyable
    • Very flexible in many ways, including game setups, competition, and the decisions available
    • Risk-reward gameplay. Decisions come with advantages and disadvantages

    Game Flow and Objective

    Objective: Kill all enemy marines

    Every players starts with 4 marines in any room. After 1 team remains, players can customise their marines in preparation for the next room/round. Each one can equip up to 2 guns, 1 armor, and 6 items. The game ends based on the majority vote on the win condition from the lobby.

    Marine Equipment

    Each one has their own unique strengths and weaknesses. The following are some examples:

    Sub Machine Gun (SMG)

    Very effective at wearing down armor. Only accurate at short ranges.

    Plasma Rifle

    Powerful and regenerates ammo. It is more expensive to obtain than other items.

    Heavy Armor

    Allows marines to survive several more hits. It's weight limits what else you could equip on the marine.

    Personal Teleporter

    Marines can instantly travel to a target location. There are limited uses and cooldowns in between.

    Cloaking Device

    The marine remains cloaked until they perform an action, that usually involves attacking, and cloak re-enables at the start of each turn. There are ways to detect cloaked units and taking damage also disables cloak.

    Replayability

    The following are sources of randomness:

    • Which room the players fight in
    • Lighting
    • Where the mineral pickups are spawned
    • Where players start in each room
    • Firing weapons at long range
    • Amount of armor that degrades after being hit by projectiles
    • The game mode if random is selected

    The following are what helps make the map dynamic:

    • The large variety of marine equipment to experiment with
    • The different research paths you can choose
    • Different game modes for a different experience
    • The interesting decision making in tactical battles
    • Figuring how to beat or counter other players
    • Learning how to adjust play style based on the amount of players
    • Learning to improvise with what is available
    • The behaviour of enemy players, especially if it changes often
    • Weighing the risk and rewards of your decisions

    Videos

    Final Comments

    This is not supposed to be an exact replica of the original X-COM games. Just simplified, multiplayer supportive, and my own spin on the gameplay. I've also used many game concepts and mechanics that I feel make the original X-COMs great.

    A big thanks to all who helped make this map possible. This includes those directly involved in this project and the mapster community :D

    Last edited Jun 09, 2013 by Trieva
    #2 Feb 29, 2012 at 08:24 UTC - 0 likes

    Just bumping so more people can see this.

    #3 Mar 02, 2012 at 22:28 UTC - 1 like

    ok, turnbased systems has its fun, especially when no one expects the game to be fast

    I may notice, that autodeselecting groups is annoying, why couldn't we give group orders?

    also, parallel turns would save alot of time, but i'm not sure is it possib;e to implement without loosing a tb feeling

    also, it could be useful to select an obsticle like a box and know how it works what is it protects against and some more useful info

    #4 Mar 03, 2012 at 00:19 UTC - 1 like

    @Zolden: Go

    Parallel turns would be possible to implement, but the problem mainly is figuring out how the heck they would work. Seeing as energy effectively translates to time, It would almost be like they have the ability to manipulate time to an extent, which would not really work right. Now, reactionary effects, if you save energy, might be o.k, like the ability to dodge, or return fire, but to a significantly limited extent, might be ok. Another idea, one that would not really work well, would be that you all set up your orders each turn, then they all excecute without input. The obvious problem with that is how it would make aiming pretty much impossible, since you cant react to enemy movement. So parallel turns, really not viable, unless you can think of anouther model that works.

    Auto-deselecting groups I think is good, as it would prevent mistakes you can easily make doing it. I understand why some people would want to be able to do it however, so an option to disable would be nice.

    Selecting obstacles, or utilizing the help menu for info like that would be nice.

    Edit: Actually, one thing to note, is that the map already pretty much hit the script limit, seeing as last I checked, AI crashes it, so any new additions might NOT be possible.

    Two things I think need to be added, is an exo-inventory, so you dont have to sell stuff, Seller remorse (can rebuy stuff for the same sell price if you misclick) and confimation for starting, so as to avoid accidents.

    Also, The cover system should show a text message when a projectile missiles, and hits debris instead. Also, a lot of hits appear to be directly on, and do not appear to have hit depris (especially the uber-damage wepaons that tend to make the debris explode instantly) but do not deal damage to the target.

    Finally, Would it be possible to have an alternate mode, where both sides start with equal amounts of minerals and money each round ,rather than depending on performance? I would like to try a match without snowballing effects.

    Last edited Mar 03, 2012 by Ranakastrasz
    #5 Mar 03, 2012 at 07:27 UTC - 0 likes

    Thanks so much for the feedback. I wasn't expecting it for a variety of reasons, and this thread was initially intended to let interested players know this map is now on EU.

    @Zolden: Go

    I don't mind allowing players to order groups of marines at once. I definitely see the advantage of efficiency and saving time, especially when wanting to move a group to the same location. I kept this because the very early stages of my map required units to be ordered one at a time. I guess I just forgot about it over time.

    I agree that parallel turns would save alot of time and I have a good idea of how to do it. I'll explain it below.

    Adding useful info about obstacles is a good idea. Although whether the obstacle is low-cover (meaning only crouch protects you while near it) or not is all I want to show when selecting/mouse-hovering it. The obstacles are really simple, like in X-COM, where all you need to know is they're destroyed when shot enough, and explosives destroy them faster. I should probably mention somewhere that rockets/grenades/plasma destroy any obstacle much quicker than other weapons.

    @Ranakastrasz: Go

    I have my own simultaneous turns idea that I think should work and will explain it below.

    I'll definitely add obstacle info somewhere.

    You're right about the script limit. Partly for that reason, I'm working on a new project (in my signature). This allows me to add more stuff.

    I think selling is necessary in case you go over the inventory limit and want to remove gear. I'm pretty sure I have something in place to prevent re-buying the same thing. Confirmation for avoiding mis-clicks is a good idea. I just hope it doesn't annoy players when they're fairly accurate with clicking or want to buy all their equipment quickly. I'm not sure exactly what you mean by 'exo-inventory'.

    I don't think it's necessary to add clear indicators of projectile collision. Couldn't you check the marine HP and deduce whether him or the debris was hit?

    I''ve already decided to remove resource rewards based on performance. But I still plan on keeping kill bounty.

    Parallel Turns

    Since both of you talked about this, I thought I would explain it here to save me time from re-writing it.

    My idea for parallel turns is everyone makes all their moves in real-time and everyone's turn is considered one and the same. When a new turn begins, it replenishes all units energy. The plus-side is we save heaps of time (especially with more players) and waiting for your turn is almost non-existant. Now that gameplay has real-time in it, it would also seem to negate all the good things that define a TBS.

    I was thinking, if I used mechanics already present from SquadCraft, it should keep as much of the turn based game as possible. Every action you take with your marines has consequence(s), mainly of losing energy. When any player orders their marines before another player, I don't feel that should give them any significant advantage. Once energy is drained, you must wait for the next turn to order your troops again. Essentially this is still turn based, whether you move before/after other players.

    I've also considered many real-time scenarios that might ruin the TB side, but still haven't found any. In real-time you'd probably guess that players would try projectile dodging (which I don't want). This is somewhat ineffective in my map though. It can be hard to judge whether another marine is about to fire so if you're being really jumpy, you're wasting energy that could be used to fire back or get into a good position.

    The only real downside I can see is if marines are low on HP, it's fairly easy retreating them than finishing them off as the opponent (as soon as a new turn begins), especially when you want to kill them here and now. Although this can be countered by the fact that all marines take damage and having a squad of near dead marines won't help this.

    Based on my understanding of my parallel turns, I feel the gameplay should still encourage players to be careful and strategic like you would be in a traditional TBS while removing the issue of time. If anyone can see flaws with this approach, please bring them up so I can fix it.

    My turn based system is subject to change and this is what I have settled on so far.

    Last edited Mar 03, 2012 by Trieva
    #6 Mar 03, 2012 at 07:39 UTC - 0 likes

    Big Update

    In case no-one has noticed my signature (or seen my general-chat thread), I've decided to work on a new project intended to improve on SquadCraft in every way possible. This means I will not be updating/patching it any more.

    However, your feedback (on the first game) is still welcome as it will influence my new project because of the many similarities in gameplay. This is a good reason to keep playing SquadCraft 1.

    Another reason to keep playing, is I have no idea when the new project will finish. SquadCraft 1 is the closest you'll get to a playable TBS game of that style.

    Last edited Mar 03, 2012 by Trieva
    #7 Mar 03, 2012 at 17:13 UTC - 1 like
    Quote from Trieva: Go

    I don't mind allowing players to order groups of marines at once. I definitely see the advantage of efficiency and saving time, especially when wanting to move a group to the same location. I kept this because the very early stages of my map required units to be ordered one at a time. I guess I just forgot about it over time.

    Ah, ok. That makes sense.

    Quote from Trieva: Go

    I agree that parallel turns would save alot of time and I have a good idea of how to do it. I'll explain it below.

    Adding useful info about obstacles is a good idea. Although whether the obstacle is low-cover (meaning only crouch protects you while near it) or not is all I want to show when selecting/mouse-hovering it. The obstacles are really simple, like in X-COM, where all you need to know is they're destroyed when shot enough, and explosives destroy them faster. I should probably mention somewhere that rockets/grenades/plasma destroy any obstacle much quicker than other weapons.

    Yep, Also, Hopefully you can *fix* the, Tooltips, Healthbars, And death animations to all scale properly, as well as display the hover-over text that is helpful for the units. I think when those tiny rocks (with enormous health bars, also clearly based on Destructable debris) are destoryed, They ought not cover half the screen in that death animation. That, and saying that they are short or tall, would be nice.

    Quote from Trieva: Go

    I'll definitely add obstacle info somewhere.

    You're right about the script limit. Partly for that reason, I'm working on a new project (in my signature). This allows me to add more stuff.

    I think selling is necessary in case you go over the inventory limit and want to remove gear. I'm pretty sure I have something in place to prevent re-buying the same thing. Confirmation for avoiding mis-clicks is a good idea. I just hope it doesn't annoy players when they're fairly accurate with clicking or want to buy all their equipment quickly. I'm not sure exactly what you mean by 'exo-inventory'.

    Well, selling is required, I know that. After all, you have a limit as to how much you can equip your dudes with. What do you mean by preventing re-buying? Does that mean it already gives a discount, or actually cause the action to fail? I think it ought to save the equipment you had at the start, and each transaction, recalculate the total cost for all of the transactions, in the cheapest way. So suppose you have two Plasma cannons, and sell two, then buy two. It would not deduce a plasma cannon's cost, because it remembers you already had two to start with, and you are only deciding what do sell/buy, not actually doing it yet. As for an exo-inventory, I suppose a better term (seeing as I made that one up) would be bank, Armory, Stockpile, Or similar. Basically, an extra inventory, which is not used in game, but you can store stuff in if you dont want to sell it when reequiping for a mission. Say you dont really need heavy armor for this mission, like if you are experimenting with light armor, so instead of selling it (and incuring the sell loss) you bank it, and then can requipt it next time, if you wish (or sell it then)

    Quote from Trieva: Go

    I don't think it's necessary to add clear indicators of projectile collision. Couldn't you check the marine HP and deduce whether him or the debris was hit?

    I can, but the problem is, Some attacks appeared to hit projectils quite far away, even at point blank range, Some appeared to have hit the target directly, but damaged rocked. Sometimes, I am unsure if a rock took damage from that attack, or earlier attacks, seeing as light weapons deal minor damage to rocks, and I cant tell if it is actually visible or not, and sometimes there are no obsicles, it appears to hit them directly, but has no effect, And I have to wonder, because of the *3 feet to the side* effect, If it hit a rock, or if it missed, or what. Oh, and since you target ground instead of units, And I cant tell if it snaps to target (if a known target is in like 0.5 distance, ought to target them directly) or not, so I might have not even aimed at them.

    Quote from Trieva: Go

    I''ve already decided to remove resource rewards based on performance. But I still plan on keeping kill bounty.

    Alright, as long as it isnt too big. Icing is OK, but giving one person the whole cake, or most of it, at the expence of everyone else is bad design imo. Some people might like it, But at the very least, Options to disable/enable perfectly balanced income would be appreciated.

    Quote from Trieva: Go

    Parallel Turns

    Since both of you talked about this, I thought I would explain it here to save me time from re-writing it.

    My idea for parallel turns is everyone makes all their moves in real-time and everyone's turn is considered one and the same. When a new turn begins, it replenishes all units energy. The plus-side is we save heaps of time (especially with more players) and waiting for your turn is almost non-existant. Now that gameplay has real-time in it, it would also seem to negate all the good things that define a TBS.

    Yea, That would obviously give advantages.

    Quote from Trieva: Go

    I was thinking, if I used mechanics already present from SquadCraft, it should keep as much of the turn based game as possible. Every action you take with your marines has consequence(s), mainly of losing energy. When any player orders their marines before another player, I don't feel that should give them any significant advantage. Once energy is drained, you must wait for the next turn to order your troops again. Essentially this is still turn based, whether you move before/after other players.

    Why do you still call it energy? isn't it time?

    Quote from Trieva: Go

    I've also considered many real-time scenarios that might ruin the TB side, but still haven't found any. In real-time you'd probably guess that players would try projectile dodging (which I don't want). This is somewhat ineffective in my map though. It can be hard to judge whether another marine is about to fire so if you're being really jumpy, you're wasting energy that could be used to fire back or get into a good position.

    Yea, Projectile dodging would be nearly impossible, I see that now.

    Quote from Trieva: Go

    The only real downside I can see is if marines are low on HP, it's fairly easy retreating them than finishing them off as the opponent (as soon as a new turn begins), especially when you want to kill them here and now. Although this can be countered by the fact that all marines take damage and having a squad of near dead marines won't help this.

    Yep, Although stun effects work. Also, I would hope that weapon attacks are instant, so that if the target is running away, you could still shoot them, and while the projectile travels, it pretends the target doesn't move (or something)

    Quote from Trieva: Go

    Based on my understanding of my parallel turns, I feel the gameplay should still encourage players to be careful and strategic like you would be in a traditional TBS while removing the issue of time. If anyone can see flaws with this approach, please bring them up so I can fix it.

    I cant see any other serious issues, although I can say that there are doubltless going to be a number of abuse holes to patch sooner or later. <<quote 568689>> My turn based system is subject to change and this is what I have settled on so far.

    Oh, one more thing. I looked at the download page, but the one I thought was correct, most recient date, It appeared not to do anything. Which download should I use of the 3?

    Last edited Mar 03, 2012 by Ranakastrasz
    #8 Mar 04, 2012 at 02:03 UTC - 0 likes
    Quote from Ranakastrasz: Go

    Yep, Also, Hopefully you can *fix* the, Tooltips, Healthbars, And death animations to all scale properly, as well as display the hover-over text that is helpful for the units.

    I didn't know things were out of proportion. I'll try to fix it.

    Quote from Ranakastrasz: Go

    What do you mean by preventing re-buying?

    I meant after you buy something, you won't be able to buy that same item again (for that marine). As a side note, if you bought anything while the marine was equipped, the game works out the difference between selling the current item and the price of the new one. There was no need to sell before buying everytime. Was that your concern?

    Quote from Ranakastrasz: Go

    Basically, an extra inventory, which is not used in game, but you can store stuff in if you dont want to sell it when reequiping for a mission.

    Ah, much clearer now. I like that idea and will give it a shot. I was thinking about that for the first game but it was my first time using dialogs heavily and I wanted to start out simple. It also helps that I've seen another game do a very similar thing, Fleet Assault.

    Quote from Ranakastrasz: Go

    I can, but the problem is, Some attacks appeared to hit projectils quite far away, even at point blank range, Some appeared to have hit the target directly, but damaged rocked. Sometimes, I am unsure if a rock took damage from that attack, or earlier attacks, seeing as light weapons deal minor damage to rocks, and I cant tell if it is actually visible or not, and sometimes there are no obsicles, it appears to hit them directly, but has no effect, And I have to wonder, because of the *3 feet to the side* effect, If it hit a rock, or if it missed, or what. Oh, and since you target ground instead of units, And I cant tell if it snaps to target (if a known target is in like 0.5 distance, ought to target them directly) or not, so I might have not even aimed at them.

    Alright. I'll look into making projectiles accurately collide with things visually. Fyi, if a marine is hit with no obstacles around, it could be the armor that absorbed the hit. I use an armor system where it's possible to completely block damage from projectiles. but is weakened with each hit. The *3 feet to the side* is meant to simulate missing at long ranges. If you're close enough to the enemy, the projectile should head straight to the target. I've also noticed a bug where the projectile collides with nearby objects that seems visually impossible, especially areas with tight spaces. I'll try fixing that too.

    Quote from Ranakastrasz: Go

    Some people might like it, But at the very least, Options to disable/enable perfectly balanced income would be appreciated.

    I like that idea. I'll add a voting system which'll enable/disable bounty. It's another interesting way to play competitively since you're defeating players with the same income as them.

    Quote from Ranakastrasz: Go

    Why do you still call it energy? isn't it time?

    I keep getting mixed up and I'm so used to SC2. Funny thing is this isn't the only mix up. X-COM had a precious resource called 'Elerium' which was used to manufacture high tech stuff. I used a similar idea and called it 'Crystals' in my map. You have no idea how many times I kept on calling them minerals :P. Yes, time is a more accurate name as I used X-COM as my inspiration. They named their energy 'Time Units' or 'Turn Units'.

    Quote from Ranakastrasz: Go

    Yep, Although stun effects work. Also, I would hope that weapon attacks are instant, so that if the target is running away, you could still shoot them, and while the projectile travels, it pretends the target doesn't move (or something)

    That's an interesting idea. It seems a bit complicated to do, but it's definitely handy getting a guarunteed hit when you're supposed to. I'll look into it. I've also decided to replace stun grenades with the smoke grenade. There's a bug with stun I haven't been able to fix yet.

    Quote from Ranakastrasz: Go

    I cant see any other serious issues, although I can say that there are doubltless going to be a number of abuse holes to patch sooner or later.

    What do you mean by 'abuse holes'? I assume you mean balance issues where players can break the game using un-intended bugs or features. Haha, don't worry, I'm ready to do plenty of balance testing/tweaking. I might even publish the map before release to help get testers ;)

    Quote from Ranakastrasz: Go

    Oh, one more thing. I looked at the download page, but the one I thought was correct, most recient date, It appeared not to do anything. Which download should I use of the 3?

    I don't know what you mean by 'not appearing to do anything'. The most recent date should be my most updated map (or the one named 'Refreshed' right now). If the download still doesn't work, just wait a short while because I'm going to upload another update.

    Thanks again for the feedback :)

    Last edited Mar 04, 2012 by Trieva
    #9 Mar 04, 2012 at 04:21 UTC - 1 like
    Quote from Trieva: Go

    @Ranakastrasz: Go

    I meant after you buy something, you won't be able to buy that same item again (for that marine). As a side note, if you bought anything while the marine was equipped, the game works out the difference between selling the current item and the price of the new one. There was no need to sell before buying everytime. Was that your concern?

    Well, Not exactly. That does explain what you said, but does not exactly address my concern, which was to allow experimentation with marine setups, without suffering huge resource losses from selling (I personally dont like using paper, and am too lazy to write a program, which I would anyhow have to minimize to use, lol) Hence the memory system I suggested.

    Quote from Trieva: Go

    @Ranakastrasz: Go

    Ah, much clearer now. I like that idea and will give it a shot. I was thinking about that for the first game but it was my first time using dialogs heavily and I wanted to start out simple. It also helps that I've seen another game do a very similar thing, Fleet Assault.

    I love fleet assault, although It has the same anti-experimentation issue, and it cant really be fixed due to nearly being at script capacity.

    Quote from Trieva: Go

    @Ranakastrasz: Go

    Alright. I'll look into making projectiles accurately collide with things visually. Fyi, if a marine is hit with no obstacles around, it could be the armor that absorbed the hit. I use an armor system where it's possible to completely block damage from projectiles. but is weakened with each hit. The *3 feet to the side* is meant to simulate missing at long ranges. If you're close enough to the enemy, the projectile should head straight to the target. I've also noticed a bug where the projectile collides with nearby objects that seems visually impossible, especially areas with tight spaces. I'll try fixing that too.

    Ah, That explains it. I was confused, because when my heavy-armored marine was hit by a grenade, he took 1 damage, so I made the obvious assumption that if the armor absorbs damage, it is reduced to 1. I suppose that explains it, but it seems a bit odd for it to fully block that huge plasma bolt, which usually vaporizes the marine instantly.

    Quote from Trieva: Go

    @Ranakastrasz: Go

    I like that idea. I'll add a voting system which'll enable/disable bounty. It's another interesting way to play competitively since you're defeating players with the same income as them.

    Yay. :D Oh, And because I managed to convince you to do that, I will push my luck and request a sandbox mode, where all the players have all research finished, and infinite resources to make a setup with, or possibly just variable starting and income values, which you can alter yourself.

    Quote from Trieva: Go

    @Ranakastrasz: Go

    I keep getting mixed up and I'm so used to SC2. Funny thing is this isn't the only mix up. X-COM had a precious resource called 'Elerium' which was used to manufacture high tech stuff. I used a similar idea and called it 'Crystals' in my map. You have no idea how many times I kept on calling them minerals :P. Yes, time is a more accurate name as I used X-COM as my inspiration. They named their energy 'Time Units' or 'Turn Units'.

    Heh, Well, Seeing as I called energy "Mana" when I started sc2, and still do half the time, But when I go to Wc3 and play abyss gates, I call it energy, well. I suppose I ought not complain. XD

    Quote from Trieva: Go

    @Ranakastrasz: Go

    That's an interesting idea. It seems a bit complicated to do, but it's definitely handy getting a guarunteed hit when you're supposed to. I'll look into it. I've also decided to replace stun grenades with the smoke grenade. There's a bug with stun I haven't been able to fix yet.

    Smoke grenades, I assume to suppress sight? And is the bug related to the armor removal thing?

    Quote from Trieva: Go

    @Ranakastrasz: Go

    What do you mean by 'abuse holes'? I assume you mean balance issues where players can break the game using un-intended bugs or features. Haha, don't worry, I'm ready to do plenty of balance testing/tweaking. I might even publish the map before release to help get testers ;)

    Yep, basically what I meant. When you make a system like that, There are bound to be issues, more so than the built-in unit system.

    Quote from Trieva: Go

    @Ranakastrasz: Go

    I don't know what you mean by 'not appearing to do anything'. The most recent date should be my most updated map (or the one named 'Refreshed' right now). If the download still doesn't work, just wait a short while because I'm going to upload another update.

    Well, If I download that one, And drop it on my sc2 game, Heres what happens. (and I tried all three before) It starts up, Shows victory dialog. I cancel, And I have no interface, units, or minimap access. I can scroll around the map, and its bare as well.

    Quote from Trieva: Go

    Thanks again for the feedback :)

    No problem. XD

    #10 Mar 04, 2012 at 05:13 UTC - 0 likes
    Quote from Ranakastrasz: Go

    Hence the memory system I suggested.

    Do you mind if I avoid the memory system altogether? If I implement exo-inventory, it should include that memory where buying a new item doesn't sell your current one. Is this the kind of experimenting you're looking for (because it lets you reuse an item you've already bought)? I like the idea of having players experiment. It does add to the fun.

    Quote from Ranakastrasz: Go

    I was confused, because when my heavy-armored marine was hit by a grenade, he took 1 damage, so I made the obvious assumption that if the armor absorbs damage, it is reduced to 1. I suppose that explains it, but it seems a bit odd for it to fully block that huge plasma bolt, which usually vaporizes the marine instantly.

    I've got to remember to mention somewhere that armor blocks more dmg from explosives than other guns. No armor should be able to block a plasma bolt completely, lol. It must be a bug or something.

    Quote from Ranakastrasz: Go

    a sandbox mode, where all the players have all research finished, and infinite resources to make a setup with, or possibly just variable starting and income values, which you can alter yourself.

    I find this quite interesting too. Lets call this mode (with infinite resources and everything researched) 'Deathmatch' :P. Variable resources might not work because wouldn't everyone choose the highest amount? Although it would be fun if everyone agreed to have the same amount and tried playing the game with low resources.

    Quote from Ranakastrasz: Go

    Smoke grenades, I assume to suppress sight? And is the bug related to the armor removal thing?

    I haven't thought about how exactly I would do smoke grenades. It's either they block vision only, or they act like that defiler ability from sc1 (which is some kind of red smoke) that blocks ranged damage. Yes, I haven't found out why stun removes armor.

    Quote from Ranakastrasz: Go

    Well, If I download that one, And drop it on my sc2 game, Heres what happens. (and I tried all three before) It starts up, Shows victory dialog. I cancel, And I have no interface, units, or minimap access. I can scroll around the map, and its bare as well.

    I have no idea why the map is doing that. Hopefully all future uploads don't do the same thing.

    Last edited Mar 04, 2012 by Trieva
    #11 Mar 04, 2012 at 15:05 UTC - 1 like
    Quote from Trieva: Go

    @Ranakastrasz: Go

    Do you mind if I avoid the memory system altogether? If I implement exo-inventory, it should include that memory where buying a new item doesn't sell your current one. Is this the kind of experimenting you're looking for (because it lets you reuse an item you've already bought)? I like the idea of having players experiment. It does add to the fun.

    Well, The Armory (probably best term to use) would certainly help. However, It would still not allow you to test out alternate equipment that would require you to sell current equipment, because if you are unable to make a viable build, then you have received a resource loss. Yea, Experimentation always adds to the fun. XD

    Quote from Trieva: Go

    @Ranakastrasz: Go

    I've got to remember to mention somewhere that armor blocks more dmg from explosives than other guns. No armor should be able to block a plasma bolt completely, lol. It must be a bug or something.

    Oh, That's odd. Im think that help or something should tell you about how armor is good vs explosions. Also, If that was a bug, Then it explains alot, lol.

    Quote from Trieva: Go

    @Ranakastrasz: Go

    I find this quite interesting too. Lets call this mode (with infinite resources and everything researched) 'Deathmatch' :P. Variable resources might not work because wouldn't everyone choose the highest amount? Although it would be fun if everyone agreed to have the same amount and tried playing the game with low resources.

    Variable resources = host choses the resources for each player. That way, You could set up senarios, like a 3 low-tech vs 1 high tech, or similar, if you wanted, or have low budget, high budget, or otherwise.

    Quote from Trieva: Go

    @Ranakastrasz: Go

    I haven't thought about how exactly I would do smoke grenades. It's either they block vision only, or they act like that defiler ability from sc1 (which is some kind of red smoke) that blocks ranged damage. Yes, I haven't found out why stun removes armor.

    Oh, Nice idea. Allows you to ruin enemy aim at things in the smoke, Or things shooting into the smoke. I have to ask what effect scan would have on that however.

    Quote from Trieva: Go

    @Ranakastrasz: Go

    I have no idea why the map is doing that. Hopefully all future uploads don't do the same thing.

    Alright, Well, next upload, Ill try it again.

    oh, Btw, The issue is, Once opened in the editer, It lacks any trigger data, aside from melee initilization. ALso, terrain is either supposed to be extremely bare, or not there, but data is fine.

    Last edited Mar 04, 2012 by Ranakastrasz
    #12 Mar 04, 2012 at 16:32 UTC - 0 likes
    Quote from Ranakastrasz: Go

    However, It would still not allow you to test out alternate equipment that would require you to sell current equipment

    But doesn't the 'storage' keep your current equipment? Buying new gear just adds to your storage so you can just mix things around. I also plan to make the storage universal so any marine can equip stuff from there.

    Quote from Ranakastrasz: Go

    Oh, That's odd. Im think that help or something should tell you about how armor is good vs explosions.

    Agreed. I just forgot because there were so many things to do on my map.

    Quote from Ranakastrasz: Go

    Variable resources = host choses the resources for each player. That way, You could set up senarios, like a 3 low-tech vs 1 high tech, or similar, if you wanted, or have low budget, high budget, or otherwise.

    I like that idea. How about we add this mode as well as 'deathmatch' to the map?

    Quote from Ranakastrasz: Go

    I have to ask what effect scan would have on that however.

    I don't what you're asking. Are you asking if the smoke cover is affected by the sensor item?

    Quote from Ranakastrasz: Go

    Alright, Well, next upload, Ill try it again.

    The next upload is now up.

    #13 Mar 04, 2012 at 17:31 UTC - 1 like
    Quote from Trieva: Go

    @Ranakastrasz: Go

    But doesn't the 'storage' keep your current equipment? Buying new gear just adds to your storage so you can just mix things around. I also plan to make the storage universal so any marine can equip stuff from there.

    Yes, Thats the idea. And on it's own it boosts flexability by a large amount. However, the one limitation is that if you need slightly more resources, and sell some of the equipment to do something, but decide to try to revert it, you cant, because the sell caused you to lose some. Fleet assault's extra storage helps, to an extent, but has the same issue. You have finite resources, and hence either can have flexable equipment, or good equipment, but not both.

    Quote from Trieva: Go

    @Ranakastrasz: Go

    I like that idea. How about we add this mode as well as 'deathmatch' to the map?

    Alright XD

    Quote from Trieva: Go

    @Ranakastrasz: Go

    I don't what you're asking. Are you asking if the smoke cover is affected by the sensor item?

    Well, It doesnt matter much, since I dont know what smoke grenades are going to do, but assuming they obscure vision, I would assume that sensors would counter them, by revealing the enemy pings. Oh, About sensor, Do you have a reduced chance of hitting a target you cant see, even if you aim directly at them? (or rather their dot)

    Quote from Trieva: Go

    @Ranakastrasz: Go

    The next upload is now up.

    Alright, Gonna try it as soon as I finish watching TB fail at ZvZ. Edit: Works so far, although tooltips missing. I like the interface setup.

    Last edited Mar 05, 2012 by Ranakastrasz
    #14 Mar 05, 2012 at 03:32 UTC - 0 likes
    Quote from Ranakastrasz: Go

    sell some of the equipment to do something, but decide to try to revert it, you cant

    I see what you mean now. It's alot easier to achieve memory by making the sell price the same (or 90-99%) of the buy price.

    Quote from Ranakastrasz: Go

    I would assume that sensors would counter them...Do you have a reduced chance of hitting a target you cant see, even if you aim directly at them?

    Having sensors counter smoke is a good idea. Otherwise the smoke becomes instant cover deploy :P. In that case I'll have a large smoke area block vision only. Accuracy is applied the same where ever you aim. I haven't found a simple way to modify accuracy in-game because the values are in the data editor.

    Quote from Ranakastrasz: Go

    although tooltips missing. I like the interface setup.

    The other project team member disabled tooltips for testing purposes I believe, but thanks for keeping an eye out in case we forgot something :) . I like the new interface too. I wanted it to be clear, simple, and better organised so players can see more of the beautiful battlefield ;)

    #15 Mar 05, 2012 at 05:24 UTC - 0 likes

    There are some great ideas here. I particularly like the idea of enabling/disabling marine bounty based on player votes. And changing the end-of-room income by player votes is great for replay value.

    #16 Mar 05, 2012 at 05:33 UTC - 1 like

    Regarding the issue of buying/selling equipment, I think it would be helpful that, when purchasing equipment for a marine, players should be able to choose and swap whatever they want but without having to commit to the transaction until they are happy with the marine setup (in which case they would click on the 'Confirm Transaction' button).

    • The following is only a suggestion. It may not reflect the finished version*

    I imagine the setup would be as follows: at the end of a room, in the initial dialog window with the marine icons and the research icon, a player clicks on a marine icon. Lets say that the player clicks on marine 1's icon. The screen then goes to marine 1's equipment screen where the purchase-able weapons/armor/items are shown as well as the marine's current weapons/armor/items (preferrably in a split screen format with the current equipment on the right hand side). Optimally, this screen should allow access to the player's storage.

    Note that the player will have to buy equipment for more than one marine so this process will be repeated multiple times.

    Here, it would help a lot if there is a little summary dialog window at the top of the screen that acts like a little financial statement which shows: The player's current credit and mineral amounts, the potential gain in selling equipment the player wanted to replace (the sell value), the purchase price of the new equipment selected by the player (the buy amount), and the remaining credits and minerals amount the player will have left should they wish to confirm their transaction.

    It would also help if the stats of the marine are summarised in a summary window as well: Max HP, Max energy, Weapon dmg and Energy cost for attacks, Max weapon range, Secondary weapon dmg, energy cost, and max range, Armor strength, a list of equipped items (preferrably showing the shield item in more detail, such as the shield hp and shield regen per turn) and the inventory space used / max inventory space.

    Last edited Mar 05, 2012 by caparosmith
    #17 Mar 05, 2012 at 06:13 UTC - 0 likes

    The rooms are a lot bigger in Squadcraft 2, so in addition to the standard "eliminate your enemy" victory condition, victory can also be achieved by capturing all three radar towers (which visually represent capture points on the battlefield). This should help prevent a hide-and-seek situation where it becomes annoying for the winning team to try to track down enemy marines.

    Also, a new feature of Squadcraft 2 is the presence of hostile marines in 2 of the rooms (they can give a small bounty).

    What are your thoughts about all this (including the stuff in the above post)?

    Last edited Mar 05, 2012 by caparosmith
    #18 Mar 05, 2012 at 12:13 UTC - 1 like

    @caparosmith: Go

    As long as the control points do not allow a *Go for the enemy gate directly* situation, I think that is a good idea.

    @Trieva: Go "I see what you mean now. It's alot easier to achieve memory by making the sell price the same (or 90-99%) of the buy price." If 100% sell price, Then no armory is required. However, it also removes any real limitation to builds aside from total resources, meaning no committing. However, You cant abuse it in this game, seeing as something like supply drops are not supported. (although that would be an interesting mechanic, call-down supplies, using surplus cash, such as med-kits, repair kits for armor, ammo, etc, but with a single turn delay, and as items that add their effect on pickup, and can be stolen if not claimed.)

    #19 Mar 05, 2012 at 12:29 UTC - 0 likes

    From what you've said, it looks like I should not have equipment memory.

    As you said, I don't want to lose the idea of committed builds because it encourages players to try out different ones the next time they play (which gives its own sense of variety and experimenting, because you can only do 1 or 2 builds per game).

    Surplus resources does remove experimentation to a degree. If your surplus resources seem like infinite really quickly, most players will go for the ultimate gear (eg highest defense armor, the most expensive energy gun, etc).

    I'm also not sure how supply drops will solve the surplus resource problem, especially if it's optional.

    Last edited Mar 05, 2012 by Trieva
    #20 Mar 05, 2012 at 12:39 UTC - 0 likes
    Quote from Trieva: Go

    Having committed builds sounds fun for my map. I also want to add the storage, so how about the extreme experimentation happens in deathmatch mode only?

    Well, If deathmode has infinite resources, Then I dont see that statement as meaning anything anyhow. :p