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Scythe

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#1 Feb 08, 2013 at 01:07 UTC - 0 likes

I would tag this thread better but this goes pretty much all across the Data sections so it wouldn't make much sense to specify something.

I am currently helping the developer of "Island Defense" (NA) by making a builder.

The builder is pretty simple as I knew GE would give him or at least me trouble, but nevertheless I have trouble and need some advice. I watched a lot of guides that deal with hero creation and abilities and they helped me a lot, but now my questions become very specific and it's hard to find guides who cover them.

First of all a short description all the things I need:

Builder having a sub menu with 1 building inside
That building having 1 unit to produce
A metric ton of abilities for the builder
The research "tree"

So I think 1 & 2 & 4 can wait, as I can figure them out myself.

I am stuck with abilities now.

What I already have:

A passive behavior that reduces damage while shields are active to a maximum of 1
An ability that can be activated to regenerate 100% of the shields instantly
An aura that increases the sight range of all units + the builder by 1.5.
An ability that makes you immune to spell-damage for 7 seconds.
An ability that roots the target in place for 4 seconds.

The last one is the first problem. I want the root-behavior to be dispelled when the target takes any damage. I made an "remove behavior" effect and added it to "damage response" but to no effect - I did something wrong.

Abilities that still need to be done:

A researchable passive that applies a behavior which lets you gain 5 energy per attack and a 0.05 movement speed buff which stacks but doesn't refresh on reapplication.
Another researchable passive that makes you cloak for 0.75 seconds whenever you take physical damage (I think I can do this without help)
Feedback, but a maybe impossible version. I want it to be targeted and drain energy from the main target and all targets in a 4 radius around it, dealing 0.5 damage per point of energy burned to the main target, meaning that the more units you hit the more damage the main target gets. If that is impossible or unnecessarily hard then an AoE Feedback would be enough.
A buff that increases movement speed by 1.5, attackspeed by 70%, decreases attackdamage by 70% and makes your attacks slow the target every 3rd hit for 99%.
An ability that cloaks the caster and all units in a 7 range radius for 10 seconds plus increasing their timescale by 15%. Note: The last two mentioned abilities are meant to lock each other out for 30 seconds.

As for the research system: You start at Tier 0 and can upgrade till Tier 3 Every Tier upgrade you can choose between 1 of 3 passive abilities. Of course they have to disable the 2 you have not chosen.

So would anyone like to help me with these things? I know it's a lot, but I am also sure they all aren't really difficult and some are even trivial.

Last edited Feb 08, 2013 by Scythe1250

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#2 Feb 08, 2013 at 08:10 UTC - 0 likes

@Scythe1250: Go

As for your damage response issue...

The damage response is on the same behavior as the root, correct? So what you want is the unit that is rooted to remove the behavior from itself when it takes damage.

You should have the following fields set to the following values:

Combat: Damage Response - Location: Defender

Combat: Damage Response - Handled: [Your Remove Behavior Effect]

Combat: Damage Response - Chance: 1

Last edited Feb 08, 2013 by MasterWrath

Trigger, layout, interface specialist for Aeon of Storms.

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#3 Feb 08, 2013 at 14:08 UTC - 0 likes

Yeah that's exactly what I did, but I think I failed somewhere at the removal effect, the question is: Where? The dev said the removal effect has to be very specific but I have no idea what I can do to make it work.

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#4 Feb 08, 2013 at 15:01 UTC - 0 likes

@Scythe1250: Go

You have to specify the name/ID of the buff you want to remove on the Remove Behavior effect (links by default if both effect and buff have the exact same name)

Otherwise try changing the Unit+ field to Source, as iirc the Target scope actually refers to the attacking unit in this case.

The on-hit can either be done via a damage response (Set->Modify Unit(Caster+5energy)+ApplyBehavior(speed buff)), or simply integrate both effects into the default weapon and add a validator to check for the upgrade.

The on-hit cloak should be done via a damage response, note that "physical" damage is ill defined, there's Melee, Ranged, AoE and Special Ability, the first 3 are all used by existing units' weapons.

The feedback can be done, but it's complicated. The stock setup won't work because that can only deal damage and compare vitals on the same unit. What you can do is remove energy (Modify Unit effect) and deal damage (to the main target) in small increments, then run this many times via a Persistent effect.

The buff is easy, the "every 3rd hit" part probably needs a damage response to stack up an invisible counter (buff, marker etc) and attmpt to apply the slow on every hit, but with an added validator that checks against the counter.

The cloak ability is fairly easy, compare with the Mothership. Note that each buff has a "time scale source", the buff will use the time scale of the specified unit when evaluating its duration ("global" is game time)

For locking out the abilities make both apply a buff to the caster (duration 30 seconds) and either make the buff deactivate the abilities or add "not having this buff" to the Requirement node for casting the ability. Either use 1 buff to lock both abilities or make 2 different ones so each ability only locks out the other one.

The tiers can be implemented in many ways, examples are morphing structures, upgrades, buffs, morphing the unit itself etc. The core of all methods are Validators and Requirement nodes which check against these changes and allow/disallow actions accordingly. For making upgrades mutually exclusive either use a "have any of them" Requirement (OR bracket filled with checks for having a specific upgrade/ability) or make "choosing" an ability also apply a hidden buff and check against that.

A rather clean system would be using ability charges: make each "tier upgrade" add the desired number of charges via a Modify Unit effect (compare Vultures rebuilding Spider Mines in the campaign), then making the "choose" ability use the same charge link for each choice in the same "tier".

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#5 Feb 08, 2013 at 15:59 UTC - 0 likes

@Photoloss: Go

I of course linked to the behavior I want to remove, still it won't work. I will try with the Unit -> Source field. Will the root then also be removed from other damage sources?

Edit: Yes now it works, it seems other units can also break the spell (that's good).

Yesterday I already did the on-hit. The speed buff works exactly like I want (stacks, each stack has its own duration), but the energy gain on hit is not working, even though I did it exactly like you said with a "Modify Unit"-Effect. I integrated the effects into the weapon. How I do this "check for upgrade" validator I have no idea, but I didn't try yet, I want to finish the abilities first.

On-hit cloak should be no problem, I just did different stuff first. And yes I know about the definitions, I was merely summarizing everything but spell damage with physical.

Feedback might become EMP, I am still tweaking the concept of the unit.

The cloak/timescale buff has been done successfully yesterday. Worked like a charm.

Locking each other out sounds quite easy now, I think I will go with the hidden buff and the requirement "not having this buff".

The Tier system and research should be doable, I just didn't mess with that yet. About the passives: I thought about the charge thing, but I don't want to have it on the unit, but on the one building she can build. And something I am not sure if I was clear: When you unlock a tier, you get 3 passives to choose from, but you can only take one. The next tier you get three entirely different passives and again can only choose one. If you played Tycoon Tower Defense then you know what I mean.

Thanks for the help so far.

Last edited Feb 08, 2013 by Scythe1250

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#6 Feb 08, 2013 at 18:37 UTC - 0 likes

@Scythe1250: Go

On-hit energy: is the Modify Unit effect executing on the Caster? It defaults to Target, which would be the unit you're attacking.

Tiers: You can make ability charges global or for each player so the structure could share with the builder. You can also modify charges through upgrades, these have the drawback of not being resettable through data, if that matters. You would need 1 charge ID for each tier.

Requirements would actually be easier for what you describe as long as there's no way of buying additional "upgrade points":

Use requirement: And
1) CountUpgrade TierX Complete
2) Less than
i) Sum
a) CountBehavior Passive1 QueuedOrBetter
b) CountBehavior Passive2 QueuedOrBetter
c) CountBehavior Passive3 QueuedOrBetter
ii) Constant 1

Where numbers, letters and i's denote entries on the same level in tree display. Passive1/2/3 are permanent buffs, either the passives themselves or a hidden marker. TierX is an Upgrade you research at the structure to unlock the tier X.

This should grey out all 3 selection buttons once one is used, if you want them to disappear completely skip the And node and move everything under 2) to the Show field. If it doesn't work try switching i) and ii) and/or changing the Constant value.

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#7 Feb 08, 2013 at 23:04 UTC - 0 likes

http://i.imgur.com/BmQqzBx.png

This is how the Modify Unit ability looks like, but it's not working.

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#8 Feb 08, 2013 at 23:14 UTC - 0 likes

@Scythe1250: Go

Set Target: Impact Unit+ to Caster. If this is applied through the default weapon the Target scope is the unit you're attacking.

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#9 Feb 09, 2013 at 03:32 UTC - 0 likes

Okay that worked.

I am done with the abilities so far, now I just need to make the Tech Tree and do a few other things:

The builder needs the ability to repair
The builder needs a sub-menu where 1 building is aviable to be built
I need to create that building
That building has to have all kinds of upgrades
It has to be able to construct one unit which I also have to create
That unit needs to be able to gather wood (I think that minerals work for that)
The main unit also needs to be able to gather wood btw

Last edited Feb 09, 2013 by Scythe1250

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#10 Feb 09, 2013 at 13:24 UTC - 0 likes

@Scythe1250: Go

Repair: Copy from SCV, be careful with target filters+validators and tag repairable units accordingly
On the command card of the unit, add a button for a Submenu, then notice there's a drop-down list for up to 4 menus. Don't forget to add a "close submenu" button.
The rest is busywork with no concrete problems

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#11 Feb 09, 2013 at 14:22 UTC - 0 likes

Okay I could do everything on my own, I am surprised that it was quite easy. (Thanks for the help anyway)

The only thing left to do is the upgrades. Meaning the tech tree for the unit with the Tiers I mentioned before. And of course the passives.

Since I will be searching a guide for that I might also learn that on my own let's not mess with that right now. But there is one thing you can help me with: I made a shield wireframe for Nova in Photoshop (was really easy) and added it and it works fine. The thing that doesn't work fine is that Nova doesn't have the proper attach point for shields. So what I did that lead to me noticing this was: I went to her model and then Attachment: Attachment Properties+ and added an entry ID: Origin, Radius Target: 1.0; Shield Radius: 1.0 and changed the squib type to "Shield".

But that didn't lead to a shield showing on her in the game. That's not necessary IMO, since she has hardened shields animations on shield-hit but I want the error message gone that I get.

CActorAction Blah Cannot fully initialize impact monitor; could not find target attach volume on attach id (Ref_center) on target: CActorUnit(Nova) Model (Nova) m3 (Nova) Radii (Contact 0.38 Vis 0.78) FoW (0,0,0,0). The target model has TAVs on other attach points however. To address this error, either configure the attack to succesfully find the target's TAVs or do not use CActerSiteOpAttackVolume, if the attack does not need to use TAVs.

Would be nice if someone could translate that in what I can do to fix that error.

Last edited Feb 09, 2013 by Scythe1250

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#12 Feb 09, 2013 at 16:10 UTC - 0 likes

@Scythe1250: Go

Try setting Target radius to 0.

The error basically says what you see anyway: The actor framework that handles impact effects couldn't find a "target attach volume", which probably is their term for the meshes/point lists used for attacks. These are seperate structures from the attachment points you normally use afaik.

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#13 Feb 09, 2013 at 16:17 UTC - 0 likes

Okay I have another problem though. I am adding upgrades and thus requirements to my abilities, but I have trouble doing that with Adrenaline and Dissolve, the both passive abilities.

Adrenaline is the set of effects I just dropped on the weapon to test it - the 5 energy on hit and the movement speed buff behavior. I want that passive to become active once the research has finished, but I have no idea how to do that.

Dissolve is the cloak when you get hit. It's just a behavior that has a damage response which triggers an effect what is again a behavior that cloaks. So I tried to make an effect that adds this behavior (with the damage response) into an ability, but that didn't work. When I add the behavior directly to the unit then it works of course.

Further I have a sub-menu in her command card that displays the passives, I would like them to be grey until the research is finished.

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#14 Feb 09, 2013 at 16:48 UTC - 0 likes

@Scythe1250: Go

If you're using Upgrades you'll have to make a Requirement for Upgrade Completed, then a validator to check this requirement. Place the validator on the effects and the Deactivate field on passive buffs.

What do you mean the ability didn't work? Even if you cast it manually? Anyway place it on the unit and add the Requirement validator under Deactivate. Note the logic is TRUE=>ON; FALSE=>OFF.

You can add Requirements to Passive type command card buttons. Show=hide if unavailable, Use=greyed out if unavailable.

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#15 Feb 09, 2013 at 17:45 UTC - 0 likes

Okay, currently it is like this: I added a set effect to the weapon named "Nova Weapon Set" which contains the Weapon Effect (aka the normal damage effect) plus the "Modify Unit" Effect that adds energy and the "Apply Behavior" Effect that adds the stacking movement speed buff.

I have a requirement "CountUpgrade - Adrenaline - Complete" - the same requirement works for all the active abilities, so I think this is fine.

Then I made a "Player Requirement" validator that uses the above requirement as value.

I added that validator to the Modify Unit and Apply Behavior Effect.

Nevertheless she gets the energy/movement speed buff even without the research. What's wrong?

Last edited Feb 09, 2013 by Scythe1250

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#16 Feb 09, 2013 at 18:07 UTC - 0 likes

Are you using a Use or Show type Requirement? It probably only works with Use. If it still doesn't work try adjusting the player scope of the validator (probably set to Caster), though if that's the problem the effect should never occur unless your target has the upgrade.

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#17 Feb 09, 2013 at 18:13 UTC - 0 likes

I used "Use" - it works on all the active abilities and I could make it work even on Dissolve without any problem.

But whatever I use as player scope on the validator it won't work.

Edit: I have to set the Validator: Find flag to enabled - then it works.

P.S.: The passives are grey when the abilities aren't researched and race-colored (I enabled that) when they are researched - in other words: It works perfectly now.

Last edited Feb 09, 2013 by Scythe1250

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#18 Feb 09, 2013 at 22:35 UTC - 0 likes

Quote from Photoloss: Go
@Scythe1250: Go For locking out the abilities make both apply a buff to the caster (duration 30 seconds) and either make the buff deactivate the abilities or add "not having this buff" to the Requirement node for casting the ability. Either use 1 buff to lock both abilities or make 2 different ones so each ability only locks out the other one.

I need a bit help on that. Which kind does the validator need to be? Unit Compare Behavior Count?

Last edited Feb 09, 2013 by Scythe1250

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#19 Feb 09, 2013 at 22:40 UTC - 0 likes

@Scythe1250: Go

Yes. Actually, now that I think about it you could also put both abilities on a 30 second cooldown using the same "link ID" to lock both, or use a Modify Unit effect to use up the cooldown of the other ability, which should be less work.

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#20 Feb 09, 2013 at 22:52 UTC - 0 likes

I made it work with validators, when I try to cast one ability 0-30 sec after the other I get an error sound and "Error" on the left side. But this is not pretty, can you tell me how to give them a shared CD with the link ID (or the modify unit effect IDC)? Because I want it to be pretty and not "working but ugly".

Last edited Feb 09, 2013 by Scythe1250

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